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Do the mages deserve freedom?


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#276
AshenEndymion

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While your examples are amusing aTigerslunch, they forget one minor detail...

 

The biggest difference between the mass-murdering rogue and the mass-murdering mage:  Preparation.  A rogue must prepare for what they're going to do, how they're going to do it, and obtain everything they need in order to do it.  All before they can take action.  Meanwhile, a mage just needs to show up.  And they don't need to do anything prior to showing up.



#277
aTigerslunch

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No need to prepare if to poison water sources at a castle or town is necessary. Poisons are pretty easy for rogues to get a hold of or had. The party, yes that does need time, anything that requires time to think.

 

Then again, a rogue could just assassinate the town guards, then kill everyone else in quiet of the night. Yes, takes time, where as a mage could do it one shot, but a rogue can still do this, not just a mage. They are faster at it is all. Sorta.......

 

*get lantern oil, pour it around all the houses and barns around town, light it, and watch the town burn, assassinate anyone picking up water buckets.

 

Some say just a mage is a threat when I say its not just mages. They can do something faster, yes, but not the only possible threat. Most mages seem to just want to live normal lives as everyone else does technically.



#278
TK514

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No need to prepare if to poison water sources at a castle or town is necessary. Poisons are pretty easy for rogues to get a hold of or had. The party, yes that does need time, anything that requires time to think.
 
Then again, a rogue could just assassinate the town guards, then kill everyone else in quiet of the night. Yes, takes time, where as a mage could do it one shot, but a rogue can still do this, not just a mage. They are faster at it is all. Sorta.......
 
*get lantern oil, pour it around all the houses and barns around town, light it, and watch the town burn, assassinate anyone picking up water buckets.
 
Some say just a mage is a threat when I say its not just mages. They can do something faster, yes, but not the only possible threat. Most mages seem to just want to live normal lives as everyone else does technically.


Your rogue can't do it as an 8 year old. Or on accident.

#279
aTigerslunch

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An 8 year old could poison a water well..... No they couldn't blast a town in one hit, no they couldn't summon undead....none of that magic stuff.

 

An 8 year old could set a town ablaze with lantern oil.



#280
AshenEndymion

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Your rogue can't do it as an 8 year old. Or on accident.

 

A rogue could kill people on accident... I mean, Zevran killed a couple targets on accident...

 

A rogue probably couldn't commit a wholesale slaughter in a single location on accident, though...



#281
BloodKaiden

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Unless you do that systematically that aspect worked in circles rather well.


Becoming Tranquil and the entire fact that there is even such a method in a system like the Circle is one of the biggest atrocities I have ever seen. It's one of the reasons I could never be a supporter of the Circle.

#282
TEWR

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Poisoning a water supply is a stupid move militarily I think. In the short-term it'll work but poison doesn't discriminate so in the long term it probably would be a stupid thing to do. You're essentially contaminating a vital part of a fortress (if not a village if the water moves towards one) which can be... pretty bad. Especially for public relations.

 

But that's not a thing I'm completely certain on. And I'm assuming the topic is the level of danger a person can cause since this is about whether mages deserve freedom or not and the posts on this page seem to say that to me. But I've also got a headache. If so then... you don't even need poison to poison a well. Bodies work just as well. Throw a corpse or two in a well and it's gonna do itself in eventually. Bonus points if it was a diseased body.

 

I'm not saying I agree or disagree that the devastation is equal, but poison in the sense of a few bottles isn't the only thing you can use.



#283
Thermopylae

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The mages deserve to be regulated by a supervisory body where their expertise and interests are represented, as well as the interests of the local community and other stake holders of their respective societies. The groups policing the mages should be composed of specialist mages as well as Templars. 

 

Privilege comes with responsibilities. The mages are like the scientists of their society and should be involved as a part of the governing bodies, being ruled over but also assisting in the functioning and improvement of society. Of course this may involve a social revolution that requires the removal of the aristocracy and more representative forms of government. Perhaps a Commonwealth.

 

Well that was five minutes wasted. 



#284
aTigerslunch

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Yeah it isn't about capturing a fortress. That would take a rogue longer than a mage, but a rogue could still manage it. Dead body deseased and decaying in a water source would be far worse than what I was actually thinking of. :)  And an 8 year old is capable of dumping a body in a well, may take longer than an adult would though.

 

 

 

Regulating mages is fine by me, as long as families can visit, that should keep mages happy too.  :)



#285
OctagonalSquare

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I don't think mages will ever be content to live their whole lives locked up in circles, so I think that will always fail. At most, I support schooling systems where young mages can be taught to control their powers. I don't agree with how the Harrowing is conducted at all. Mages should be prepared for how to deal with a variety of demons. It shouldn't be something that's just sprung on them and we assume they're good because they dealt with one alright by chance. It proves nothing. Schooling should be supportive and actually educational. It should not be connected to the Chantry and religious dogma. At a certain point, mages should be free to leave. They should always be allowed to see their families. 

And to make sure no one causes trouble, station Templars throughout towns.


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#286
BobZilla84

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I think there is not a good solution but if I was a mage in Thedas I would want to live in Ferelden because the Circle there was a vast step up compared to some others "Cough" Kirkwall "Cough" but all in all there is no good solution.



