100 réponses à ce sujet

[themikefest]

Oghren, Shale, Zevran, Alistair

 

Anders, Justice

 

 

Varric, Merril, Anders

[Lavaeolus]

Sebastian: I will welcome as any atheist will be welcome if i had a party... oh forgot to mention that I consider that every atheist in this century must have the Saarebas treatment in real life. So he will be welcome if we saw his mouth, chop his tongue and chain his hands. Really he was unbearable

Hold on, hold on. Do you think Sebastian is an atheist, or are him and Morrigan going to be staring at each other making mmphf noises?

[dekarserverbot]

Hold on, hold on. Do you think Sebastian is an atheist, or are him and Morrigan going to be staring at each other making mmphf noises?

No.
I think he is as jerk as any atheist in this century. He is like an overwhelmed righteous ass version of Lelianna without the brains, making him as stupid no brainer as any atheist is.

[Icy Magebane]

Realistically, I'd avoid:

- Sten - At the very top of my list, and I almost never recruit him in-game.  Not willing to trust someone who's locked up and admits to being an unstable murderer.

 

- Zevran - Again, there is just no reason to trust this guy.  I don't care how charming he seems, the Warden got lucky.  If Zevran hadn't been conflicted over the recent events of his life, he'd have finished his contract without hesitation...

 

- Morrigan - I wouldn't be comfortable traveling with her after a few missions, because it's pretty obvious that she's only in it for herself.  Once she's outlived her usefulness (after I recruit Wynne), it's time for her to go.  Basically, this one is just personal.  I don't like her attitude and wouldn't want to listen to her complaining all the time.

 

- Nathaniel Howe - I always kill him if playing as a Cousland.  There's really no solid reason for other Wardens to kill him (not that I can remember, at least), but I figured I'd put him on the list just in case.

 

- Velanna - She's basically a xenophobic killer.  Don't want her anywhere near me.

 

- Anders... - Okay, he was fine in DA:A, but in DA2, he's off the team the minute I find out that he's an abomination.  So I guess it would be more accurate to say that I'd never have allowed him to join.

 

- Merrill - Realistically, I would not take any chances with a blood mage.  I'd escort her to Kirkwall as a favor to her clan, but that would be the end of our dealings.

 

Too bad I can't metagame, because I rarely recruit Isabela now that I know how the storyline goes... but yeah, that's my list, based on first impressions.

[Lavaeolus]

No.
I think he is as jerk as any atheist in this century. He is like an overwhelmed righteous ass version of Lelianna without the brains, making him as stupid no brainer as any atheist is.

 Remind me not to give you sewing lessons. Or, for that matter, a saw.

 

- Merrill - Realistically, I would not take any chances with a blood mage.  I'd escort her to Kirkwall as a favor to her clan, but that would be the end of our dealings.

It sort of bugs me how when you take her to the Alienage she'll ask if you'll stop by to visit, and you can just outright say "no" -- and yet in she goes to your party anyway.

[Icy Magebane]

It sort of bugs me how when you take her to the Alienage she'll ask if you'll stop by to visit, and you can just outright say "no" -- and yet in she goes to your party anyway.

Yeah, it's a shame that the game wasn't more like DAO, where you could specifically tell people to stop following you around.  No idea why they did it like that... oh wait, I remember.  Some of those companions' personal quests were mandatory if you wanted to progress the main quest.  But again... the DAO way of making such quests optional was great... it didn't need to be changed IMO.

[dekarserverbot]

Remind me not to give you sewing lessons. Or, for that matter, a saw.

It sort of bugs me how when you take her to the Alienage she'll ask if you'll stop by to visit, and you can just outright say "no" -- and yet in she goes to your party anyway.

Yeah, it's a shame that the game wasn't more like DAO, where you could specifically tell people to stop following you around.  No idea why they did it like that... oh wait, I remember.  Some of those companions' personal quests were mandatory if you wanted to progress the main quest.  But again... the DAO way of making such quests optional was great... it didn't need to be changed IMO.

