64 réponses à ce sujet

[CIA]

Well it's very clear you didn't read my post, only looked at the images. Here is the part you failed to read...

"Joking aside I know there are bug fixing mods out there but aside from a few minor side quests that were still left bugged they did fix a lot of errors with patches officially. The only thing you need a mod for, IMO, is if you want to play a mage at high levels of the game. Every other combat option out there you can buff as you get stronger where magic you could only make it cost less magicka."

I read it thoroughly thank you very much, and you're still objectively wrong. There is much more wrong with Skyrim than high level Mage balancing.

Also, Dragon Age:Origins while a good RPG for the most part suffered from some terrible design decisions in regards to forcing skill point spending and attributes you don't need. Mods fixed this.

[chance52]

I read it thoroughly thank you very much, and you're still objectively wrong. There is much more wrong with Skyrim than high level Mage balancing.

Also, Dragon Age:Origins while a good RPG for the most part suffered from some terrible design decisions in regards to forcing skill point spending and attributes you don't need. Mods fixed this.

 

 

Clearly not.  I was replying to someone that said mods were needed in Skyrim to make the game playable.  I assumed that person was speaking metaphorically and I responded metaphorically as well, all in good/friendly intent given the goofy nature of my examples. Then I answered his/her post with my opinion. 

 

Taste in entertainment and functionality are two different things. I wasn't saying anything about mods being needed for people to enjoy the game, as many people that enjoyed it on consoles without any mods prove already. I was speaking about functional aspects of the game not 'needing' mods.  Like Skyrim or don't, you don't need a single mod to play 99.9% of the game and that .1% are 2 or 3 side quests and a couple dialogue triggers at this point given the official patches.

 

I am not 'objectively wrong' but you seem to be hell bent on proving Skyrim is bad, which isn't really a reply to anything in my above posts.

[Lyrandori]

Oh the reaction of the hordes of young frustrated males (and, heck, possibly females too) when they'll realize they'll never get their nude textures.

 

Anyone got popcorn? The drinks are on me though! Wait, no, I'll pay the popcorn. To be honest, however, what sort of mods would you want? This is a genuine question (try to ignore the comment above, it never happened). Mods to "rebalance" skills and damage? To expand the already-gigantic map? Amateur-made content with a plethora of bugs? A "revamped" GUI? Nah, we all know what will happen, we'll have maybe, maybe a dozen "decent" mods and the thousand others will be found under the "Adult" section of Inquisition Nexus.

 

Anyway, I don't think that it will be a mods-friendly game, there's been zero announcement regarding any sort of editing tools / software nor do other existing Frostbite-powered games have anything remotely similar to a modding community. As far as I know Bad Company 2, BF3, BF4 and the Frostbite Need for Speed games cannot be modded to any significant extent (or not at all).

 

Also http://gamerant.com/...-modding-tools/ gives more insights on the subject of modding and the Frostbite engine (the reasons are mostly all delightfully laughable, but such is life, you can't get everything you want, it sucks).

[Andraste_Reborn]

Oh the reaction of the hordes of young frustrated males (and, heck, possibly females too) when they'll realize they'll never get their nude textures.

 

That would only annoy me if they put underwear sex scenes in Inquisition, which I trust they won't .

 

(Origins remains the only game I've ever installed nude textures for, because the sex scenes were just so silly otherwise. Where did Morrigan get that bra, and why did she put it on just to have sex in?! Not to mention that every woman wearing the same underwired bra was ridiculous.)

[Sylvius the Mad]

(Origins remains the only game I've ever installed nude textures for, because the sex scenes were just so silly otherwise. Where did Morrigan get that bra, and why did she put it on just to have sex in?! Not to mention that every woman wearing the same underwired bra was ridiculous.)

Origins was the first game for which I ever installed nude mods, and I did it for similar reasons. But the benefits of the nude mods were more far-reaching than I expected.

Because corpses.

There's a lack of dignity to a nude corpse. When I visited Ostagar and saw Cailan's body left exposed to the elements, it was a much sadder scene with the nude mods.

