518 réponses à ce sujet

[thetinyevil]

That comic is non-canon

It is only non-canon because it doesn't fit what you want. 

[Steelcan]

Rivain says hello and so do the mages in the Grey Wardens.

Grey Warden mages, like Avernus?  Stand up guy he is

[Lulupab]

You mean abominations and peoples like avernus?

Grey Warden's whole foundation rests on Tevinter's blood magic and knowledge of blood in general. Its ALWAYS justified to use lesser evils to beat greater evils.

[Steelcan]

Really? At least Anders' short story is canon. At least there have been no indication its not and the fact that its written by Jennifer Hapler (Anders' writer) solidifies it as canon and in it Rolan is a spy. Its canon unless stated otherwise.

The important thing here is Rolan and his "friends" ruined everything for Anders even after he merged with Justice. Anders is not a simple abomination, he can think, he can feel and most importantly he is not driven by malice to kill everyone on sight. In the same time he does have the powers of an abomination and I personally think spirit abominations are even stronger because there is synergy between the spirit and the host in opposed to forced possession in demonic abominations. Anyway he is like the perfect weapon against the darkspawn. Grey warden leaders would make use of him, they have used far worse.

He is still an abomination, and once he left the wardens he should have been purged like any other

[Steelcan]

Grey Warden's whole foundation rests on Tevinter's blood magic and knowledge of blood in general. Its ALWAYS justified to use lesser evils to beat greater evils.

 

"The ends does not justify the means."

 

make up your mind

[TheKomandorShepard]

Grey Warden's whole foundation rests on Tevinter's blood magic and knowledge of blood in general. Its ALWAYS justified to use lesser evils to beat greater evils.

wow so now end justifies the means i see we are using that philosophy when convenient

[Steelcan]

It is only non-canon because it doesn't fit what you want. 

its non-canon because it cannot work in every world state, at least if we are thinking of the same comic

[Lulupab]

He is still an abomination, and once he left the wardens he should have been purged like any other

Rolan forced him to leave because his puppets were grey wardens and Anders had to kill hem. And the Grey Wardens have every right to keep him and use him if the wanted to. It devours Chantry authority and Templar duty because they have no say in who the grey wardens can use in their battle against darkspwan. The fact that they kidnapped him from grey warden camp speaks volumes. Why not talk it over with the leading grey warden commander? Because they knew he would use Anders, any real grey warden would have. I mean he obliterated people whop train for years to counter his kind with a single spells, killing darkspawn should be a breeze for him.

[Lulupab]

"The ends does not justify the means."

 

make up your mind

 

It doesn't apply when there is no other end. Only Grey Wardens can kill archdemons and they exist because blood magic made it possible. There is no other way.

[Steelcan]

It doesn't apply when there is no other end. Only Grey Wardens can kill archdemons and they exist because blood magic made it possible. There is no other way.

So now we are adding conditions?

 

How about this "its ok to kill blood mages outside of the Grey Wardens because they are wont to go on killing rampages"

[Master Warder Z_]

It doesn't apply when there is no other end. Only Grey Wardens can kill archdemons and they exist because blood magic made it possible. There is no other way.

 

They exist because blood magic was convenient in usage with the joining when they first learned of the art, the dude they learned it from just straight up drank blood to increase his power, akin more to a reaver then a blood mage.

 

._. I am still convinced you could just use a mortar in place of a blood mage for the joining.

[Lulupab]

So now we are adding conditions?

 

How about this "its ok to kill blood mages outside of the Grey Wardens because they are wont to go on killing rampages"

 

When do we say "The ends does not justify the means"? usually when there is a better a way to do whatever it was we are doing. Not using blood magic means the end of the world as the archdemons will be reborn over and over and over. Its not a condition, its a necessity. The circle system is a not a necessity, its an idea that has failed. So when I tell you the ends does not justify the means I actually mean there is a better way to reach the end. Believe me if there was no other way I wouldn't but there is and you know it.

[Lulupab]

._. I am still convinced you could just use a mortar in place of a blood mage for the joining.

Where was this mortar when the blight ravaged the land for 250 years.

[Master Warder Z_]

Where was this mortar when the blight ravaged the land for 250 years.

 

How would i know?

 

But it isn't like a bowl and masher are high tech, it isn't like a combustion engine.

[Steelcan]

When do we say "The ends does not justify the means"? usually when there is a better a way to do whatever it was we are doing. Not using blood magic means the end of the world as the archdemons will be reborn over and over and over. Its not a condition, its a necessity. The circle system is a not a necessity, its an idea that has failed. So when I tell you the ends does not justify the means I actually mean there is a better way to reach the end. Believe me if there was no other way I wouldn't but there is and you know it.

it hasn't failed, its merely being tested, and once the mages are hounded and harried to the ends of the Earth they will go back to Circles

[TheKomandorShepard]

When do we say "The ends does not justify the means"? usually when there is a better a way to do whatever it was we are doing. Not using blood magic means the end of the world as the archdemons will be reborn over and over and over. Its not a condition, its a necessity. The circle system is a not a necessity, its an idea that has failed. So when I tell you the ends does not justify the means I actually mean there is a better way to reach the end. Believe me if there was no other way I wouldn't but there is and you know it.

Well there is we can kill mages and had no more magical disasters seems like best solution and well they created blight and many other disasters.Sound fine for me

[Steelcan]

No. If it was something you believed like, All mages are evil. You would be running around flailing your arms all over the places like a hyperactive sugar high five year old screaming "IT'S CANON!!!"

you clearly are not worth discussing this with

[thetinyevil]

you clearly are not worth discussing this with

Don't like the truth.