#287
EmperorSahlertz

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Wowsers! There is a whole bunch of people here with gameplay-story segregation problems..



#288
LobselVith8

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Tevinter, Dalish, Rivain.  The three "nations" that allow their mages autonomy, and in all three the mages are in a "supervisory" role over the non-mages.  Rivian is the least extreme of the three, though, because those with magic are treated more like spiritual leaders than anything else.  And I don't think that It really matters that the Dalish have been brainwashed into thinking that it's "tradition" for the mages to rule them...

 

Brainwashed? I don't see the Dalish as being brainwashed for not vilifying magic to the point where it causes people to murder mages, i.e. how Andrastian culture has lead to mobs murdering mages over things they haven't done. Also, hahren also have an authoritative voice in the clan.

 

I appreciate the situation the mages are in.  If I were a mage, I'd probably be pissed and on-board with the whole "I deserve to be treated as any 'normal' person" shtick.  But from the random peasant's standpoint, they only have a shot of murdering the lord that mistreats them if that lord is not a mage...  Nobody here honestly thinks the city-elf is saving Shiala from a mage version of Vaughan Kendalls, do they?

 

Or the perspective could be that a mage among the city elves could have helped them stop a threat like Vaughan and his guards.


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#289
Sylanaar

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Judging by the vitriol I have just read, It would seem that based on their opinions  Master Warder Z_ TheKomandorShepard  and General TSAR are more dangerous than any mage....


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#290
EmperorSahlertz

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Judging by the vitriol I have just read, It would seem that based on their opinions  Master Warder Z_ TheKomandorShepard  and General TSAR are more dangerous than any mage....

I don't think they can set stuff on fire with their minds...



#291
Sylanaar

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I don't think they can set stuff on fire with their minds...

They probably would if they could ;)



#292
EmperorSahlertz

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They probably would if they could ;)

Then I am sure they would willingly submit to the harsh treatment they advocate.


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#293
TheKomandorShepard

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Judging by the vitriol I have just read, It would seem that based on their opinions  Master Warder Z_ TheKomandorShepard  and General TSAR are more dangerous than any mage....

Im nice and kind individual i don't know if im more dangerous than guys that can destroy entire towns in seconds. :devil:

 

 

They probably would if they could ;)

Pretty sure if i had power that no one can handle and oppose i would abuse it but then everyone would it is like god mode and starting rampage in gta and that mean total lack of negative consequences.

 

 

 

 

Then I am sure they would willingly submit to the harsh treatment they advocate.

Nah i alrady said that i wouldn't not that i I expect mages do the same as i said it isn't matter of morality it is matter of survival.



#294
EmperorSahlertz

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Nah i alrady said that i wouldn't not that i I expect mages do the same as i said it isn't matter of morality it is matter of survival.

And by virtue of your claim, you wouldn't be mad if people tried to kill you, if you were a mage, because you would be capable of comprehending why they would do it, based on your previous claims.


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#295
TheKomandorShepard

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And by virtue of your claim, you wouldn't be mad if people tried to kill you, if you were a mage, because you would be capable of comprehending why they would do it, based on your previous claims.

I didn't say i would be mad because of that there is no much emotions in that same with my solution toward mages i see mages as obstacles but same i would see peoples that try to kill me and i just remove them.



#296
EmperorSahlertz

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I didn't say i would be mad because of that there is no much emotions in that same with my solution toward mages i see mages as obstacles but same i would see peoples that try to kill me and i just remove them.

And with that, I rest my case.


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#297
Sylanaar

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I didn't say i would be mad because of that there is no much emotions in that same with my solution toward mages i see mages as obstacles but same i would see peoples that try to kill me and i just remove them.

Mages are not obstacles they are people....That includes children that are not trying to kill you


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#298
Jerome Jira

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Absolutely, but it should be worked at gradually, and not immediately done.



#299
TheKomandorShepard

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And with that, I rest my case.

Well you said that you would expect me to submit treatment that i suggests for mages if i was a mage right?

But then as i said my reason behind my solution which is my survival so what point would be killing myself if my goal is to survive? :whistle:

 

 

Mages are not obstacles they are people....That includes children that are not trying to kill you

For me mages are obstacles because of their dangerous and unstable nature but as i said other peoples can be obstacles (just to much lesser degree) for me as well but in that case it would depend on individual.Those childrens because their nature still are dangerous whether they intend me harm me or not , it is like be locked with human bomb in 1 room doesn't matter if it is children it still can explode and kill me.  



#300
Sylanaar

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Well you said that you would expect me to submit treatment that i suggests for mages if i was a mage right?

But then as i said my reason behind my solution which is my survival so what point would be killing myself if my goal is to survive? :whistle:

 

 

For me mages are obstacles because of their dangerous and unstable nature but as i said other peoples can be obstacles (just to much lesser degree) for me as well but in that case it would depend on individual.Those childrens because their nature still are dangerous whether they intend me harm me or not , it is like be locked with human bomb in 1 room doesn't matter if it is children it still can explode and kill me.  

"Fear makes men more dangerous than magic ever could" by advocating the genocide you are the cause of all the mages problems they would be too scared to learn about magic and therefor the consequence of it, It is fear and desperation that drive them to demons, if you treat others with respect and kindness they will show you it too and they wouldn't "explode"


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