That's why i preffer Lloyd to Hawke, at least Lloyd can do objections and be heared (or intimidated)... but what Hawke likes, thinks or says is not important.

[sylvanaerie]

Yeah, it's a shame that the game wasn't more like DAO, where you could specifically tell people to stop following you around.  No idea why they did it like that... oh wait, I remember.  Some of those companions' personal quests were mandatory if you wanted to progress the main quest.  But again... the DAO way of making such quests optional was great... it didn't need to be changed IMO.

Some companions in DA2 were entirely optional (like Fenris, Sebastian and Isabela--their recruitment isn't required to progress the story). Even then, you can park Merrill in the Alienage and never do any of her companion stuff once you dispatch Flemeth's amulet, it's not required to finish the game.  Anders' initial recruitment also is driven by plot, so you get no choice with him, but again, can park him in his clinic and never speak to him again.  You can even drive him from the group in Act 2 entirely after doing his quest that act, though he does pop up at the end in his plot driven event.  Even both siblings can die in Act 1.

 

It is never required to take any companion once recruited except Varric at the end of Act 1.  This is plot driven.  I can't recall if any other companions are required in any of the general quests, but I believe all other companion quests are optional.  My first playthrough I didn't do Isabela, Anders, Merrill or Fenris's companion quests--never even picked up Fenris as I missed the quest to recruit him altogether.  I was playing blind, and not paying attention--and still reached the end.

 

DAO was the same.  Alistair becomes part of the camp and can only be driven out by recruiting Loghain--and he's forced onto your group when you head off to the Landsmeet, no option to choose someone else instead of him (though you can bring 2 others).  Morrigan returns even if you've driven her out earlier to offer the dark ritual.  I wanted to be able to tell Oghren to take a hike on more than one of my wardens, but he's always forced on me, if not in the initial deep roads expedition, it forces him into your group once you reach Branka.  And there is no option to say 'GTFO'.  I suppose you could if his approval drops low enough (I think I saw a Utube on it, but that still requires enough interaction to really make him hostile, not quite the same as "GTFO").

[congokong]

Realistically, I'd avoid:

- Sten - At the very top of my list, and I almost never recruit him in-game.  Not willing to trust someone who's locked up and admits to being an unstable murderer.

 

- Zevran - Again, there is just no reason to trust this guy.  I don't care how charming he seems, the Warden got lucky.  If Zevran hadn't been conflicted over the recent events of his life, he'd have finished his contract without hesitation...

 

- Velanna - She's basically a xenophobic killer.  Don't want her anywhere near me.

 

These 3 are the ones that make me want to kick the Bioware writers. I'm stunned some people say they'd recruit Sten for example without meta-gaming. Despite their claims I suspect they can't remove their familiarity with the character when making this claim. I remember on my first blind playthrough I looked to Sten far more wearily then I did on later ones because he truly was an unknown. I thought it was crazy to recruit him and left him there.

 

Bioware basically gave Sten one of the most absurd recruitment backstories; a giant locked in a cage who murdered children with his bare hands and won't even give a reason. Then they slip "recruit Sten" in the questlog. **** you Bioware. I'm the type who wants to recruit everyone, but I need the recruitment to be a sane decision. And then you have people who try justifying Sten's killing spree because he "panicked." When you panic you scream, vomit, flail... You don't strangle/beat a child to death, then rinse/repeat 7 more times.  I try to contemplate which of these 3 are the stupidest to recruit.

[sylvanaerie]

These 3 are the ones that make me want to kick the Bioware writers. I'm stunned some people say they'd recruit Sten for example without meta-gaming. Despite their claims I suspect they can't remove their familiarity with the character when making this claim. I remember on my first blind playthrough I looked to Sten far more wearily then I did on later ones because he truly was an unknown. I thought it was crazy to recruit him and left him there.

 

Bioware basically gave Sten one of the most absur recruitment backstories; a giant locked in a cage who murdered children with his bare hands and won't even give a reason. Then they slip "recruit Sten" in the questlog. **** you Bioware. I'm the type who wants to recruit everyone, but I need the recruitment to be a sane decision. And then you have people who try justifying Sten's killing spree because he "panicked." When you panic you scream, vomit, flail... You don't strangle/beat a child to death, then rinse/repeat 7 more times.  I try to contemplate which of these 3 are the stupidest to recruit.