The piles of corpses on Fort Drakon are made far more horrifying with nude mods. Piling up corpses in the corner is one thing, but piling up nude corpses really drives home the inhumanity of it.

[Wulfram]

As far as nude mods go, I expect life will find a way

[Shapeshifter777]

Oh the reaction of the hordes of young frustrated males (and, heck, possibly females too) when they'll realize they'll never get their nude textures.

 

Anyone got popcorn? The drinks are on me though! Wait, no, I'll pay the popcorn. To be honest, however, what sort of mods would you want? This is a genuine question (try to ignore the comment above, it never happened). Mods to "rebalance" skills and damage? To expand the already-gigantic map? Amateur-made content with a plethora of bugs? A "revamped" GUI? Nah, we all know what will happen, we'll have maybe, maybe a dozen "decent" mods and the thousand others will be found under the "Adult" section of Inquisition Nexus.

 

Anyway, I don't think that it will be a mods-friendly game, there's been zero announcement regarding any sort of editing tools / software nor do other existing Frostbite-powered games have anything remotely similar to a modding community. As far as I know Bad Company 2, BF3, BF4 and the Frostbite Need for Speed games cannot be modded to any significant extent (or not at all).

 

Also http://gamerant.com/...-modding-tools/ gives more insights on the subject of modding and the Frostbite engine (the reasons are mostly all delightfully laughable, but such is life, you can't get everything you want, it sucks).

 

Well I made a killer shapeshifting mod for Skyrim.  I would want that for this game, especially since they took away our shapeshifter class.

[CIA]

To be honest, however, what sort of mods would you want? This is a genuine question (try to ignore the comment above, it never happened). Mods to "rebalance" skills and damage? To expand the already-gigantic map? Amateur-made content with a plethora of bugs? A "revamped" GUI? Nah, we all know what will happen, we'll have maybe, maybe a dozen "decent" mods and the thousand others will be found under the "Adult" section of Inquisition Nexus.

If you look at http://www.nexusmods...lltime/?adult=0, you'll see lots of changes that actually fix some of the(understandable) f**kups Bioware made in Origins and make them a lot better. Improved tactics, improved combat, improved atmosphere, improved models, improved textures, being able to hide your helmet, being able to bash locks to open them. Then, you'll see a couple mods that *oh god* improve the nude models from the mess they were before.

 

So please, take your baseless assumptions somewhere else.

[Sylvius the Mad]

I expect a great many "features" that would benefit from modification.

[Lyrandori]

If you look at http://www.nexusmods...lltime/?adult=0, you'll see lots of changes that actually fix some of the(understandable) f**kups Bioware made in Origins and make them a lot better. Improved tactics, improved combat, improved atmosphere, improved models, improved textures, being able to hide your helmet, being able to bash locks to open them. Then, you'll see a couple mods that *oh god* improve the nude models from the mess they were before.

 

So please, take your baseless assumptions somewhere else.

 

At least you asked politely, but I won't take my "assumptions" somewhere else. I'll discuss this topic here, it's not like I'm going to find a proper thread on CNN.com.

 

Most of the mods you're referring to are subjectively appreciated at best. So called "improved" tactics, "improved" combat, "improved" atmosphere. You don't need those if you already find the default tactics, combat and atmosphere good as it is. All of those are good only if... well you know, if you happen to find them good, can we agree on that? Or you absolutely want to pretend that only those matter? The only mods that I would find objectively better are improved models NOT because they also change the actual appearance of a character, but simply because it would increase actual polygons count, which is usually not the case (more often than not those " improved models" mods also change character appearances).

 

As far as "improved textures" go, it's also subjective. You can "improve" the textures of Denerim or the textures of trees and grass, but if it contrasts too much with the existing default textures you essentially have two different art styles and low default and new high resolution textures competing against each other. Then you need a complete textures overhaul to make a worthy visual change, and then maybe, objectively, it's good. When it comes to textures I can certainly appreciate an increase in default textures resolution from say... 1024x1024 to 2048x2048, that sort of textures mod is objectively better. But when it changes the actual material / surface texture for a new one and then pretends to be "better" or "improved" that's complete subjective territory.

