939 réponses à ce sujet

[WildOrchid]

Not rly he/she could just escape to another country said as morrigan so it was choice.

 

Sadly Duncan wasn't around to tell Hawke to be a warden. And she chose to run away to save her family instead. Not everyone makes the same choices.

[TheKomandorShepard]

Sadly Duncan wasn't around to tell Hawke to be a warden. And she chose to run away to save her family instead. Not everyone makes the same choices.

And what Duncan have to that? Duncan was dead and even if you have taint in your veins you don't do anything about blight or belong to the wardens you can leave.Most of warden companions were normal peoples so well...

[Warden Commander Aeducan]

 

Warden is a Grey Warden. She has to face the Blight. Hawke wasn't even a warden (more like a civilian) and if she was, i can assure you she'd stay to face the Blight too.

 

 

Seriously though, I'm laughing. People are comparing warden and Hawke.... whose are different and have different stories. And they argue who's best and who's not.

 

I just don't know what else to say.

Being a Grey Warden doesn't dictate one to stay and fight, and it was his/her choice to stay and fight even if you're trying to play as cowardly Warden who's unwilling to join the Grey Warden but he/she still stay and fight. Hawke could flee because he/she has a family to take care of but regardless always flee anyway so...there we go.

 

Funny, because that is exactly what many of the Hawke's fans did, comparing the Warden and Hawke against each other...even trying to bury one character just to put their preferred character  on the pedestal. Honestly, I think it was a Hawke's fan who start to compete two characters...but oh well...

I have no word either.

[Char]

And what Duncan have to that? Duncan was dead and even if you have taint in your veins you don't do anything about blight or belong to the wardens you can leave.Most of warden companions were normal peoples so well...

The Warden had no choice in their actions, they -had- to join the Wardens and from therein had the duties that went with that responsibility. Hawke was either in the fighting at Ostagar or defending their family. Once they escaped from Lothering, Flemeth specifically says that the wardens are gone, and the only survivors far too far away. There was no way of Hawke joining the wardens even if they wanted to. Remember that joining the Wardens is supposed to be a life that very few people would choose.

So... People are entitled to prefer either character, for whatever reason, but they are two different people, in very different circumstances with different options open to them.

[raging_monkey]

Have tgey said anything about how they would look in game?

[WildOrchid]

The Warden had no choice in their actions, they -had- to join the Wardens and from therein had the duties that went with that responsibility. Hawke was either in the fighting at Ostagar or defending their family. Once they escaped from Lothering, Flemeth specifically says that the wardens are gone, and the only survivors far too far away. There was no way of Hawke joining the wardens even if they wanted to. Remember that joining the Wardens is supposed to be a life that very few people would choose.

So... People are entitled to prefer either character, for whatever reason, but they are two different people, in very different circumstances with different options open to them.

 

That's pretty much what i was saying. All this comparison is ridiculous. I prefer Hawke over Warden for personal reasons, and so others do too.

[TheKomandorShepard]

The Warden had no choice in their actions, they -had- to join the Wardens and from therein had the duties that went with that responsibility. Hawke was either in the fighting at Ostagar or defending their family. Once they escaped from Lothering, Flemeth specifically says that the wardens are gone, and the only survivors far too far away. There was no way of Hawke joining the wardens even if they wanted to. Remember that joining the Wardens is supposed to be a life that very few people would choose.

So... People are entitled to prefer either character, for whatever reason, but they are two different people, in very different circumstances with different options open to them.

No they had to go through joining that all is all what is your duty is your view as far i know duty doesn't mean literal chains rather blind view of the world... pretty much there was nothing that stops you from going to orlais to have fun...

[Char]

That's pretty much what i was saying. All this comparison is ridiculous. I prefer Hawke over Warden for personal reasons, and so others do too.

I love both my canon warden and my canon Hawke equally. My warden queen was devious, manipulative and obsessed with the station of her family and was great fun to play. My Hawke was a sarcastic mage, and I loved having all the snarky options, the bromance with Varric and the smaller, more intimate storyline- I was really upset when Leandra died!

[Char]

No they had to go through joining that all is all what is your duty is your view as far i know duty doesn't mean literal chains rather blind view of the world... pretty much there was nothing that stops you from going to orlais to have fun...

