518 réponses à ce sujet

[Master Warder Z_]

I don't know but huge numbers of darkspawn from nowhere may be rather good reason to start suspect that it may be blight

 

The darkspawn raid the surface occasionally, even when it isn't a blight.

 

Not in those numbers usually, but it happens.

[Lulupab]

I didn't say mages, I said magic. Magic is part of Thedas and it cannot be changed, deal with it. There will ALWAYS be fade tears in battlefields, templars caused many themselves. When you annul a circle the fade is torn and pretty much that building is cursed.

Whatever Loghain plans were, he caused more damage than mages and darkspawn and all disasters that happened in Ferelden combined. He tricked Uldred (had major part in circle disaster), don't forget that. He also sent Jowan ( had part in redcliff disaster) and refused help from Orlais. (made the death of many possible and delayed the blight).

The Templars have failed, they are no longer authorized and are no different than the next door bandit. No rule, no law. Just rogue drug addicts on the loose. We need a better plan to control magic because its not safe and we cannot get rid of it, not without severe consequences anyway.

[TheKomandorShepard]

The darkspawn raid the surface occasionally, even when it isn't a blight.

 

Not in those numbers usually, but it happens.

I know but rather not in big numbers when you deal with such amount of darkspawn it is sane scenario to at least assume that may be a blight.

But i don't blame loghain for his paranoia at the beginning it wouldn't be first time when orlais take over country after blight.

[Milan92]

 

• Loghain: Here, some smoked boar saved from supper. Huh, it'll do you good.
• Dog: (Excited huffing)
• Loghain: I had a mabari once. Adalla--that was her name. We found her in the wood shed one night. She was still a pup then.
• Loghain: We never figured out where she came from. My mother called her a gift from the Maker. And she was... she really was.
• Loghain: She was beautiful; she had a lovely chestnut brown coat, and the most intelligent, understanding eyes. You would have liked her.
• Dog: (He wags his tail.)
• Loghain: We grew up together. She never left my side, not once. Ten years we had her, before she was taken away...
• Dog: (He cocks his head and looks curiously at Loghain.)
• Loghain: Another time perhaps. Finish
• your snack.
• Dog: (Dog sniffs the air curiously.)
• Loghain: Oh, don't give me that face. I'm betting you want the cheese in my pocket.
• Dog: (He sits and waits patiently.)
• Loghain: Very well, here you go. Don't eat it all at once. Or... do, whichever you prefer.
• Loghain: I used to keep cheese in my pocket for Adalla too. I think the rinds were her favorite part.
• Loghain: I mentioned she was taken from us, did I not? This was when Orlais still ruled, and it was an Orlesian lordling who took her.
• Loghain: He wanted to mix the blood of our noble mabari with their frail, wasp-wasted game hounds, which were bred for looks, not intelligence.
• Loghain: I tried to keep her, but there was little I could do to stop the Orlesian... I wasn't even a man then.
• Loghain: You can imagine what it was like for her, being torn away from the boy--the family she was bonded to.
• Dog: (Long, low whine)
• Loghain: It was six months before we saw her again. The Orlesian returned her--and when I say "returned," I mean "pushed her out of his wagon."
• Loghain: She was skin and bone, and still carried the scars from where their pronged collars bit into her neck. She never quite recovered.
• Loghain: She passed away after a week. It was as though she held on long enough to come home to us. I held her head in my lap, and I believe she died happy.
• Dog: (Sad whine)

 

http://dragonage.wik...ac_Tir/Dialogue

 

That conversation is pretty telling.

 

 

That was so sad.

[Lulupab]

With full legions of Chevaliers along with wardens from Orlais, the battle of Ostagar could have been won easily. But no, fear and paranoia at it again.

[The Hierophant]

Mages are required to follow some rules but they don't have a duty to protect the circle of magi from anything. Its the Templar's job. Now if the Templars are the danger itself which the games shows they really can be, then as I said autonomy is justified because this simply proves Templars are not as efficient as they claim and can be. Also Uldred didn't train blood mages in secret, there was no sane mage under his command, all were abomination and he himself became one by "accidentally" summoning a pride demon. But this is not even important. The fact remains that if Templars cannot stop corruption among their own ranks they need to be removed from command or undergo changes. Mages are just in circles without their own will so they are not required to ensure the safety of circles.

(Here comes the opinion you wanted pointed out) You think just because there are blood mages among circle of magi this absolves the Templars from the corruption and following orders without question. While the cold and harsh truth is, there is nothing worse when a force that is supposed to fight corruption becomes one itself. It also applies in our world and for this very reason Police and all security forces are punished much harsher if they commit a crime by abusing their power.