 

Smaller gameplay-related mods such as bashing open locked chests, or hiding your helmet, sure that's ok, those are decent mods. I did mention in my post that we would end up with a dozen decent mods for Inquisition. I'm not pretending that the only worthy mods would be adult ones (nudity, romance/sex scenes, etc). What I am saying, essentially, is those mods are inevitable. Whether or not people admit it here they'll be popular on a would-be Inquisition Nexus site. It shouldn't be a big deal, however. I can admit that I've peppered this subject with a dose of unnecessary drama. I mean Skyrim sold millions, continues to sell to this day and Skyrim Nexus is filled with "adult mods", from the comical and exaggerated to the utterly grotesque and obscene (sometimes even morally questionable, at the very least). To be honest I don't know if it actually helps to sell it on the PC platform, maybe it actually does. And CD Projekt Red got the balls to include full nudity that actually fits with the narrative and context in The Witcher 2 (rated M, with nudity and "strong sexual content"), and it never stopped the game from being praised all over the planet.

 

The main points of this are:

 

1) The more the devs know what they're doing and the more balls they have to include "mature content" where fitting (and not "just because") the less mods become desired or even necessary. As you said yourself CIA, some of the mods were made to "fix" the so called "f-ckups" that BioWare themselves made. By that logic then mods become necassary when a developer screws things up? Then again, screw ups are usually subjective. If the devs themselves actually made them... maybe that's because... oh... because they wanted the thing to be that way? That's just a thought. If not, I guess because the game was rushed? Or because they want to make sure that they avoid a Mature rating from ESRB? There's too many reasons... please, "take your baseless assumptions somewhere else" (yeah I had to).

 

2) I don't know what's going on in EA Digital Illusions CE's minds (they are the creators of the Frostbite engine). Maybe it's related to... let's try to guess for a moment. Can anyone start a drums roll please. What about money? The true God of humanity. Or maybe because they're too proud of themselves? I don't know. I mean Patrick Söderlund did mention that Mr. Joe everyone wouldn't know how to mod games powered by Frostbite anyway, because it's a "complex engine" and we're just too stupid to figure things out (well ok he didn't say that word for word but he's a bad liar, please, Mr. Söderlund, avoid politics at all costs). See, our true and only real job is to buy games, we're not intelligent enough to mod them.

 

3) Believe it or not, but the potential of ending up with adult or nudity mods (whether it be a "fitting" mod that adds something good to one or two specific scenes or not) for your game a big no no for some of the folks taking the final decisions over at EA and/or BioWare when it comes to the moddability of a game. Someone, somewhere, at EA or BioWare (or both) will have a bad day (inexplicably so especially from the point of view of the gamers) when the media writes a novel worth of complaints and starts an existential debate because Mr. Joe removed Josephine's bra in one scene and ended up exposing her blindingly shocking female nipples.

 

And, anyhow, as far as we know for now Inquisition will not be moddable (at least not to any significant extent). Maybe we'll be able to change a few textures here and there (and even that would surprise me) but that's about it.

[CIA]

All of those are good only if... well you know, if you happen to find them good, can we agree on that?

 

Afraid we can't. Let's not brush over things, let's go through nice and steady, one by one

 

Improved tactics. See here. http://www.nexusmods...nage/mods/181/?

 

 

This add-in fix various bugs in tactics system, party members behaviors and AI.

• It enable new conditions and actions in the tactics system that give you the opportunity to configure your followers more precisely. For example, you will find a [Dead] statement that allow you to check for a dead ally. Full list below.
• It makes some changes in followers AI. For example, Ranged followers avoid melee with this add-in. Full list below.
• It also fix some bugs that players may encounter during combat. Like caster freeze trying to cast a spell or melee players stopping auto attack.
• An effort is done to translate this add-in in all languages available in dragon age: English, French, German, Spanish, Italian, Russian, Polish, Hungarian, Czech

 

This fixed BUGS. LITERAL things wrong with the game.

 

Improved Combat. See here http://www.nexusmods...nage/mods/354/?

 

 

The objective of this mod is to smooth the talent progression curve, make obscure talents worthwhile, remove some combat annoyance, while maintaining overall balance, without straying too far from vanilla gameplay. I would greatly appreciate any suggestions to achieve better balance across all talents and improve combat experience in general.