 

It's a tossup.  While of the three I actually like one of them (Zevran), Sten and Velanna are borderline psychos (which IMO is putting it in its mildest, most flattering view).  Sten actually bothers me more than Velanna for being outwardly calm.  Frankly he's like a ticking time bomb to me, all his anger turned inward and rarely expressed till it explodes--on a helpless target, and this is reflected in his dialogues.  

 

Truly a stupid choice, Bioware.  

[Icy Magebane]

-snip-

That's not how I remember it... I thought that the "Justice" quest was mandatory?  Weren't there several "Talk to Anders" or "Talk to Merril" quests that you had to do in order to continue the main plot?  My point is that you can never stop associating with these people.  Aside from Isabela and Fenris, don't they all either show up at your house or make you visit their houses or show up in cutscenes even if you'd rather tell them you aren't interested in their friendship?  Hm...  sure seemed that way...

 

On the other hand, DAO had 1 mandatory companion: Alistair or Loghain.  Beyond that you at least had options for getting rid of or not recruiting each potential party member.  So even though you had to actually talk to Oghren to drive him off, you could still do it.  DA2 didn't give you that chance.

[sylvanaerie]

That's not how I remember it... I thought that the "Justice" quest was mandatory?  Weren't there several "Talk to Anders" or "Talk to Merril" quests that you had to do in order to continue the main plot?  My point is that you can never stop associating with these people.  Aside from Isabela and Fenris, don't they all either show up at your house or make you visit their houses or show up in cutscenes even if you'd rather tell them you aren't interested in their friendship?  Hm...  sure seemed that way...

 

On the other hand, DAO had 1 mandatory companion: Alistair or Loghain.  Beyond that you at least had options for getting rid of or not recruiting each potential party member.  So even though you had to actually talk to Oghren to drive him off, you could still do it.  DA2 didn't give you that chance.

 

Even "Justice" was not required to advance the plot--I didn't do it the first three playthroughs I had of the game, and the cutscenes you refer to were just cinematics, I don't recall Hawke saying much beyond "go on" and "What happened next".  Those weren't 'companion quests'.  Even DAO had preprogramed cinematics Alistair dialogues with you whenever you get back to camp at certain events--such as after you complete Lothering and Connor's quest in Redcliffe.  The one time I recruited Loghain I hadn't hit camp after Redcliffe (did it immediately prior) and had Loghain in my party.  Alistair's verbal cinematic started up in Loghain's spot...creeepy.

 

There were "talk to so-n-so" quests in DA2 but you weren't required to speak to them.

 

*Edit* I do recall doing Merrill's Act 3 quest on my first run now that I think about it, but I didn't do her Act 2.  I am unsure if the plot requires you do it to progress the story or not?  I recall it only because it's the only time I killed her clan, not knowing what I was doing and that was my 'keep whatever choices, even bad ones' story.

 

I only did "Justice" for the first time on Kit, my rogue and she was somewhere around playthrough 3 or 4 (I remember because there was an actual achievement for it?).

 

Most of the plot driven (required) stuff for companions seems to happen in Act 1, like sneaking into the family estate to get the deed (Sibling companion quest), Anders recruitment, Merrill's recruitment both being part of the plot as well and forced on the player, and Varric's Deep Roads expedition which ends Act 1.

[Lavaeolus]

That's not how I remember it... I thought that the "Justice" quest was mandatory?  Weren't there several "Talk to Anders" or "Talk to Merril" quests that you had to do in order to continue the main plot?  My point is that you can never stop associating with these people.  Aside from Isabela and Fenris, don't they all either show up at your house or make you visit their houses or show up in cutscenes even if you'd rather tell them you aren't interested in their friendship?  Hm...  sure seemed that way...

 

On the other hand, DAO had 1 mandatory companion: Alistair or Loghain.  Beyond that you at least had options for getting rid of or not recruiting each potential party member.  So even though you had to actually talk to Oghren to drive him off, you could still do it.  DA2 didn't give you that chance.

