839 réponses à ce sujet

[Hanako Ikezawa]

I actually think Dragon Age 2 does a good job of this. At least, better than Origins. Bringing Bethany to the Deep Roads informed the tone of my entire playthrough. Nothing was safe, everything could go wrong. Which made it all the better when Isabela returns with the book; I actually thought she was gone (and indeed she could be depending on you). Then at the end of the game it's either support Meredith or Orsino. And sometimes you don't get a choice, like All That Remains.

 

It kept me on my toes and paying attention, more than Origins and certainly more than Mass Effect.

All That Remains is one of the times I agree with the "Hawke is stupid" people. 

 

Sure, there is a serial killer out there and our mom got his calling card and has disappeared, but let's wait several hours before we even start looking. 

[Zjarcal]

All That Remains is one of the times I agree with the "Hawke is stupid" people. 

 

Sure, there is a serial killer out there and our mom got his calling card and has disappeared, but let's wait several hours before we even start looking. 

 

But it's easier to do so at night... *bodhan logic*

 

Yeah, that bugged me as well.

[LaughingBanana]

You can also decapitate Howe in the very same game, who goes on to say his final words anyway directly after.

 

Okay? Not decapitation then. Killed.

 

It's as if you get to kill Howe in DA:O only for him to reappear in DA2 or DA:I

 

I am actually rather surprised that some people wouldn't consider that Leliana reappearing in DA2 and in here even if you decided to kill her at the Urn quest as them handwaving your decision because they couldn't be bothered to do otherwise. I mean, it's pretty blatant, heh.

[Samahl]

Okay? Not decapitation then. Killed.

 

If Leliana hasn't been decapitated, I can buy her surviving because of proximity to the urn (or anything in that temple, really).

[CronoDragoon]

I am actually rather surprised that some people wouldn't consider that Leliana reappearing in DA2 and in here even if you decided to kill her at the Urn quest as them handwaving your decision because they couldn't be bothered to do otherwise. I mean, it's pretty blatant, heh.

 

In this case bothering to do otherwise isn't really worth the resources, I'd say. Gaider's been pretty transparent that if they think they need to go a certain way with the main plotline (which in this case was tying Leliana into the formation of the Inquisition) then he's fine with overruling some player's canon. Decapitation aside though I think the official canon for the "Leliana died" people was that Andraste's ashes revived her.

 

We can see from Mass Effect what happens when you start trying to account for character deaths that a great deal of people don't even see, creating new characters to fulfill the same role.

 

 

All That Remains is one of the times I agree with the "Hawke is stupid" people. 

 

Sure, there is a serial killer out there and our mom got his calling card and has disappeared, but let's wait several hours before we even start looking. 

 

Stupid is one interpretation, but I took it that Hawke was too self-centered and absorbed in her own problems to notice.

 

Dragon Age 2 really does work the best with an anti-hero criminal greedy sarcastic Hawke. Highly recommend it.

[jtav]

Defense of Hawke here: you don't find out Leandra got lilies until after she's abducted.

[Nefla]

If Leliana hasn't been decapitated, I can buy her surviving because of proximity to the urn (or anything in that temple, really).

Wouldn't the dead servants and villagers in Redcliffe be coming back to life as you walk through the village on the way to the castle by proximity to the ashes you carry then? We should totally have taken some back to Ostagar and revived king Cailan in that case "Being near Andraste's sacred ashes brings the dead back to life" is obviously not something they intended with the original game but a cheap explanation for a retcon they made because they're attached to the character. I just wish they would plan things out and if they want to keep shoving a character in the game for cameos and such then don't let us kill them in the first game, give them plot armor from the start.

[CronoDragoon]

Wouldn't the dead servants and villagers in Redcliffe be coming back to life as you walk through the village on the way to the castle by proximity to the ashes you carry then? We should totally have taken some back to Ostagar and revived king Cailan in that case "Being near Andraste's sacred ashes brings the dead back to life" is obviously not something they intended with the original game but a cheap explanation for a retcon they made because they're attached to the character. I just wish they would plan things out and if they want to keep shoving a character in the game for cameos and such then don't let us kill them in the first game, give them plot armor from the start.

 

Not exactly. There's a period of time after you "die" but before your soul crosses permanently over the Veil that you can be revived, a la *Asunder spoilers*

Spoiler

Evangeline and Wynne

 

Those villagers would have been dead for some time.

[Nefla]

Not exactly. There's a period of time after you "die" but before your soul crosses permanently over the Veil that you can be revived, a la *Asunder spoilers*

Spoiler

Evangeline and Wynne

 

Those villagers would have been dead for some time.

What about those who kill brother Genitivi? Will he be coming back to life? We had the ashes at that point after all.