 

Now I will grant you that this mod is entirely optional, but it does 'fix' a lot of oversights with the original Dragon Age gameplay. It even says it doesn't stray too far from vanilla gameplay.

 

Improved Atmosphere. See here. http://www.nexusmods...nage/mods/686/?.

 

 

This mod will redesign the WHOLE of the NPCs in Dragon Age to fix skin issues, face proportions, personality mismatches, gender identification, race identification, etc. in an attempt to make each character fit better with the the lore of Dragon Age.

 

I shouldn't have to write here, but I will: This fixes objective issues with the games, that were simple oversights by Bioware when they were making a big, impressive RPG. Just a fan perfecting the understandable rough edges.

 

 

As far as "improved textures" go, it's also subjective.

No it isn't, if they're the same thing but a higher resolution and detail, then they're objectively better.

 

 

I did mention in my post that we would end up with a dozen decent mods for Inquisition

 

I gave you a list of just under one hundred, and there are MANY more.

 

 

the rest of the third paragraph

 

Then we're in agreement? lol. There are thousands, tens of thousands of Skyrim mods. Sure, a large amount of them are waifush*t, but an equally large amount of them are well thought out mods that add to and improve the game.

 

I will address your 1) 2) and 3)

 

1) "maybe that's because... oh... because they wanted the thing to be that way?" No. Just no. There are things that mods change that are objectively better than the original game. Now, I do realise you were referring to the nude models(which you can't get your mind off apparently, despite them being less than 1% of mods), which I understand. But when a game deals with rape(city elf origin), murder of children, and you know, sex itself, I can't see that being a problem. Anyway, I don't use those mods so don't even think of painting me as one of your strawman "young frustrated males"

 

2) This entire point went nowhere and had no relevance to the conversation. If you're trying to suggest that the reason DA:O had some glaring problems was because they didn't have the resources to finish it? Fine, I accept that. That doesn't mean that every mod is a waifu mod though.

 

3) So you're saying the shameful, godawful, corrupted, broken, immoral and genuinely wrong gaming journalism sites like Kotaku are a good reason to limit player moddability entirely? That is a terrible opinion, and you know it.

 

Besides, I invite you to find one article about Dragon Age Origins or Dragon Age 2 from a credible source that criticised the modding scene of those games. Go on. Do it. None of that has ANYTHING to do with Bioware.

 

 

I'm sorry, but there is nothing you can say to me that will convince me modding is a bad thing. Cherrypicking immature mods does not do it. If I cherrypicked some bad posts on this forum would you say it represents all of BSN?

 

Also, you're entirely right about Frostbite, haha. So OP, the answer is 'most likely no', but this got more into the ethics of mods than whether it's possible.

[Realmzmaster]

Mods are great for gamers who feel a need for them. The point that mods make the game better is entirely subjective.

 

I like to use the tactics screen in both DAO and DA2. Many gamers like to rave about the advanced tactics mode for DAO. So I decided to try it only to find that it breaks the tactics scripts that I have already set by changing some of the conditionals from the way they originally worked. That means to use the mod I must rework all the scripts. So I simply removed the mod because I do not need it to fix something that is not broken along with the fact it would not work with another mod I tried..

 

The other mod I tried was Combat Tweaks which I quickly found conflicts with many other mods that wish to modify the same files. The point is that modders do not have to make sure that their mods work with other mods. Basically it is impossible when there can be hundreds of mods modifying the same files. So the modder can only be responsible for his/her mod.

 

That leaves the gamer with the task of backing out all the mods in use until the gamer finds the one that is in conflict. One good rule of thumb is to limit the number of mods in use.

 

If a developer issues a modkit the developer becomes responsible for supporting that kit with patches, bug fixes and other support which cost resources.

 

The question the developer has to ask  is will the benefit out weigh the cost in resources?. 

 

I have no skin in the game, but so far I have not found mods to be useful to me in my gameplay. Others on the other hand have and that is good for them.