Technically speaking, it's possible to finish the game with only Varric and Aveline or Merrill. Granted, until the very last bit you'll be stuck with those three.

 

Fenris: Can never be met, refused when you first meet him, or if you're an ass sold to slavery.

Isabela: Can never be met, I think, and will leave you after Act 2 if you're not careful. Can be given to Arishok if kept.

Carver/Bethany: Will always leave at the end of Act 1, and can be... rather permanently removed from the plot, if Anders is not in your party at a certain time.

Sebastian: A DLC companion, so obviously optional.

Anders: You'll be stuck with him for a bit, but can be removed in Act 2.

 

Fenris, Sebastian, and Isabela will never be mentioned again, except in some bugs I think. Carver/Bethany may be brought up in banter, but will not resurface if things play out certain ways.

 

Aside from their recruitment, Anders, Merrill, and Aveline's companion quests can be ignored. Though it may seem plot-critical, you don't even have to help Aveline become guardscaptain. "Justice", where you help Anders mix up the ingredients, can be outright refused.

[congokong]

It's a tossup.  While of the three I actually like one of them (Zevran), Sten and Velanna are borderline psychos (which IMO is putting it in its mildest, most flattering view).  Sten actually bothers me more than Velanna for being outwardly calm.  Frankly he's like a ticking time bomb to me, all his anger turned inward and rarely expressed till it explodes--on a helpless target, and this is reflected in his dialogues.  

 

Truly a stupid choice, Bioware.  

I certainly liked Zevran the most. Who doesn't? He's so charming and that's why he's so dangerous. "He's so pleasant so I'll let him near me" is the sad ending to many an assassination tale I fear.

 

It's not addressed in-game really, but it's clear Sten has mental issues. I'm assuming it's not the normal reaction of qunari soldiers to go on killing sprees if their swords are lost in battle. I hope not at least... Despite all their stolid reservations, qunari are people with emotional flaws who divert from the qun intentionally or unintentionally. Sten clearly has an inward anger issue that, like you said, explodes on a target if prompted. There is no excuse for massacring a family who saved him and I like leaving him to rot in that cage. Stupid Bioware.

[sylvanaerie]

Technically speaking, it's possible to finish the game with only Varric and Aveline or Merrill. Granted, until the very last bit you'll be stuck with those three.

 

Fenris: Can never be met, refused when you first meet him, or if you're an ass sold to slavery.

Isabela: Can never be met, I think, and will leave you after Act 2 if you're not careful. Can be given to Arishok if kept.

Carver/Bethany: Will always leave at the end of Act 1, and can be... rather permanently removed from the plot, if Anders is not in your party at a certain time.

Sebastian: A DLC companion, so obviously optional.

Anders: You'll be stuck with him for a bit, but can be removed in Act 2.

 

Fenris, Sebastian, and Isabela will never be mentioned again, except in some bugs I think. Carver/Bethany may be brought up in banter, but will not resurface if things play out certain ways.

 

Aside from their recruitment, Anders, Merrill, and Aveline's companion quests can be ignored. Though it may seem plot-critical, you don't even have to help Aveline become guardscaptain. "Justice", where you help Anders mix up the ingredients, can be outright refused.

 

And of these three, with the right decision/circumstances, you can lose Merrill and Aveline I believe, depending on which side you take. Like Alistair/Loghain, Varric is the only character in DA2 who is with you at the end regardless of your choices since he is the bard telling Cassandra the tale of Hawke.  When my first character finished her game, she had only Varric, Merrill, Aveline and Sebastian with her (and a templar Carver--though he wasn't part of her group).  She ended up having Zevran and Nathaniel help her in the final fight because she had so few party members left.

[Riverdaleswhiteflash]

I certainly liked Zevran the most. Who doesn't? He's so charming and that's why he's so dangerous. "He's so pleasant so I'll let him near me" is the sad ending to many an assassination tale I fear.