[Master Warder Z_]

Well there is we can kill mages and had no more magical disasters seems like best solution and well they created blight and many other disasters.Sound fine for me

 

But then they just pop back up again, like weeds.

 

Believe me TKS i would love a magic free world, but there are reasons to keep them around, apart from using them as fodder against Qunari.

 

Namely, it isn't genetic, magic appearing within a person is in it self a magical event, its part of the world.

 

It's easier to just accept that logic and lock them away and only pull them out when needed, like war beasts.

[Lulupab]

it hasn't failed, its merely being tested, and once the mages are hounded and harried to the ends of the Earth they will go back to Circles

Interesting. Explain this "hounded" and "harried" in this sentence: All mages from all fifteen circles except the dasirimund circle successfully break free and rallied at andorhal's reach. Where were your precious Templars?

 

 

Well there is we can kill mages and had no more magical disasters seems like best solution and well they created blight and many other disasters.Sound fine for me

 

During the 1st and 2nd blight mages turned the tide. Do you even read WOT? without them the world would have fallen to the darkspawn. They also turned the tide when fighting the Qunari.

 

1. World destroyed by Darkspawn

2. The Qun ruling whole Thedas

 

Take your pick because without mages that would have happened. It can still happen.

[Master Warder Z_]

2. The Qun ruling whole Thedas

 

I'm pretty sure Mages had their part to play with the withdrawl of the Qunari from Thedas, but i'd also point out that a war that went on for two ages, for two centuries, and called for three exalted marches, had plenty of people within it beyond mages.

 

I'd credit the armies Thedas kept throwing at the Qunari with the reason why they were pushed back, Well that the massive slave revolts in the Imperium.

 

I'd say your giving one faction a bit much credit.

[Nukekitten]

Well there is we can kill mages and had no more magical disasters seems like best solution and well they created blight and many other disasters.Sound fine for me

Killing all the mages isn't a practical solution. I can't really see the Tevinter Imperium or the darkspawn going along with it, the Qunari hate to waste a tool, and any country that offers refuge to them - (Hello, Tevinter) - will become massively more powerful simply by virtue of being one of the few nations left with magic.

And then you're stuffed, basically.

[TheKomandorShepard]

But then they just pop back up again, like weeds.

 

Believe me TKS i would love a magic free world, but there are reasons to keep them around, apart from using them as fodder against Qunari.

 

Namely, it isn't genetic, magic appearing within a person is in it self a magical event, its part of the world.

 

It's easier to just accept that logic and lock them away and only pull them out when needed, like war beasts.

That is why i want drive templars into new goal so they hunt mages systematically and be focused on hunting not watching.

 

To be honest Thedas could be much more prepared to deal with qunari if not amount of disasters including blights caused by mages not to mention that humans would have the need for technology so they could satisfy their needs.

 

Only place i can see where mages are needed are grey warden but then all they need is few mages to prepare joining.

 

 

 

During the 1st and 2nd blight mages turned the tide. Do you even read WOT? without them the world would have fallen to the darkspawn. They also turned the tide when fighting the Qunari.

 

1. World destroyed by Darkspawn

2. The Qun ruling whole Thedas

 

Take your pick because without mages that would have happened. It can still happen.

 

Eee as i said 1000 times in first place without mages there wouldn't be blight so you set world on fire then you helped extinguish fire is rather poor argument how great mages are... as far mages are only needed to deal with disaster they cause unless we count qunari but then again points above.

 

 

Killing all the mages isn't a practical solution. I can't really see the Tevinter Imperium or the darkspawn going along with it, the Qunari hate to waste a tool, and any country that offers refuge to them - (Hello, Tevinter) - will become massively more powerful simply by virtue of being one of the few nations left with magic.

And then you're stuffed, basically.

Yeah i can see how unstable and mentally unbalanced go to the tevinter and explode there creating massive disasters that tev have deal with.  

As i said technology is the future qunari show that perfectly.

[Master Warder Z_]

Killing all the mages isn't a practical solution. I can't really see the Tevinter Imperium or the darkspawn going along with it, the Qunari hate to waste a tool, and any country that offers refuge to them - (Hello, Tevinter) - will become massively more powerful simply by virtue of being one of the few nations left with magic.

And then you're stuffed, basically.

 

Your joking right?

 

You think the Imperium would take in a bunch of foreign mages and treat them like equals?

 

They view Thedas a Chattel, people really need to get over their naive view of the Imperium as "benevolent".

 

Those Mages would either be used as canon fodder against the Qunari, made into slaves or killed because their inconvenient.

 

Or used for blood sacrifices anyway...though they tend only like little boys for those.

[Lulupab]

I'm pretty sure Mages had their part to play with the withdrawl of the Qunari from Thedas, but i'd also point out that a war that went on for two ages, for two centuries, and called for three exalted marches, had plenty of people within it beyond mages.
 
I'd credit the armies Thedas kept throwing at the Qunari with the reason why they were pushed back, Well that the massive slave revolts in the Imperium.
 
I'd say your giving one faction a bit much credit.

Magic is the only advantage Humans have against Qunari, that's how Tevinter can fight Qunari, that's how the Qunari couldn't take Minrathous and ultimately got defeated by humans of Thedas. Everyone played their part, sure. But I was talking about turning the tides aka balancing the war. I didn't say mages won by their own. The Qunari have their own mages but I suspect they are lesser in number and even lesser are properly trained to participate in a war.