[CIA]

@Realmz

 

That's fair enough, the mod page does warn it's incompatible with existing saves, IIRC. Still much better for a new playthrough.

 

"One good rule of thumb is to limit the number of mods in use."

This is only in a game with mediocre modding tools, like Dragon Age. In games like Elder Scrolls or Fallout, you can easily merge them through external applications.

 

"the developer becomes responsible for supporting that kit with patches, bug fixes and other support which cost resources."

The question the developer has to ask  is will the benefit out weigh the cost in resources? Well, we'll see. If a game is good enough, people will endlessly replay it. Personally, I think an unmodded DA:O will be played for years to come, even if mods do make it objectively better. DA2 won't be played in 5 years time, let alone years to come. So yes, if DA:I is very good, it won't be a big no-no that it isn't moddable.

[Realmzmaster]

@Realmz

 

That's fair enough, the mod page does warn it's incompatible with existing saves, IIRC. Still much better for a new playthrough.

 

"One good rule of thumb is to limit the number of mods in use."

This is only in a game with mediocre modding tools, like Dragon Age. In games like Elder Scrolls or Fallout, you can easily merge them through external applications.

 

"the developer becomes responsible for supporting that kit with patches, bug fixes and other support which cost resources."

The question the developer has to ask  is will the benefit out weigh the cost in resources? Well, we'll see. If a game is good enough, people will endlessly replay it. Personally, I think an unmodded DA:O will be played for years to come, even if mods do make it objectively better. DA2 won't be played in 5 years time, let alone years to come. So yes, if DA:I is very good, it won't be a big no-no that it isn't moddable.

 

No quite in Elder Scrolls or Fallout  mods can also conflict because of load order. The mods priority level in Fallout and Elder Scrolls can cause conflicts even using external applications like FOMM (which is now not being supported by the modder because the modder is working on a replacement). This can cause CTD. So gamers will still have to deactivate each mod to find the one causing the conflict and then change the load order which still may not solve the problem. 

[Lyrandori]

Afraid we can't. Let's not brush over things, let's go through nice and steady, one by one

 

Improved tactics. See here. http://www.nexusmods...nage/mods/181/?

 

This fixed BUGS. LITERAL things wrong with the game.

 

 

Yes I understand that such mods fix literal bugs with the game, but is your point that we absolutely have to download them?

 

I've never tried to dismiss the potential usefulness of mods (such as those that do fix bugs). I know that there's decent ones out there... but no one is obliged to download them even if they fix actual bugs. I still maintain that if a person doesn't want to use a mod like that because it's not worthy it to him or her... then he or she won't download it, therefor it is subjective. If a person finds such mods to be something they consider good... then, good for them? Now if YOU, yourself, think that a person "ignoring" such a mod is out of his or her mind then that's your opinion, it's not their fault. It's not like the entire Dragon Age: Origins players base actually even know about such mods to start with nor did every single one of the DAO players even downloaded them. They still can enjoy the game the way it is with the lingering bugs.

 

Improved Combat. See here http://www.nexusmods...nage/mods/354/?
 

Now I will grant you that this mod is entirely optional, but it does 'fix' a lot of oversights with the original Dragon Age gameplay. It even says it doesn't stray too far from vanilla gameplay.

 

Improved Atmosphere. See here. http://www.nexusmods...nage/mods/686/?.

 

 

Again, it's not like I'm "against" mods like that, you're presenting them as if it was the case. I'm aware that modders out there attempt (and sometimes successfully) to "rebalance" or smooth things out without completely destroying the default content. But mods like that are still subjectively appreciated by would-be interested (or not) supporters / followers of said mod(s). We still don't "need" them. I could stop this here by saying that NO mods are "needed" even if they fix actual bugs but I'll keep going for the rest below.

 

I shouldn't have to write here, but I will: This fixes objective issues with the games, that were simple oversights by Bioware when they were making a big, impressive RPG. Just a fan perfecting the understandable rough edges.