Even the leader of all blood mages, Orsino was willing to resolve things without conflict but nope, Meredith wanted her annulment and there was no single Templar even questioning this act. She shouts "kill" they don't ask "why?" They ask "who?". Actually I'm just saying this, they don't even say this, they nod and kill.

Again you're shifting the argument to one about corruption while my initial response to your post about no templar opposing Meredith is still the same.

My point isn't about Templars, Mages and corruption. I only took note of your generalizations of all Templar and care little about the existence of corruption in any given organization, because if it's run by fallible beings (DA's mortals) there'll eventually be corruption.

Again. Corruption is not what i take issue with. Only that your claim about there being no Templars to oppose or disagree with Meredith.

Call it pedantic or whatever but i still got my eyes on THE PRIZE.

[Steelcan]

I didn't say mages, I said magic. Magic is part of Thedas and it cannot be changed, deal with it. There will ALWAYS be fade tears in battlefields, templars caused many themselves. When you annul a circle the fade is torn and pretty much that building is cursed.

Whatever Loghain plans were, he caused more damage than mages and darkspawn and all disasters that happened in Ferelden combined. He tricked Uldred (had major part in circle disaster), don't forget that. He also sent Jowan ( had part in redcliff disaster) and refused help from Orlais. (made the death of many possible and delayed the blight).

The Templars have failed, they are no longer authorized and are no different than the next door bandit. No rule, no law. Just rogue drug addicts on the loose. We need a better plan to control magic because its not safe and we cannot get rid of it, not without severe consequences anyway.

Hmm and yet the Circle at Ferelden gets new mages afterwards...

 

No he didn't, the damage is from darkspawn, you can say he didn't do enough to counter it, but he didn't burn villages, he did not trick Uldred, Uldred made the deal then went loony on his own.  Jowan was a means to an end, and if Connor hadn't made a deal with a demon he would have succeeded, removing Eamon as a threa.

 

And I say the Divine overstepped her boundaries, the templars are carrying out their sacred duty even though the leadership is foolish

[Master Warder Z_]

With full legions of Chevaliers along with wardens from Orlais, the battle of Ostagar could have been won easily. But no, fear and paranoia at it again.

 

Legions which didn't arrive until the battle was already over but, lets leave out that bit.

 

 

That was so sad.

 

It's easy to view characters, people really. that never express remorse or guilt at their actions as inhuman.

 

What people tend to forget is that, people have lives and feelings, Loghain was around for a long time before the Warden ever met him.

 

And he saw the brutality of the occupation, that the PC never did, War changes people i suppose, Even those who knew Rendon Howe before white river, claimed the man they knew to have died on that battlefield.

[Lulupab]

Hmm and yet the Circle at Ferelden gets new mages afterwards...
 
No he didn't, the damage is from darkspawn, you can say he didn't do enough to counter it, but he didn't burn villages, he did not trick Uldred, Uldred made the deal then went loony on his own.  Jowan was a means to an end, and if Connor hadn't made a deal with a demon he would have succeeded, removing Eamon as a threa.
 
And I say the Divine overstepped her boundaries, the templars are carrying out their sacred duty even though the leadership is foolish

they couldn't question the leadership? Of course they couldn't. The best templar is a zealot Templar.

Again you're shifting the argument to one about corruption while my initial response to your post about no templar opposing Meredith is still the same.

My point isn't about Templars, Mages and corruption. I only took note of your generalizations of all Templar and care little about the existence of corruption in any given organization, because if it's run by fallible beings (DA's mortals) there'll eventually be corruption.

Again. Corruption is not what i take issue with. Only that your claim about there being no Templars to oppose or disagree with Meredith.

Call it pedantic or whatever but i still got my eyes on THE PRIZE.

Its pedantic. Also refer to my comment above in this post. The majority of Templars, following without questioning leadership, march to become a rogue and hated faction as if every single zealot person in Thedas has become a Templar.

[Milan92]

 

It's easy to view characters, people really. that never express remorse or guilt at their actions as inhuman.

 

What people tend to forget is that, people have lives and feelings, Loghain was around for a long time before the Warden ever met him.

 

And he saw the brutality of the occupation, that the PC never did, War changes people i suppose, Even those who knew Rendon Howe before white river, claimed the man they knew to have died on that battlefield.

 

This is why in my opinion everyone should atleast try one playthrough with Loghain alive.

 

Just for his dialogue.

[Master Warder Z_]

And I say the Divine overstepped her boundaries, the templars are carrying out their sacred duty even though the leadership is foolish

 

Lambert i admit, may have been overzealous, but he was as patient with those ingrates as he could possibly be.

 

He offered them every chance in the world to go home and for there not to be a fight, But honestly what are you supposed to do when they are interfering with your duties, refusing your commands and basically demanding a battle?

