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And its abetter deal than wandering the wilds shunned at every turn, they can either settle down or be blown aside. Nomadic cultures do not fare well when up against sedentary civilizations
Of course. Endlessly wandering is far inferior to relying on the goodwill of a monarch who will order the massacre of thousands of elves in Halamshiral for political expediency.
Why ever didn't any of us think of that?
If you were the emperor of Orlais, and you had Gaspard leading a civil war, a giant breach in the sky raining demons into your lands with new breaches opening, a mage and templar war throughout the kingdom, and a few elves setting up a homeland on the outskirts of your kingdom in a place most humans had abandoned because of all the previous troubles, where exactly would you put the highest priority?
Kicking out the elves?
You only have limited resources and personnel. Are the elves setting up a homeland really such a big threat to the security of your nation that the civil war, the mage and templar war, and raining demons simply don't compare and most of your troops go to sorting out elves?
And after the Crisis is over?
Once Orlais can go abck to warring with everyone who looks funny at them? When Ferelden can rally armies again?
Of course. Endlessly wandering is far inferior to relying on the goodwill of a monarch who will order the massacre of thousands of elves in Halamshiral for political expediency.
Why ever didn't any of us think of that?
I believe they were rebelling against the local lord and that was a revolt put down and nothing more.
It wasn't a purge out much else then their own actions, Human settlements were obliterated by Orlais during their occupation of Fereldan for less.
This is a bit of a follow on to the thread - do elves deserve a homeland? Let's assume that by whatever means, either rebellion or benevolence of human rulers, you have achieved a homeland. It is intended as a refuge for all elves. How would you organise it?
Would you allow the Dalish to run the show? Would you insist on some sort of Landsmeet type council to approve an overall leader? Would you not have an overall ruler but simply a ruling council with equal representation for the various elven factions.
Would you have freedom of worship? Bearing in mind that many city elves do worship the Maker and others have converted to the Qun, would you allow them to continue to follow their particular faith? What of those who have no religious faith and are hostile and disparaging about the Creators/Maker/Qun?
What would be your attitude towards other races? Would they be allowed to co-exist in the elven state provided they did not cause trouble? Would they be allowed a say in running affairs? Or would all non elves be excluded totally and evicted if living on the land now considered elven?
Would you be isolationist and attempt to be largely self sufficient or would you actively engage in trade with other nations? Would you send ambassadors to make your case with other rulers and would you allow the same? Would you have an army patrolling borders and keeping out intruders and non elves.
Everyone may have their own particular view about the truth of what happened in the past and this may inform your ideas about the best way to run your homeland but for the most part I want to concentrate on the future and how you would use your homeland?
Where do we stand on the elves being immortal if not around other races? Because if so, yes I'd go full isolationist. If I'm to assume the immortality was a myth or magic, then I'd try to cultivate an alliance with some other power. Dwarves being the most likely. A culture with no access to magic meets a culture with a natural predilection for it? The thwo finest smithing traditions in thedas with vast ancient empires worth of loot to reaquire? Hell yes.
Where do we stand on the elves being immortal if not around other races? Because if so, yes I'd go full isolationist. If I'm to assume the immortality was a myth or magic, then I'd try to cultivate an alliance with some other power. Dwarves being the most likely. A culture with no access to magic meets a culture with a natural predilection for it? The thwo finest smithing traditions in thedas with vast ancient empires worth of loot to reaquire? Hell yes.
the dwarves are too reliant on human support, the elves can't grow food, make goods, etc.. on a large enough scale to but into that trade
Where do we stand on the elves being immortal if not around other races? Because if so, yes I'd go full isolationist.
We don't know. Gaider and Kirby even gave conflicting information about whether the Dalish live longer the more generations they live away from humans, so it's impossible to say with any degree of certainty.
If I'm to assume the immortality was a myth or magic, then I'd try to cultivate an alliance with some other power. Dwarves being the most likely. A culture with no access to magic meets a culture with a natural predilection for it? The thwo finest smithing traditions in thedas with vast ancient empires worth of loot to reaquire? Hell yes.
If you're contemplating an alliance with a neighboring nation (and assuming you're talking about the Dales), the closest two would be Orzammar and Ferelden, and the latter has also dealt with an Orlesian occupation. The entrance to Orzammar is accessible from the Dales, and if you're contemplating an alliance because the Dalish have magic, Duncan notes the useful of mages against large groups of darkspawn.
