839 réponses à ce sujet

[King Dragonlord]

There's earning things and working hard even in those games. Difficulties exist to increase the challenge. I get what you mean though when it comes to some things.

 

I hate to think of what real work must be like for you.

[LPPrince]

I hate to think of what real work must be like for you.

 

"Real work" can be a physical, mental, spiritual, or even psychological challenge or effort for a person to overcome, combat against, and fight for.

 

Games that embrace that thought process will move the medium forward. I like my happy endings in games, and I'll work for them;if they make me shoot through psychological hoops and try to break my spirit, or make me have to overcome a mentally strong character to do it, I'm all for it.

[A Clever Name]

 

But it is hard work to accomplish/achieve certain things/feats in games. Its not physical(unless it requires insane button mashing), but more mental;strategizing, forethought, planning, pre-planning, reacting, etc etc

 

Depending on what it is, it is absolutely possibly that someone "worked so hard" to get something they desired in a video game.

 

Respect goes out to all the speed runners out there I'm currently thinking of. I do not envy you. That is mental.

Sort of off-topic, but I still feel super accomplished when I manage to actually complete a speed run of YGO:FM.  For those who aren't familiar with it (as it has a very small following on Twitch), it's basically a speed run based entirely on luck.  Three hours of crushing defeat, where you're just hoping for the best.  It's an amazing feeling to actually see RNG in your favor, and it's no different from the rush I get when completing a more technical run like OoT, even if my time is complete crap.

 

Of course, not everyone is going to be impressed or find enjoyment in trying to time a HESS perfectly.  It doesn't mean that anyone is wrong to find it unexciting, but it doesn't invalidate that someone else certainly will see it in a different way.  We're all allowed to have our own opinions on what's rewarding and what isn't, yes?

[LPPrince]

 

It doesn't mean that anyone is wrong to find it unexciting, but it doesn't invalidate that someone else certainly will see it in a different way.  We're all allowed to have our own opinions on what's rewarding and what isn't, yes?

 

 

Absolutely. Don't let anyone tell you otherwise.

[King Dragonlord]

"Real work" can be a physical, mental, spiritual, or even psychological challenge or effort for a person to overcome, combat against, and fight for.

 

Games that embrace that thought process will move the medium forward. I like my happy endings in games, and I'll work for them;if they make me shoot through psychological hoops and try to break my spirit, or make me have to overcome a mentally strong character to do it, I'm all for it.

 

I guess we're just working off of different definitions of real work and I have much higher standards for when words like "earned" should come into play. You haven't earned anything until you've produced something (good or service) that someone else could want. At that point what you've earned is whatever someone else is willing to give you for it. 

 

Its certainly possible to earn things in a game. Players of Foldit assist with protein folding that has lead to real medical breakthroughs. Players of EvE, by putting in time and/or trading, create virtual ships that sometimes others are willing to pay real money for in order to avoid having to put in the time themselves. Players of Second Life craft and script in game content that others can purchase with Lindens that are exchangeable with real currency.

 

Other than that sort of thing, a player has only earned what the developer feels like giving them and really the player has earned that by virtue of paying for the game.  

[garrusfan1]

Make a happy ending EXTREMLY HARD to get that is what I want. Like you have to do all the work and put in a fu** ton of effort to make it happen. But They need to at least have ALOT of option.

[DameGrace]

I'm all for "Earn Your Happy Ending", but I'd like it to be earned. You know, make some right decisions, do some optional quests, give some, take some... If the only way to "earn" your happy ending is to finish all optional quests, gather all 100+ pieces of whatever, discover all points of interest, kill all monsters, reach highest level, etc, it's not "earning" - it's grinding. And it kills the desire to replay the game. I like ME3, but even with Extended Cut I only replay some portions of the game - because the "happy ending" doesn't feel rewarding when compared to the amount of sweat, blood and tears I'm going through to get it. 

 

To sum up: different endings are good as long as they are optional and satisfying. It's nice to know that demons can win (demons need win, too!). The question is, can WE win. At least, from time to time.

[JeffZero]

With respect to a game's ending, the reality is that it's going to be very difficult to give people an ending that everyone will enjoy.  The biggest issue I have with the "work hard for it" happy ending is that a lot of the times, it simply means "play the game in its entirety" (ME2 almost fits this, if not for the fact that characters can die based on the decisions you make on the suicide mission).  That said, I think that having an ending where the suicide mission can be achieved without anyone dying isn't as interesting of an ending as it could have been.  It'd be like being able to save Ashley and Kaidan.