 

I view his actions as quite understandable, for a man who was basically forced into a horrible position by a moronic elf with a chip on her shoulder and her brain rotted by the taint.

[Steelcan]

Lambert i admit, may have been overzealous, but he was as patient with those ingrates as he could possibly be.

 

He offered them every chance in the world to go home and for there not to be a fight, But honestly what are you supposed to do when they are interfering with your duties, refusing your commands and basically demanding a battle?

 

I view his actions as quite understandable, for a man who was basically forced into a horrible position by a moronic elf with a chip on her shoulder and her brain rotted by the taint.

bloody Mary Sues

[TheKomandorShepard]

they couldn't question the leadership? Of course they couldn't. The best templar is a zealot Templar.

Best templar is templar who follow the rule better safe then sorry without remorse otherwise we have Thrask.

[Master Warder Z_]

bloody Mary Sues

 

Hopefully little miss sue will be missing her head by the end of DAI.

[Lulupab]

Legions which didn't arrive until the battle was already over but, lets leave out that bit.
 
 

 
It's easy to view characters, people really. that never express remorse or guilt at their actions as inhuman.
 
What people tend to forget is that, people have lives and feelings, Loghain was around for a long time before the Warden ever met him.
 
And he saw the brutality of the occupation, that the PC never did, War changes people i suppose, Even those who knew Rendon Howe before white river, claimed the man they knew to have died on that battlefield.

Loghain was not blameless in delay of Chevaliers.

Anyway when I tell people the same thing about Anders (In this case oppression changes people) I receive condemnation from some members. He fully familiarized me with how being born a mage in Thedas can be worse than death and its completely justified to beg to become a grey warden and endure all those hardships because it would still be better than the circle. He was tormented all his life by the Chantry and Templars and all that hate will eventually explode in your face, quite literally in Anders' case.

[Master Warder Z_]

Loghain was not blameless in delay of Chevaliers.

 

They literally didn't arrive until days after the battle was over.

[Steelcan]

Loghain was not blameless in delay of Chevaliers.

Anyway when I tell people the same thing about Anders (In this case oppression changes people) I receive condemnation from some members. He fully familiarized me with how being born a mage in Thedas can be worse than death and its completely justified to beg to become a grey warden and endure all those hardships because it would still be better than the circle. He was tormented all his life by the Chantry and Templars and all that hate will eventually explode in your face, quite literally in Anders' case.

nah, Anders is a pretty cool dude, dunno about that abomination Justice though

[Lulupab]

Lambert i admit, may have been overzealous, but he was as patient with those ingrates as he could possibly be.
 
He offered them every chance in the world to go home and for there not to be a fight, But honestly what are you supposed to do when they are interfering with your duties, refusing your commands and basically demanding a battle?
 
I view his actions as quite understandable, for a man who was basically forced into a horrible position by a moronic elf with a chip on her shoulder and her brain rotted by the taint.

The Templars have done enough to justify the fact that Mages are better off with autonomy. Mind you Fiona wanted autonomy, not complete freedom.

[Lulupab]

nah, Anders is a pretty cool dude, dunno about that abomination Justice though

He gave up being cool when the chantry went to the limits of sending spies to grey warden ranks. They simply wouldn't leave him alone. You honestly can't expect all that to go unanswered.

[Steelcan]

The Templars have done enough to justify the fact that Mages are better off with autonomy. Mind you Fiona wanted autonomy, not complete freedom.

no they aren't, if you want to see what free mages do look at Uldred, Tevinter, Grace, etc...

[Steelcan]

He gave up being cool when the chantry went to the limits of sending spies to grey warden ranks. They simply wouldn't leave him alone. You honestly can't expect all that to go unanswered.

 

That comic is non-canon

[Master Warder Z_]

That comic is non-canon

 

FINALLY!

[Lulupab]

That comic is non-canon

Really? At least Anders' short story is canon. At least there have been no indication its not and the fact that its written by Jennifer Hapler (Anders' writer) solidifies it as canon and in it Rolan is a spy. Its canon unless stated otherwise.

The important thing here is Rolan and his "friends" ruined everything for Anders even after he merged with Justice. Anders is not a simple abomination, he can think, he can feel and most importantly he is not driven by malice to kill everyone on sight. In the same time he does have the powers of an abomination and I personally think spirit abominations are even stronger because there is synergy between the spirit and the host in opposed to forced possession in demonic abominations. Anyway he is like the perfect weapon against the darkspawn. Grey warden leaders would make use of him, they have used far worse.

[cjones91]

no they aren't, if you want to see what free mages do look at Uldred, Tevinter, Grace, etc...

Rivain says hello and so do the mages in the Grey Wardens.

[TheKomandorShepard]

Rivain says hello and so do the mages in the Grey Wardens.

You mean abominations and peoples like avernus?