However, Gervaise has left it up to us to contemplate how we would manage an elven homeland, so it's all in your hands how you envision an elven homeland working, or where you think it could be located.
And after the Crisis is over?
Once Orlais can go abck to warring with everyone who looks funny at them? When Ferelden can rally armies again?
After it's over, that depends on how much strength you have left, and how much the elves built up. If they are strong enough, and you are weak enough, you may not have a choice but to let them have it.
After it's over, that depends on how much strength you have left, and how much the elves built up. If they are strong enough, and you are weak enough, you may not have a choice but to let them have it.
That's not going to happen, like i said according to in game comments and dev comments, the elves are more or less outnumbered by humanity to a degree near a several hundred to one. Or was that dwarves? Or were they both about the same? I forget, anyway its something akin to that.
Humans are much more populas in Thedas then elves.
Eventually the region would stabilize and get it's act together, the elves could have a century and they still wouldn't be able to match human numbers.
Any military seizure, even if its success initially wouldn't last in the long term. The elves are just too far into the grave to compete with their cousins now.
Wonder how long this thread will last...
I believe they were rebelling against the local lord and that was a revolt put down and nothing more.
It wasn't a purge out much else then their own actions, Human settlements were obliterated by Orlais during their occupation of Fereldan for less.
Ah, so the same monarch would do the same to humans rebelling against their lords in Orlais and not a country they are occupying? My, I'm sure the peasantry and the people of Ferelden and Orlais both had no problems with Orlais on every level because humans have it so similar to elves.
I mean, we all know Chevalier's are practically lining up to butcher humans in initiatory rites.
That's not going to happen, like i said according to in game comments and dev comments, the elves are more or less outnumbered by humanity to a degree near a several hundred to one. Or was that dwarves? Or were they both about the same? I forget, anyway its something akin to that.
Humans are much more populas in Thedas then elves.
Eventually the region would stabilize and get it's act together, the elves could have a century and they still wouldn't be able to match human numbers.
Any military seizure, even if its success initially wouldn't last in the long term. The elves are just too far into the grave to compete with their cousins now.
And we all know that humans are the most united race and all believe the same, and are willing to congregate in a single area on rumors of elves seeking a homeland.
Of course.
Ah, so the same monarch would do the same to humans rebelling against their lords in Orlais and not a country they are occupying? My, I'm sure the peasantry and the people of Ferelden and Orlais both had no problems with Orlais on every level because humans have it so similar to elves.
I mean, we all know Chevalier's are practically lining up to butcher humans in initiatory rites.
Do you even acknowledge the ludicrous nature of that?
Lothering was put to torch during the rebellion because a handful of rebel soldiers fled there after the rebel queen was killed, an entire settlement, burnt to the ground.
Because a few soldiers took refugee there, During the later part of the rebellion, rebels and criminals were strung up from posts along the roadway for MILES, So, i'd point out the message here is clear.
Orlais doesn't show quarter period, to its enemies.
It doesn't matter their race.
It kills them.
And we all know that humans are the most united race and all believe the same, and are willing to congregate in a single area on rumors of elves seeking a homeland.
Of course.
Because the Monarchy or new Dynasty taking power will completely forget that during their little issue a while back, the elves showed up and stole territory, if it s valuable territory? all the more so, but even if it's worthless or blighted i could still see them raising a fuss about it on principle.
It shows lack of unity and strength its an invitation for rebellion, and beyond that?
Humans tend to unite pretty well behind exalted marches, take that as you will.
Do you even acknowledge the ludicrous nature of that?
Lothering was put to torch during the rebellion because a handful of rebel soldiers fled there after the rebel queen was killed, an entire settlement, burnt to the ground.
Because a few soldiers took refugee there, During the later part of the rebellion, rebels and criminals were strung up from posts along the roadway for MILES, So, i'd point out the message here is clear.
Orlais doesn't show quarter period, to its enemies.
It doesn't matter their race.
It kills them.
I'm sure Gaspard and Celene most certainly approve of your statments and agree with it in regards to their approach to each other.
Because the Monarchy or new Dynasty taking power will completely forget that during their little issue a while back, the elves showed up and stole territory, if it s valuable territory? all the more so, but even if it's worthless or blighted i could still see them raising a fuss about it on principle.
