164 réponses à ce sujet

[Rockpopple]

Race is a social construct, but there is no denying that there are certain features common among certain groups of people. White people tend to have thinner lips and noses than black people. Monolids are typically found among Asian people. Black people tend to have kinky hair. Most people who have blue eyes are white.

The fact is, white European features are largely considered more attractive than African features. It's clear that Vivienne is meant to represent the latter, and I'd prefer she did so completely. Brown eyes are beautiful too.

 

European features are largely considered more attractive in contemporary European culture. Unfortunately aspects of that culture has been exported to the non-West, making some of those features more valuable than Asian and/or African features, even in countries where people largely sport Asian and/or African features. 

[Vumba the Wild Elf]

European features are largely considered more attractive in contemporary European culture. Unfortunately aspects of that culture has been exported to the non-West, making some of those features more valuable than Asian and/or African features, even in countries where people largely sport Asian and/or African features. 

Pretty much.

 

As Africans we are pretty much the opposite of what Europeans look like. Taking in their ideals of what is acceptable, what looks are beautiful was, and still is pretty much bound to ruin us.

[Sylvius the Mad]

Let us have mods, and then each of us can decide for ourselves hiw she should look.

[Battlebloodmage]

I find beauty to be socially construct, the standard Eurocentric looks is often being portrayed in very positive light in books, movies, and the media in general. Most of the protagonists are white brown hair in 20-30 years of age while the female LI is usually white. Most of the other races are usually being portrayed in caricature roles. Dragon Age Inquisition has done a good job of portraying more types of beauty. There are beauty in every race, and I hope to see more in the Western world. Now that Hollywood has gone global, they really need to take into account more than Middle Americans. 

[Samahl]

Let us have mods, and then each of us can decide for ourselves hiw she should look.

So that we can get white Vivienne mods? No thanks.

[Darth Death]

seems brown to me

ekk Morrigans neck looks gross

"What a long neck you have, mother," said the OGB.

"All the better to say 'nope' with," answered Morrigan. 

[Tevinter Rose]

So that we can get white Vivienne mods? No thanks.

 

I heard that modding the new engine would be really difficult, so hopefully it won't even be possible. I do not want to see Viv whitewashed. That one whitewashed photoshopped pic of hers (that I won't link to) grosses me out. 

I personally don't mind if she has light eyes because I love abnormal eye colors in general, but I totally get why its problematic. 

[Gamemako]

Race is a social construct, but there is no denying that there are certain features common among certain groups of people.

Certainly true, though it's also important to remember that classification attempts have struggled with even defining these features (even as people perceive them). Race is so fundamentally unscientific that even attempting to define the concept results in hilarious logical loops.

[Vumba the Wild Elf]

Dunno what the problem is, I've seen black people with different eye colors than brown before. (even though her eyes actually are brown evidently)

^.^......

 

Anyways, enough of that.

 

Bioware, remove that hat. it's getting on my nerves! I want to see Vivienne full on in-game just like every other companion.

[Sylvius the Mad]

I heard that modding the new engine would be really difficult, so hopefully it won't even be possible. I do not want to see Viv whitewashed. That one whitewashed photoshopped pic of hers (that I won't link to) grosses me out. 

I personally don't mind if she has light eyes because I love abnormal eye colors in general, but I totally get why its problematic. 

What does it matter how other people play?  Why do you want other people to enjoy the game less than they otherwise might?

 

I don't have any particular need to whitewash Vivienne (because the engine does appear to render her skin tone adequately), but I don't begrudge anyone who might.  And If I want to give Sera dark skin, or wings, or vampire fangs, I don't see why I should care if such a thing would offend other players (since they don't have to do it).

[Tevinter Rose]

^.^......

 

Anyways, enough of that.

 

Bioware, remove that hat. it's getting on my nerves! I want to see Vivienne full on in-game just like every other companion.

 

Lol me too, I wonder if you can even take it off.

Underneath her hat I wish she had any one of these hairstyles instead of a buzzcut:

 

Spoiler

[Samahl]

What does it matter how other people play?  Why do you want other people to enjoy the game less than they otherwise might?

 

I don't have any particular need to whitewash Vivienne (because the engine does appear to render her skin tone adequately), but I don't begrudge anyone who might.

 

I don't think you'll ever understand, tbh, since you don't seem to care about people actualizing their racism.

[Hanako Ikezawa]

Lol me too, I wonder if you can even take it off.

Underneath her hat I wish she had any one of these hairstyles instead of a buzzcut:

 

Spoiler

I believe in the E3 demo you see it equipped in the helmet slot for her, so I'm thinking you can. 