Except for the fact the plot of the game didn't allow for that, absolutely. Probably 95% of people in that situation would have headed for the hills and lived it up elsewhere, but our Warden couldnt because otherwise the game would read more like Dragon Age: Spring Break

[Warden Commander Aeducan]

The Warden had no choice in their actions, they -had- to join the Wardens and from therein had the duties that went with that responsibility. Hawke was either in the fighting at Ostagar or defending their family. Once they escaped from Lothering, Flemeth specifically says that the wardens are gone, and the only survivors far too far away. There was no way of Hawke joining the wardens even if they wanted to. Remember that joining the Wardens is supposed to be a life that very few people would choose.

So... People are entitled to prefer either character, for whatever reason, but they are two different people, in very different circumstances with different options open to them.

I still don't see the reason that dictates the Warden to stay and fight. True, that it was the grey warden's duty to fight the Darkspawn and end the Blight, and the calling will eventually draw every wardens to the Deep Roads, but nothing forces him/her to stay and he/she could attempt to flee after the joining is complete. There are room for role-play your own character as a dutiful, courage or a coward for the Warden and there is nothing to stop him/her from fleeing yet the Warden stay anyway regardless of how you play your character.

 

I wouldn't call Hawke a coward, and there are no reason for Hawke to join the Wardens but I fail to see how the Warden is insignificant compared to Hawke. I wouldn't even start on who's better though. I guess to each his own, and everyone is entitled to their own opinion. I'm pretty sure there is no problem until someone start to compete two previous protagonists...ah..bsn never changes.

[TheKomandorShepard]

Except for the fact the plot of the game didn't allow for that, absolutely. Probably 95% of people in that situation would have headed for the hills and lived it up elsewhere, but our Warden couldnt because otherwise the game would read more like Dragon Age: Spring Break

Yes but it was because main goal of the game was to stop the blight to so game had to follow plot but not that you don't have to be grey warden (read as belong to their organisation) or think that is your duty.Simple the warden chose to stop the blight for whatever reason you pick but nothing was forcing him to fight the blight. 

[Willowhugger]

There was a LOT of freedom in the Grey Warden's story, I found.

 

My Mage Warden's plot was completely different from my Cousland plot just in terms of how I was able to roleplay.

 

Amell Warden was just grateful to be out of the Circle.

 

The Cousland burned for revenge!

 

The game also nicely directed you to handle the Treaties business and "boxed you in" to the main quest because Loghain was hunting you and the Blight was going to destroy the world. As a result, you might as well save the world since all of the safe places you went were anything but.

[SgtSteel91]

I don't know if people forgot but Hawke became an indentured servant for year to pay off his Uncle's debts and actually be allowed to move into Kirkwall, and by the time he paid off those debts the Blight was over.

[Willowhugger]

I don't know if people forgot but Hawke became an indentured servant for year to pay off his Uncle's debts and actually be allowed to move into Kirkwall, and by the time he paid off those debts the Blight was over.

Hell, if Hawke joined the mercenaries, maybe he DID fight the Blight.

[Jedi Master of Orion]

By who?

 

._.

 

His children are dropping like flies.

 

White Walkers. They'd make absolutely sure they also didn't miss anybody.

[Elite Midget]

The Warden > Hawke. There's no debate.

 

The Warden killed/defeated 2 Pride Abominations (Uldred, the Baroness), 1 Pride Demon, 3 extremely powerful blood mages one of them a Magister (Caldrius), Gaxkang the Unbound, 3 High Dragons (one of them was Flemeth), 1 Varterral, the Queen of the Blackmarsh, the Archdemon Urthemiel, the Mother, the Harvester, and thousands of darkspawn. (Not counting diverging enemies like Caradin or Witherfang)

 

Hawke's killed Corypheus (tops his list), Xebenkeck, Maybe the Arishok, Maybe Danarius, 2 Varterrals, 1 High Dragon, Red Lyrium Meredith, Harvester Orsino, 1 High Dragon, 1 Pride Abomination (Marethari), and hundreds of demons.

 

Hawke's tough, but is not on the Warden's tier of badassery yet. 

 

When you consider that the Warden accomplished all of this within the span of 2 years as opposed to 7 it makes the winner a clear case.

That's like your opinion man. There's plenty that like Hawke more like there's plenty that like the Warden more. Thus your "There's no debate" conclusion isn't valid as you only speak for yourself.

 

Flemeth didn't fight at full strength, we've yet to see Flemeth use even a portion of her true power. Heck she didn't even hurl spells at you and she's a far more powerful spellcaster than Morrigan considering that she's very old, powerful, and taught Morrigan everything she knows. You also seem to be over emphasizing the Warden's accomplishments and downplaying everything Hawke did.