 

Man, the more I read of your thoughts on endings scattered across the forums, the happier I am to find someone who shares my opinions on them almost down to a tee. It's not even that you're a dev, it's that I have a hard time finding this even among the user base. That's pretty cool.

 

I totally agree. I don't know if you go this far or would care to go this far, but I actually off people at the Suicide Mission every file. Always have, always will.

 

It's true that ME3's overall bittersweet tone has largely given me what I wanted from 1 and 2. It's also true that I feel the endings went overboard with that, including Extended Cut, so that now the balance has shifted. But with ME2's conclusion, I always prefer the narrative sense of having lost, of making that mountain truly impossible to climb without a touch of genuine sacrifice, over the thrill many others experience from doing the impossible. I feel like I've done the impossible all throughout the trilogy, so when the opportunity presents itself to show off the absolute nightmare that is that climactic location, I like the vibe that even Shepard's "Best Team in the Galaxy" isn't going to escape unscathed.

 

And I love the Ashley/Kaidan throwdown for precisely the same reasons. Saren's finally coming into the spotlight. The plot is finally really taking off. And this is the power of the enemy.

[aTigerslunch]

I know, I know.... my ending will be perfect..

 

As soon as the inquisitor crawls out of the blast and collapses, I shut off the game, saying, well, that inquisitor just died...along with everyone else....

 

 

 

of course after many hours of being in the CC to create said inquisitor

[wright1978]

Really don't want 'forced self sacrifice' to be the only choice. ME3 really got my goat by trying to force everyone to commit suicide. There should be opportunity and equal closure for both live and death states of protagonist.

I have to say i prefer the 'earn your happy ending' through your choices as ME2. As long as there are a set of sophisticated choices lead to that end state that would require large amounts of skill/luck or use of a walkthrough i don't see the issue.

[TheLastSuperSaiyan87]

DA team won't make the same mistake the ME team made, I'm sure players who want a happy ending can get it and I'm sure players who want a sad ending will get that to and everything else in between. 

[schall_und_rauch]

Well, I'm sure not everyone considered having sex with Morrigan as cake, but I get what you're saying.

My cake was telling Alistair to have sex with Morrigan and watching his face. Glorious!

Oh, did I mention already that I am still pissed that they cut the scene between the two leading to it?

[schall_und_rauch]

On a related note, one of the gamescon interviews said that there will be game overs by taking the wrong choices. I am very much for that. Stupidity + heroism should get you killed, no matter what combat skill you have.

I want to take the offer of a seduction demon for eternal bliss and have all of my companions turn on me as a result, leading to more chaos, failure, doom and the bitter end of the world.

Or I sacrifice one of my companions to a vampire seduction demon for sex so that I explode in a glorious, stunning orgasm while she sucks the life force out of me. Game over!
Would Bioware allow the player something that cruel? Naww......

[aTigerslunch]

Lol, I like that schall_und_rauch

[JeffZero]

Really don't want 'forced self sacrifice' to be the only choice. ME3 really got my goat by trying to force everyone to commit suicide. There should be opportunity and equal closure for both live and death states of protagonist.

I have to say i prefer the 'earn your happy ending' through your choices as ME2. As long as there are a set of sophisticated choices lead to that end state that would require large amounts of skill/luck or use of a walkthrough i don't see the issue.

 

This is actually my only major issue with ME3's endings as of June 2012. Well, that is to say, my only major issue with the endings I like out of the mix. But yeah. I mean, it's funny. I don't like Destroy, but I feel like it should have been far, far more open and expressive about Shepard surviving, so that at least one of the damn endings gave flat-out survival a flat-out representation. As it stands, I look at the four, and I see that personal sacrifice in every single one of them, honestly. It nags me to no end even as I'm fine with mostly everything else. 

 

I don't think we need to worry very much, though, unless things have changed. We've been told -- months ago, even -- that when the story is completed the game can continue on. Now, me being who I am, I endeavor to never 100% assume anything in life, so I won't deny there's, like, a sliver of a chance the Inquisitor kicks the bucket in every single ending and you continue by playing a Morrigan who has, say, learned to shapeshift into an Inquisiclone. But I'm thinking probably not.