[Samahl]

Underneath her hat I wish she had any one of these hairstyles instead of a buzzcut:

 

I'm personally fine with her having a buzzcut, but I'd hate it if they didn't include kinky hair in the CC.

[Icy Magebane]

Lol me too, I wonder if you can even take it off.

Underneath her hat I wish she had any one of these hairstyles instead of a buzzcut:

 

Spoiler

*sigh* Seeing all those possibilities just makes me sad.  Why a boring buzz cut?

[Vumba the Wild Elf]

*sigh* Seeing all those possibilities just makes me sad.  Why a boring buzz cut?

No, none of those weaves or wigs. I suggest kinky hair, and I think it suits her best, and would look very good on her.

[Tevinter Rose]

What does it matter how other people play?  Why do you want other people to enjoy the game less than they otherwise might?

 

I don't have any particular need to whitewash Vivienne (because the engine does appear to render her skin tone adequately), but I don't begrudge anyone who might.  And If I want to give Sera dark skin, or wings, or vampire fangs, I don't see why I should care if such a thing would offend other players (since they don't have to do it).

 

If whitewashing Viv would make someone enjoy the game better, that is very disturbing to me for a multitude of reasons. You can disagree and that is perfectly fine. With that being said, I'm not able to actively stop them from doing it so they can do what they please but that won't stop me from not liking it. My dislike is not going to stop someone from enjoying the game since I'm not the one making it. I'm not trying to censor anything, just stating my opinion. 

[Icy Magebane]

No, none of those weaves or wigs. I suggest kinky hair, and I think it suits her best, and would look very good on her.

So now a woman can't even have her hair styled?  What exactly do you have against freedom of expression?

[Samahl]

So now a woman can't even have her hair styled?  What exactly do you have against freedom of expression?

 

It's less that they have something against freedom of expression, and more that, on a societal level, blackness (including kinky hair) is considered undesirable. It's one thing if you're telling a real life black woman that she shouldn't do as she pleases with her hair, and another if you're commenting on a fictional black character who is designed with non-black* hair.

 

* The race, not the color, if that was unclear.

[Tevinter Rose]

I'm personally fine with her having a buzzcut, but I'd hate it if they didn't include kinky hair in the CC.

 

I hope they have kinky hair too, hell i'll be happy with curly hair, just more options that aren't bone straight. I'm really hoping they have different braided hairstyles, (I want my inquisitor to rock poetic justice style braids lol), but i don't know how good it's going to look, so far even the straight hair has looked a bit janky

[Tevinter Rose]

No, none of those weaves or wigs. I suggest kinky hair, and I think it suits her best, and would look very good on her.

 

I don't think any of those are supposed to be weaves or wigs, just different options. I get what you're saying though. Some black people have straight, wavy or long hair and I don't think it's fair to automatically assume their hair is fake. Honestly, Viv could make any hairstyle look good 

[Icy Magebane]

It's less that they have something against freedom of expression, and more that, on a societal level, blackness (including kinky hair) is considered undesirable. It's one thing if you're telling a real life black woman that she shouldn't do as she pleases with her hair, and another if you're commenting on a fictional black character who is designed with non-black* hair.

 

* The race, not the color, if that was unclear.

It depends on what country you're talking about, but a large number of black women style their hair in one way or another.  I didn't see anything wrong with those hairstyles, and saying that they are wigs or weaves is simply disingenuous.  Many black women can grow longer hair... it's not automatically fake if it's longer than a couple of inches off the scalp.  In the case of Vivienne, a shaved head means no hair at all.  How is that embracing anything? (edit:  IMO that's avoiding the issue entirely.)

[Samahl]

It depends on what country you're talking about, but a large number of black women style their hair in one way or another.  I didn't see anything wrong with those hairstyles, and saying that they are wigs or weaves is simply disingenuous.  Many black women can grow longer hair... it's not automatically fake if it's longer than a couple of inches off the scalp.  In the case of Vivienne, a shaved head means no hair at all.  How is that embracing anything?

 

Again, there's nothing wrong with real life people doing what they want with their own hair. Vivienne is not real. She is a fictional character, designed by a person with biases and ingrained social attitudes. The person who drew all those alternative hairstyles for Viv included straight hair, which tends to be seen as more attractive than kinky hair because it's whiter.

 

As far as I can tell, Vumba wants Vivienne not to be designed with Eurocentric beauty standards in mind, which is why they reject the idea of her having non-kinky hair. I'm sure they wouldn't mind if Vivienne's hair was like #1, or #16, or #25.