 

It's not addressed in-game really, but it's clear Sten has mental issues. I'm assuming it's not the normal reaction of qunari soldiers to go on killing sprees if their swords are lost in battle. I hope not at least... Despite all their stolid reservations, qunari are people with emotional flaws who divert from the qun intentionally or unintentionally. Sten clearly has an inward anger issue that, like you said, explodes on a target if prompted. There is no excuse for massacring a family who saved him and I like leaving him to rot in that cage. Stupid Bioware.

It might be a normal reaction for someone in that position. Sten has just found out that, through no fault of his own, he will be killed on sight if he ever returns home due to a flaw in a system he believes in so utterly that he can't comprehend that it can be flawed. I agree that what he did was not precisely the best way of reacting to that, but it does seem like the sort of thing that can cause a mental breakdown. And a mental breakdown from someone with combat training, surrounded by civilians much smaller than they are? Scary. Of course, the player does not know any of this, and you can argue he should die for it even if you did. (Particularly since the situation that brought this on can only be remedied by going to Lake Calenhad, then Orzammar, then Redcliffe, and he might snap again at any point for all the player knows.)

[congokong]

It might be a normal reaction for someone in that position. Sten has just found out that, through no fault of his own, he will be killed on sight if he ever returns home due to a flaw in a system he believes in so utterly that he can't comprehend that it can be flawed. I agree that what he did was not precisely the best way of reacting to that, but it does seem like the sort of thing that can cause a mental breakdown. And a mental breakdown from someone with combat training, surrounded by civilians much smaller than they are? Scary. Of course, the player does not know any of this, and you can argue he should die for it even if you did. (Particularly since the situation that brought this on can only be remedied by going to Lake Calenhad, then Orzammar, then Redcliffe, and he might snap again at any point for all the player knows.)

Recruiting someone who has had "a mental breakdown" to the point that they strangled/beat 8 men, women, and children to death who saved their life is batshit crazy. It's not panic. It's mental illness. It's disgusting visualizing him covered in blood looming over the cold bodies of his rescuers over a lost sword regardless of the artificial value qunari put on such objects. You don't even learn this poor excuse for Sten's behavior until already stupidly recruiting him anyway.

 

Imagine the precedent this would set if such behavior from qunari was "normal." After battle it would be best to kill any wounded qunari left on the battlefield to prevent a possible killing spree if their precious sword was misplaced.

[dekarserverbot]

Recruiting someone who has had "a mental breakdown" to the point that they strangled/beat 8 men, women, and children to death who saved their life is batshit crazy. It's not panic. It's mental illness. It's disgusting visualizing him covered in blood looming over the cold bodies of his rescuers over a lost sword regardless of the artificial value qunari put on such objects. You don't even learn this poor excuse for Sten's behavior until already stupidly recruiting him anyway.

This is why you could keep a samurai near you but never an aztec. A Samurai will just suicide in that case or became ronin until he recovers his honor... Aztec warriors... just imagine what Sten did but finding also that he is eating the poor children hearts

[Icy Magebane]

Aside from their recruitment, Anders, Merrill, and Aveline's companion quests can be ignored. Though it may seem plot-critical, you don't even have to help Aveline become guardscaptain. "Justice", where you help Anders mix up the ingredients, can be outright refused.

Wait, wait... I mixed up my quests... I meant the one with Ser Alrik... the wiki says it's called "Dissent."

 

Anyway, I just wish I could have called the templars on Anders in Act 1 for roleplaying purposes.  That's the bottom line.  You didn't have to put up with companions who were incompatible with your PC's goals at all in DA:O.  The only exception being the other Grey Warden, but that's something I can excuse.  Hawke's group didn't even have a main mission... they were just random adventurers who hung out once in a while.

[Lavaeolus]

That quest is also optional. The only ones you must do are labelled "Main quests", and Dissent's a "companion quest". Of course, failing to do quests in DA2 can sometimes feel less loss of interaction/story arc with a companion and more "Hawke missed out on part of the main plot", a problem of its own.