 

And if you want to go by canon, since you seem to act like every optional thing the Warden can do is canon while not for Hawke, than the Warden sacrifices themselves against the Archdemon.

 

 

Hawke is running away from the Blight, while the Warden stays to rally everyone and defeat the Archdemon. Yeah...I know who's better since the beginning, and the mighty champion of Kirkwall wasn't even the person who starts something that ought to change the world since most of the time these events just caught up with him/her, and last I checked Hawke's goal was only to get rich and take care of his/her family.

 

Frankly I'd take that blank face but a room for more personality that make the Warden more of a unique character and closer to the human being, over a defined personality that makes Hawke super good all the time even to someone who's totally evil, Hawke that always cracks joke even at the most inappropriate time like Dumar's son dying, or Hawke that always angry and blunt all the time...those defined personality while many find it amusing it doesn't sound like a normal human being to me.

Pretty sure the Warden ran away from the Blight to and had to be saved by Flemeth. Furthermore Hawke wasn't a Grey Warden and Hawke had no means to fight the Blight or form an army considering that Hawke was literally only a peasant at the time that was only trying to protect their family. 

 

Anyway, than the Warden spent much of DA:O running away from the blight, since confronting the blight right away would be suicide, as the Warden gathered a massive army so the Warden could actually fight and end the Blight.

 

So stop trying to pretend that the Warden didn't run(And left Lothering to burn), when you literally did for nearly 99% of the game, and incorrectly believing that the Warden solo'd the blight and the Archdemon. If that was the case than the Warden wouldn't have had to do many of the things they did it if was so simple to end the Blight.

 

 

 I don't..Not everyone hated DA2 and Hawke, shocking right?    

Sarcastic Female Hawke>The Warden.

 

Indeed that voice is love. 

 

Does anyone know if Hawkes' V.A's are confirmed to be returning for DAI?

I believe that he and she will return for Hawke as Bioware tends to use the same VAs for a lot of their work. Look at the VAs for SWTOR, a lot of those VAs were pulled from ME and DA series. VAs seem to have a pretty good relationship with Bioware as well as they do come back for multiple games.

[Milan92]

I liked The Warden and Hawke equally.

[Warden Commander Aeducan]

Pretty sure the Warden ran away from the Blight to and had to be saved by Flemeth. Furthermore Hawke wasn't a Grey Warden and Hawke had no means to fight the Blight or form an army considering that Hawke was literally only a peasant at the time that was only trying to protect their family. 

 

Anyway, than the Warden spent much of DA:O running away from the blight, since confronting the blight right away would be suicide, as the Warden gathered a massive army so the Warden could actually fight and end the Blight.

 

So stop trying to pretend that the Warden didn't run(And left Lothering to burn), when you literally did for nearly 99% of the game, and incorrectly believing that the Warden solo'd the blight and the Archdemon. If that was the case than the Warden wouldn't have had to do many of the things they did it if was so simple to end the Blight.

Pretty sure there are big differences between cowardice and realize your own strength and the reality of the situation or fight smart or charge head on without a second thought of the suicide. By the way, the Warden didn't run away from the Blight he/she was fighting at Ostagar remember? before you pin the blame on the Warden you cannot deny the fact that the situation is dire, and it's also Loghain and King Cailan's fault everything went downhill. Beside isn't it Hawke who's running away and also had to be saved by Flemeth? If we follow your logic then perhaps they are more alike than you think. I know with Hawke's role and situation has no means to fight the Blight, but there is nothing that makes the Warden more of a coward than Hawke, the fact that the Warden never flee Ferelden already prove that.

 

There are huge differences between fighting smart and charge head on to the suicide.

It still doesn't change the fact that Hawke ran away from the Blight and flee Ferelden. Believe it or not but you would be fell of the chair laughing if the game force you to solo the Archdemon and you failed. You know that gathering the armies to stop the Blight is a sensible decision, and by the way the Warden still saves a lot of life or doom them (if you choose to abandon them yourself). Face it Hawke's first reaction is to flee from the problem, and even if his/her burden was to protect the family, the Warden regardless of personal burden never flee Ferelden, he/she also did many great things more than gathering armies to fight the Blight, and end the civil war in Ferelden. I don't even know how you could consider the Warden as a coward more than Hawke since the Warden never flee Ferelden, but if you want to dig everything that can be used to defend your preferred character well that's your business. The fact still stands though no matter how much you want to deny it.  Was there any word in my previous sentence that I think the Warden should solo the Archdemon just to prove who's better? No?