 

 

Of course the issues are... objective issues. But what if for example a person happens to be browsing the mods, sees one that happens to "fix actual bugs" and the person just shrugs it off and continues browsing for "something else" (anything)? How would you consider someone doing that? The person is just blind? If he/she wants something else and ignores "Mod #21 fixing bugs numbered 47 to 86" but instead goes for "Overpowered Weapons That Adds a Little Spicy Something To The Game #99", can you still consider that a choice? The choice of the mod(s) to be used is subjective even if the mod contains fixes to issues that themselves are objectively present in the game.

 

I'll give you another example: Skyrim's Unofficial Patch. That monster of a "mod" is indeed one epic "let's basically fix the entire game ten times over" patch. But do you honestly, genuinely believe that everyone playing Skyrim actually has it installed without a single exception? Again, I'm not saying that for Inquisition a "bugs fixing" patch wouldn't exist nor that if it does exist that it wouldn't be useful.

 

So, yeah, what if I subjectively choose not to download it because it merely does not interest me? I'm talking about subjectivity. It's not because we're talking about this that I just happen to give this example. You have to realize (I hope you'll agree, I can admit that much) that some people simply "don't want to" download such mods. Not because they don't believe the mod fixes so many bugs, but because they just don't want to, even if their reasons are basically nonexistent for you (or "poor", which would still just be your or my point of view on their choice).

 

No it isn't, if they're the same thing but a higher resolution and detail, then they're objectively better.

 

 

Yeah except that's exactly what I said. I haven't edited my post, just read that part again. I clearly say that I would personally find a textures mod objectively good if it happened to contain increased resolution default textures from (by example) 1024x1024 to 2048x2048. So yeah we agree on that one (see, I'm not that bad of a person? I don't bite anyway).

 

I gave you a list of just under one hundred, and there are MANY more.

 

 

Ok c'mon, we don't always have to be literal. When I say that maybe we'll end up with a dozen decent mods for Inquisition I don't actually mean twelve. I know Oblivion, Fallout 3 and Skyrim Nexus very well. I've been there myself, I've downloaded a few mods myself (I'm using 9 mods for Skyrim, now may the wrath of God strike me where I stand). I know that there's thousands of mods... okay. The point now? You thought that I was literally... literal? I admit, it's easy for me to type this right now but really, you really thought that I wasn't just a little bit cynical or that I was at the very least just being dramatic? Do we have to weight our words on forums all the time now? I'm not into politics yet.

 

Let me rephrase it then, can I? If Inquisition ends up being "moddable" then I pretend, I assume, I arrogantly believe that we'll end up with maybe 567 decent mods.

 

1) "maybe that's because... oh... because they wanted the thing to be that way?" No. Just no. There are things that mods change that are objectively better than the original game. Now, I do realise you were referring to the nude models(which you can't get your mind off apparently, despite them being less than 1% of mods), which I understand. But when a game deals with rape(city elf origin), murder of children, and you know, sex itself, I can't see that being a problem. Anyway, I don't use those mods so don't even think of painting me as one of your strawman "young frustrated males"

 

 

Hummm, I didn't paint you specifically as such. I was generalizing (obviousness meter wasn't working?). Don't pretend that I was even remotely suggesting so because you're pumped up for some reason, calm down a bit. If you feel pointed at for some reason by my "strawman accusation" then go out for a moment and take a breath of fresh air. With this said, however, there are existing young males whom will be frustrated strawmen when they'll realize that if Inquisition essentially cannot be modded that they won't have their already-imagined "extended sex scene with 'x' character".

 

2) This entire point went nowhere and had no relevance to the conversation. If you're trying to suggest that the reason DA:O had some glaring problems was because they didn't have the resources to finish it? Fine, I accept that. That doesn't mean that every mod is a waifu mod though.

 

 

In my second point I was trying to say (and wasn't clear enough, I admit it) that there's obviously other reasons than modded nudity for EA and/or BioWare to potentially refrain Inquisition from being moddable, that they'd go all their way to stop the game from being mods-friendly, or receiving a proper editor. Those reasons have to be related to money (which I'm certain is probably the primary reason), and if not the case most likely pride of their engine (that's on EA Digital Illusions, not BioWare). Because there's no other reasons if those are removed (money, pride or fear that nudity coming from mods would affect either the image of the game or the "moral perception" of the creators of the engine).