 

I agree there should've been an option along those lines. The problem is, DA2 is a game that is probably about, if it is about any one specific thing, the mage/templar conflict. If you're fully pro-templar, it becomes crazy why you are even associating with Merrill, let alone the escaped mage activist who outright tells you he's running a "Mage Underground". Anders is probably forced in to make sure you have some mage perspective, and also because he's the only character who can be arsed to get the plot to move forwards and begin the finale in the third act. I can understand why, but it isn't the most satisfying thing.

[Riverdaleswhiteflash]

Recruiting someone who has had "a mental breakdown" to the point that they strangled/beat 8 men, women, and children to death who saved their life is batshit crazy. It's not panic. It's mental illness. It's disgusting visualizing him covered in blood looming over the cold bodies of his rescuers over a lost sword regardless of the artificial value qunari put on such objects. You don't even learn this poor excuse for Sten's behavior until already stupidly recruiting him anyway.

 

Imagine the precedent this would set if such behavior from qunari was "normal." After battle it would be best to kill any wounded qunari left on the battlefield to prevent a possible killing spree if their precious sword was misplaced.

Notwithstanding that I agree that it's a stupid risk to take, I think you're underestimating the strain Sten was under. Of course, since he's still to some degree under that strain, and he doesn't even try to help you understand the strain he's under until you've already taken the stupid risk, I can't see any reason that that excuses taking the stupid risk.

[congokong]

Yeah, I just wish Bioware made DA:O recruitments less absurd. I didn't have the same feeling about any of the DA2 companions. I'm sure some people will have reservations about almost anyone but Sten, Zevran, and Velanna were the only characters in DA or the Mass Effect series that I actually avoided recruiting on certain pc's simply because it would have been very out-of-character for them to do so. Zevran especially was a shame to avoid because he's so likable once you get to know him. The only character in the ME series for those who've played it that I'd be really uncomfortable with is Jack. The difference with characters like Sten and Zevran is you're not just pointing them at an enemy to charge; they're expected to travel with you for months, be in your presence roughly all the time, and sleep a few feet away from you with plenty of daggers, swords, bows, poisons, etc. nearby...

[ShadowLordXII]

Alistair: he's cool

 

Morrigan: unsure

 

Sten: no

 

Zevran: no

 

Oghren: sure

 

Leliana: sure

 

Wynne: sure

 

Shale: she's awesome

 

Dog: of course!

 

Loghain: no

 

Awakening

 

Nathaniel: maybe

 

Anders: yes

 

Sigrun: yes

 

Velana: no

 

Justice: yes (until i find a way to free him from that corpse)

 

Oghren: no (I'd tell him to go back to his family. Not a fan of deadbeat parents)

[Karach_Blade]

Team Yes 

Wynne

Nathaniel

Shale

Dog

Sigrun

Anders

Justice

Varric

Aveline

 

Team Maybe 

Alistair

Sten

Fenris

Anders

Leliana

Loghain

Merril

 

Team Nope

Oghren

Zevran

Morrigan

Velanna

Isabela

[King Dragonlord]

 

Team Yes 

Wynne

Nathaniel

Shale

Dog

Sigrun

Anders

Justice

Varric

Aveline

 

Team Maybe 

Alistair

Sten

Fenris

Anders

Leliana

Loghain

Merril

 

Team Nope

Oghren

Zevran

Morrigan

Velanna

Isabela

 

You raise a good point. We're all so quick to justify Lelianna but we know she lies to us. And even the story she finally tells us after admitting to lying is another lie. 

 

Aside from Alistair, Wynne, Sigrun, the only reason I can justify recruiting any of them is that the Grey Wardens just aren't picky about what your past is or how you kill Darkspawn. Frankly Loghain is one of the saner choices. You can get enough sense of him at least to feel like he's a pretty safe bet now that he's been defrocked and his only path back to honor is service to you. 

EDIT: And if we're including DA2 characters, Varric and Aveline would be the other safe bets. I could probably take a chance on Isabella too. I get the sense that, like Sigrun, her criminal tendencies will be outweighed by her use as a warrior. I don't see why Oghren is on Team Nope though. He's very manageable. Just keep him away from people you don't want to offend.