It shows lack of unity and strength its an invitation for rebellion, and beyond that?
Humans tend to unite pretty well behind exalted marches, take that as you will.
Of course. Religious genocides are always good things to get behind, especially for a religion that's very much in control of its armed forces and its mages.
I'm sure Gaspard and Celene most certainly approve of your statments and agree with it in regards to their approach to each other.
May Gaspard's reign be strong and long.
Of course. Religious genocides are always good things to get behind, especially for a religion that's very much in control of its armed forces and its mages.
It's armed forces are a paltry nothing compared to what it has gathered in the past.
The Templar Order at it's height likely had a bit over ten thousand members, you think that is larger then the armies of Orlais, Nevarra, Rivain and the Free Marches?
Beyond that, your entire notion seems to be based on a temporary distraction somehow upsetting nature it self, the Elves are a minority, they cannot lose what Humans can lose and still be viable as a combat force.
Hence why i view military seizure as unadvised as the tranquil would put it.
May Gaspard's reign be strong and long.
I'm sure his code as a chevalier has no problem ending chevalier initiation rites in alienages, and he represents a more equal playing field for his subjects, no matter the race.
My, whatever would we do without such a man?
It's armed forces are a paltry nothing compared to what it has gathered in the past.
The Templar Order at it's height likely had a bit over ten thousand members, you think that is larger then the armies of Orlais, Nevarra, Rivain and the Free Marches?
Beyond that, your entire notion seems to be based on a temporary distraction somehow upsetting nature it self, the Elves are a minority, they cannot lose what Humans can lose and still be viable as a combat force.
Hence why i view military seizure as unadvised as the tranquil would put it.
Ah, I see. So the templars breaking away from the chantry, splintering into warring factions full of infighting with mages while also losing their minds thanks to red lyrium was simply a figment of my imagination.
I'm sure the Chantry is impressed.
Ah, I see. So the templars breaking away from the chantry, splintering into warring factions full of infighting with mages while also losing their minds thanks to red lyrium was simply a figment of my imagination.
I'm sure the Chantry is impressed.
That has nothing to do with the meat of my point at all, and splintering into warring factions?
As far as we can tell? there are three, Red, Normal and Lambert.
We haven't seen Lambert and Normal Templars fighting in any of the trailers or game demos yet, so i wouldn't declare them warring as the devs haven't said anything to that effect, beyond have either of those templar groups combated red templars?
May Gaspard's reign be strong and long.
That sounds naughty 
That has nothing to do with the meat of my point at all, and splintering into warring factions?
As far as we can tell? there are three, Red, Normal and Lambert.
We haven't seen Lambert and Normal Templars fighting in any of the trailers or game demos yet, so i wouldn't declare them warring as the devs haven't said anything to that effect, beyond have either of those templar groups combated red templars?
So two groups opposed in ideology and loyalty aren't two factions split among templars with the red and the normals and suffering infighting as a result.
Gotcha.
Guest_Faerunner_*
And its abetter deal than wandering the wilds shunned at every turn, they can either settle down or be blown aside. Nomadic cultures do not fare well when up against sedentary civilizations
Which is where the advantage of a nomadic culture comes in. If the local sedentary people get huffy, the nomads can up and leave. They don't have to just sit there and take it. The nomadic elves in this particular universe have the advantage of plenty of forests and wildlands to retreat into where humans can't follow them. Whereas accepting the sedentary dictatorship of a local sedentary government would put them at greater risk since the monarchy can at any time decide to start mistreating or massacring them, and they couldn't leave as quickly or easily since they had prepared for or gotten used to settling down, and so can't just up and leave before humans get within firing distance.
Which is where the advantage of a nomadic culture comes in. If the local sedentary people get huffy, the nomads can up and leave. They don't have to just sit there and take it. The nomadic elves in this particular universe have the advantage of plenty of forests and wildlands to retreat into where humans can't follow them.
Of course. Endlessly wandering is far inferior to relying on the goodwill of a monarch who will order the massacre of thousands of elves in Halamshiral for political expediency.
Why ever didn't any of us think of that?
Be loyal citizens instead of murderous rebels and rioters, and the chances of the local monarch being forced to treat you like a rebellion and put your enclave to the torch drop considerably.
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