 

Which is why in my original post I offered this link: http://gamerant.com/...-modding-tools/ (because it's related to modding for, and the Frostbite engine), that's where you can see a quote from "that guy from EA" that basically commented on the potential mods community saying that "we" (anyone?) having too much in common with cretins to even start to comprehend the oh so magnificent complexity of the Frostbite engine, perish the thought let alone actually make mods for a game powered by its divine essence. If that wasn't clear enough we're probably talking about pride at that point. It was, and still is relevant to this discussion, it means that with a mentality like that (pride alone) we'll not have a proper editor tool to mod for Inquisition (that's not including other reasons such as money).

 

3) So you're saying the shameful, godawful, corrupted, broken, immoral and genuinely wrong gaming journalism sites like Kotaku are a good reason to limit player moddability entirely? That is a terrible opinion, and you know it.

 

 

Well no, not just Kotaku, but I remember the "scandal" that Fox created after they were shocked (and wanted to create shock out of nowhere) because they thought that they saw a side nipple shot of Liara during the romance scene in the original Mass Effect. Why is it that we never saw "fitting" full frontal nudity in ME2 and ME3 then? The engine? Pride? Money? Or a bit of "let's not risk that scandal again" back thought? We'll never know for sure. But what I know is that mainstream media can create a story out of nothing to justify their pay check. It doesn't mean that it will happen with Inquisition (it won't anyway because as far as I know Inquisition isn't rated M by ESRB with "strong sexual content" like The Wticher 2 is, speaking of which, that one was ignored by Fox was it?).

 

Besides, yes, it was my point, glad you got it. It might be a "terrible opinion" in YOUR... well, in your opinion. It's my opinion nonetheless. If you find it terrible even if you think that "I know it" (of course I do) then there's nothing I can do about it. I do not pretend to know that BioWare (or EA) is "afraid" of creating fitting, well-crafted mature/adult content for one or two scenes, in fact I'm certain that if the scene(s) would feel more "plausible" or genuine that way they'd do it. But there's potential for stress knowing that if they allow Inquisition to be modded that the inevitable might happen (not will, might) which would be another scandal about "unacceptable nudity in video games", you know, and outraged parents claiming "and what about the poor kids watching that against their will!?". Yeah it's a terrible opinion but it could happen and no company want to have to write down boring public relation apologies for something they think wasn't wrong to do in the first place.

 

So yeah, nudity could potentially provoke a similar situation and would convince Digital Illusions to have complete control over their engine, making sure that no public editor even becomes available or simply would never be made to start with.

 

Anyway, I think that my points are better detailed in this reply now.

[CIA]

@Realmz Yes this is true but like I said you can just download an external application like BOSS or Mod Organizer and it will fix it for you. No biggie,especially with a Wrye Patch. There are also conflict detectors and lots of other tools and compatibility patches, but I guess it would be hard for someone beginning to start modding.

@Lyrandori
I guess our main argument stemmed from the fact that you said there would be a minority of decent mods and a majority of silly nude waifu mods, when in most modding communities which I am a part of it is not the case and it gives people a bad name even when you've worked hard to create/help create mods.

Right, I think I get your point about not wanting to download game fixing patches, I rather meant mods like those are proof that mods CAN objectively improve the game.

"Let me rephrase it then, can I? If Inquisition ends up being "moddable" then I pretend, I assume, I arrogantly believe that we'll end up with maybe 567 decent mods."

Hmm maybe, Origins has over 2000 mods though, and I struggle to think how 1500 of them are smut. Lol.

@Strawmen stuff Alright, I just thought since I'd already taken a stance against it you were referring to people like myself. Sorry for being a hothead

You are correct about the EA and their Pride demons, I think modding has shown that users can often surpass devs(given ample free time which devs don't have obviously) but Frostbite is complex.

As for the third paragraph, well the 'terrible opinion' was more in reference to fearing clickbait sites like Kotaku or non-gaming sites that want to target video games as destroying youth. So I'll grant you that, it COULD happen. I don't think Bioware lost sales because of it, right? And I think CDPR just don't give a f**k haha, based Poles.