[Feybrad]

The Point of these People is, that Leliana was defeated right next to the Urn of sacred Ashes and as there are many Ways of dying without being dead after a few Seconds, everyone is assuming, that she only got mortally wounded and managed to get some of the Ashes before actually dying. It's not that hard to imagine.

[LPPrince]

People can hand wave it, they simply choose not to. The potential is there.

 

Though I can't fault them;if you make a decision regarding the fate of a character, you tend to want that decision to matter and the result of that decision to reflect in future content.

 

In this case, what appeared permanent was actually not;we'll see how that transpires later.

 

In my case not though, as Leliana will be marked as surviving DAO in my DA Keep saves.

[myahele]

Leliana surviving makes alot more sense than using a time freezing spell on grifin eggs in the latest book.

[LPPrince]

Leliana surviving makes alot more sense than using a time freezing spell on grifin eggs in the latest book.

 

Wait what

 

That happened?

[Periculo]

Hey if your into the Hero dying style endings that's fine but I am not and would like there to be one where you die for the people who want that and one where you live for the people like me who prefer there Hero lives. , You could say i'm a crappy/selfish hero , I want to live , get the girl and live to tell the tale , and retire where ever and bask in the glory , sacrificing myself isn't in the game plan.

 

The goal of war isn't to die for your country, but to make that poor bastard die for his.

[Hanako Ikezawa]

The goal of war isn't to die for your country, but to make that poor bastard die for his.

Ah, General George S. Patton. 

[King Dragonlord]

The goal of war isn't to die for your country, but to make that poor bastard die for his.

And if this were a real life war, that would mean something.

 

This is a story. This is about what works for a story.

 

I'm not even against the hero living. I've yet to play DA1 and sacrifice my Warden. Although there its about not wanting to play an Orlesian Warden in Awakening or have a continuity snarl. 

 

But again, realize that the people who want a noble death for the hero and the people who want the hero to live can't both have what they want. If the hero can live and win, then the hero dying to win doesn't have the same impact as it otherwise would. If his living has a high cost attached, that is still another matter. 

 

And thats to say nothing of dilemmas where you choose between other people to die. Patton is no stranger to that. 

[Master Warder Z_]

Ah, General George S. Patton. 

 

Overrated Tanker ._.

 

 

Gimme Model any day of the week.

[Hanako Ikezawa]

Overrated Tanker ._.

 

 

Gimme Model any day of the week.

Well, if we're going that side, then give me the master that is Erwin Rommel. 

[Steelcan]

Overrated Tanker ._.

 

 

Gimme Model any day of the week.

pfft Hitler's fireman couldn't hold a candle to Rommel or Patton

[Hanako Ikezawa]

pfft Hitler's fireman couldn't hold a candle to Rommel or Patton

Agreed. The Desert Fox's and Old Blood and Guts' ideas are the basis for modern tank tactics. 

[cjones91]

And if this were a real life war, that would mean something.

 

This is a story. This is about what works for a story.

 

I'm not even against the hero living. I've yet to play DA1 and sacrifice my Warden. Although there its about not wanting to play an Orlesian Warden in Awakening or have a continuity snarl. 

 

But again, realize that the people who want a noble death for the hero and the people who want the hero to live can't both have what they want. If the hero can live and win, then the hero dying to win doesn't have the same impact as it otherwise would. If his living has a high cost attached, that is still another matter. 

 

And thats to say nothing of dilemmas where you choose between other people to die. Patton is no stranger to that. 

Only a Sith deals in absolutes.

[Master Warder Z_]

pfft Hitler's fireman couldn't hold a candle to Rommel or Patton

 

Rommel is an overrated general with an ulcer! 

 

And his Book isn't very good at all, I read Infantry attack...Not impressed.

 

Beyond that, Model is by far the best in field General for the AXIS when it came to infantry and artillery usage.

 

Hell, if he had gotten his way, Kursk would have been a victory for the other side.

[KaiserShep]

I like how the ulcer made its way in there.

 

"You? A brilliant tactician? Don't make me laugh. I mean, for god's sake, you have an ulcer!"

[Steelcan]

Rommel is an overrated general with an ulcer! 

 

And his Book isn't very good at all, I read Infantry attack...Not impressed.

 

Beyond that, Model is by far the best in field General for the AXIS when it came to infantry and artillery usage.

 

Hell, if he had gotten his way, Kursk would have been a victory for the other side.

he also oversaw the collapse of the eastern front

[Master Warder Z_]

he also oversaw the collapse of the eastern front

 

...a fair point, but you could argue by the time he got his turn at it, it was already lost.

 

It was his brilliance at west wall that led the way to the Arden Offensive, it isn't his fault that the army couldn't follow up.