[Black Jimmy]

This is one of those conversations which is pointless because noone is going to change there mind, so let's move on to something else.

 

What do you guys think Hawke's going to be doing in DA:I?

[Warden Commander Aeducan]

What do you guys think Hawke's going to be doing in DA:I?

Saving the world? Why did Hawke and the Warden disappear in the first place assuming the Warden never go through eluvian.

[Black Jimmy]

Saving the world? Why did Hawke and the Warden disappear in the first place assuming the Warden never go through eluvian.

Pub crawl.

[NeverlandHunter]

The Warden had no choice in their actions, they -had- to join the Wardens and from therein had the duties that went with that responsibility. Hawke was either in the fighting at Ostagar or defending their family. Once they escaped from Lothering, Flemeth specifically says that the wardens are gone, and the only survivors far too far away. There was no way of Hawke joining the wardens even if they wanted to. Remember that joining the Wardens is supposed to be a life that very few people would choose.

So... People are entitled to prefer either character, for whatever reason, but they are two different people, in very different circumstances with different options open to them. It's weird to try and compare them. Hawke is a very distinct character, even with the personality choices you can make for him/her he/she is still Hawke. The Warden on the other hand is a blank slate, for you (the player) to put a personality behind. It's partly due to the fact that there were so many origins for your Warden, it's partly due to the fact your Warden doesn't speak and has a whole lot more dialogue options. You have to use your own imagination to distill a personality onto the Warden.

[Elite Midget]

Pretty sure there are big differences between cowardice and realize your own strength and the reality of the situation or fight smart or charge head on without a second thought of the suicide. By the way, the Warden didn't run away from the Blight he/she was fighting at Ostagar remember? before you pin the blame on the Warden you cannot deny the fact that the situation is dire, and it's also Loghain and King Cailan's fault everything went downhill. Beside isn't it Hawke who's running away and also had to be saved by Flemeth? If we follow your logic then perhaps they are more alike than you think. I know with Hawke's role and situation has no means to fight the Blight, but there is nothing that makes the Warden more of a coward than Hawke, the fact that the Warden never flee Ferelden already prove that.

 

There are huge differences between fighting smart and charge head on to the suicide.

It still doesn't change the fact that Hawke ran away from the Blight and flee Ferelden. Believe it or not but you would be fell of the chair laughing if the game force you to solo the Archdemon and you failed. You know that gathering the armies to stop the Blight is a sensible decision, and by the way the Warden still saves a lot of life or doom them (if you choose to abandon them yourself). Face it Hawke's first reaction is to flee from the problem, and even if his/her burden was to protect the family, the Warden regardless of personal burden never flee Ferelden, he/she also did many great things more than gathering armies to fight the Blight, and end the civil war in Ferelden. I don't even know how you could consider the Warden as a coward more than Hawke since the Warden never flee Ferelden, but if you want to dig everything that can be used to defend your preferred character well that's your business. The fact still stands though no matter how much you want to deny it.  Was there any word in my previous sentence that I think the Warden should solo the Archdemon just to prove who's better? No?

 

And Hawke wasn't a coward, Hawke did the only thing he/she could do to protect their family as Hawke was only a peasant with no means to deal with the Blight. The Warden on the other hand DID have the means to deal with the Blight. Thus you're unfairly attacking Hawke to try and make the Warden look more awesome while completely ignoring that you could be forced into the Order and didn't really have a choice on the matter. It was either end the Blight or die as Loghain was watching the borders so you weren't going to escape the country during the Blight since they were specifically looking for Wardens.

 

The Warden DID run after Ostagar when they realized that the blight was a real deal and the Warden abandons Lothering instead of facing the Blight. That's a fact. Whether it's cowardly or not is an opinion, what isn't is that the Warden DID run. Your the one that started the Hawke bashing, I merely pointed out the flaws of your argument and how your unfairly target Hawke while trying to over-exaggerate the Warden.

 

Still running no matter how you look at it. 

 

Hawke was a peasant with no means to fight the Blight and Hawke had a family to take care of. The Warden is an practically an Orphan that has no one personal that's depending on them when Ostagar falls like Hawke did. So face it, Hawke had VERY VALID reasons for fleeing Ferelden.

 

I'll number it for you.

 

1 - Hawke is a peasant, not a Warden.

2 - Hawke has no Title or Name they can call upon nor does Hawke have treaties.

3 - Hawke had a family that depended on him/her for their survival.

4 - Hawke fled Lothering AFTER it was attacked. The Warden left BEFORE Lothering was attacked so the Warden didn't suddenly wake up one morning to see a bunch of Darkspawn attacking his/her home like the Hawke Family did.

 

I'm merely stating what happened, you're purposely trying to downplay Hawke to make the Warden look better and twisting what happened so the Warden looks more heroic even though the fact of the matter is that both the Warden AND Hawke fled from the Blight. The only difference is the Warden had no choice but to try and solve the problem and actually had the means to do so. Expecting Hawke to stay and fight the Blight when they have no station, name, tittle, or means or coercion to force an army together is extremely unrealistic.

[KaiserShep]

Hawke is running away from the Blight, while the Warden stays to rally everyone and defeat the Archdemon. Yeah...I know who's better since the beginning, and the mighty champion of Kirkwall wasn't even the person who starts something that ought to change the world since most of the time these events just caught up with him/her, and last I checked Hawke's goal was only to get rich and take care of his/her family.

 

Frankly I'd take that blank face but a room for more personality that make the Warden more of a unique character and closer to the human being, over a defined personality that makes Hawke super good all the time even to someone who's totally evil, Hawke that always cracks joke even at the most inappropriate time like Dumar's son dying, or Hawke that always angry and blunt all the time...those defined personality while many find it amusing it doesn't sound like a normal human being to me.

 

Wut...

 

I understand people not liking Hawke, but I think at times some may be trying too hard, to the point of making things up.

 

Everyone was fleeing from the Blight, soldier and civilian alike. If Hawke was a mage, then she was just another peasant in a rather defenseless Lothering, and if she was a rogue or warrior, then she is fleeing with Carver from Ostagar after Loghain withdrew and the darkspawn overwhelmed them. Suicide is not exactly my idea of a brilliant strategy. If not for Flemeth, the Hero of Ferelden and Alistair would not even have had time to flee, because they would simply be dead. "Better" is kind of meaningless here, because it's not a matter of who's better, but rather who is lucky, or unlucky depending on how you look at it. Aside from Hawke simply not being equipped to end the Blight anyway, the Warden's sole source of power lies in the Grey Warden treaties.

 

 

It still doesn't change the fact that Hawke ran away from the Blight and flee Ferelden. Believe it or not but you would be fell of the chair laughing if the game force you to solo the Archdemon and you failed. You know that gathering the armies to stop the Blight is a sensible decision, and by the way the Warden still saves a lot of life or doom them (if you choose to abandon them yourself). Face it Hawke's first reaction is to flee from the problem, and even if his/her burden was to protect the family, the Warden regardless of personal burden never flee Ferelden, he/she also did many great things more than gathering armies to fight the Blight, and end the civil war in Ferelden. I don't even know how you could consider the Warden as a coward more than Hawke since the Warden never flee Ferelden, but if you want to dig everything that can be used to defend your preferred character well that's your business. The fact still stands though no matter how much you want to deny it.  Was there any word in my previous sentence that I think the Warden should solo the Archdemon just to prove who's better? No?

 

You make it seem as though Hawke was just avoiding something that could be faced head-on, as if it was some sort of personal issue that could simply be resolved if she just confronted it. People were fleeing a massive horde of doom that even left the very ground they tread upon leaves sickness and death in their wake.

 

Hawke's first reaction to flee the Blight is a sensible one, because any other reaction would be stupid and end in death.

[Willowhugger]

Cowardice, to me, implies that someone puts themselves above the common good.

 

Hawke put his FAMILY above himself.

 

So I can't say he's a coward.

 

Was he as selfless as the Grey Warden? I dunno, a lot of the Grey Wardens had pretty bad family situations except for the Couslands. By the beginning of the game, he has nothing to lose but himself.

 

Despite the controversial nature of your statement, Hawke not giving a **** about the world at large is actually a PLOT POINT, though so the guy who says the Grey Warden is more noble actually has a point. In "The Mark of the Assassin" Talis asks whether Hawke has anything he devotes his considerable power and skill to.

 

My Hawke says, "I protect my family."

 

Talis more or less says, "That's not enough."

Later Hawke can say, "I protect Kirkwall."

 

Which satisfies Talis.

 

But a huge amount of the game is about Hawke trying to STAY OUT of the larger affairs of things like Templars vs. Mages and Slavery and So On. In D&D terms, every Hawke is Neutral whether Neutral Good, Chaotic Neutral, Neutral, Lawful Neutral, or Neutral Evil. They don't feel the entire world's problems are theirs.

 

Which is what Hawke's emotional journey is about changing.