I see your point though. It's a shame, really when there are so many 'PC' mods out there that genuinely improve the experience.

[Grimsteele]

I know this is an old post, but I'm wondering if anyone has found a way to switch out or add skill "trees" to your character? I for one, never understood why in the hell, a rogue couldn't wield a dagger and (small) shield and a warrior didn't know the simple mechanics of a bow. These class/item restrictions are lame, the mod enabling them to be slightly modified in DA2 saved the game and it's replay value for me.

 

*shrugs*

 

If the stupid The Sims games can be modded, why not every other EA backed game? I miss Bioware working with TSR/WOTC, mainly because Neverwinter Online is utter MMORPG garbage...

 

*double shrug* 

[mysticnox]

I find it funny when people say there won't be mods. I learned long ago to never underestimate the fans. There are plenty of games everyone thought were unmoddable that turned out otherwise. The devs aren't the only ones that know how to code. Give it time. All the things we're complaining about will be fixed eventually. If not by EQ/Bioware, then by the fans. 

[Jallard]

LOL what? You only consider a game worth buying if you can mod it? Then you probably shouldn't buy DAI, but we all know you will anyway.

 

 

I have it, but I didn't buy it. It was offered to me for free for screwing up my account. 

[Jallard]

I completely disagree.

What constitutes "properly playable" will differ from player to player.

For example, Skyrim's UI was widely disliked, and millions of players (literally millions) have downloaded the SkyUI mod.

But I didn't. I didn't think the Skyrim UI needed modding. I wanted to put VATS in it, but given Skyrim's mechanics I found thw default UI perfectly acceptable.

If BethSoft had put the supposedly improved UI in the game initially, maybe I would have wanted to mod it.

No, that a game has lots of mods downloaded tells us about the diversity of the player-base, not the competence of the developers.

 

The very first day Skyrim came out and I installed it, I also installed four mods that were already available on Nexus. Consequently, I have never played a vanilla game of Skyrim, and I have well over 250 hours of play time in the game--as well as roughly over 60 some mods installed. And, I still play it, along with Fallout 3, New Vegas, DAO, DA2 and the Mass Effect Trilogy. And, all are modded.

[shubnabub]

I agree. Because it does not matter how good modders are at manipulating existing resources, retexturing textures, changing mechanics etc. and even building new resources, things like proper lore-based story content and voice acting will always be lacking severely.
 
[edit]
I will also add that for Skyrim, the extensive modding was done from a NEED to make the game properly playable.
If the developer spends the time needed to polish the game in the first place, modding will not be such a big thing. So in a sense, a game with thousands of mods reflects badly on the developer.

Horse ****.

[Shapeshifter777]

I find it funny when people say there won't be mods. I learned long ago to never underestimate the fans. There are plenty of games everyone thought were unmoddable that turned out otherwise. The devs aren't the only ones that know how to code. Give it time. All the things we're complaining about will be fixed eventually. If not by EQ/Bioware, then by the fans. 

 

Boy you are in for some hard core disappointment then.  It's not a matter of "knowing how to code", it's a matter of being able to 1.) decrypt an encrypted file which uses the most draconian encrypting I have EVER seen for a game.  NSA would be jealous.  2.) Modify existing code (knowing where and what to change) and then re-encrypting it using the same algorithm used by the developers, which they won't share with us.

 

 This is coming from a modder of 10 years who has been modding since Dungeon Siege II, Diablo II all the way up through Skyrim, Halo Reach and I even discovered my own secret way to mod Diablo III -- and a lot more games!  This is coming from an experienced modder who has had time to sit down and try and decode and decrypt Inquisition's files.  You are in for some major disappointment but keep telling yourself "oh, they'll figure it out."

[James11389]

@ CIAand @Lyrandori you're both too funny  ,  Arguing over something so trivial a thing as modding. You’re both right and wrong at the same time, getting so frustrated and bent out of shape because someone disagrees with you. Such thinking is of course a natural part of human interaction but is also one of many main driving forces behind violent conflict between humans. Now I’m not saying that either of you would or wouldn’t get violent, but humans (and yes games) have, some have gone so far as to murder others over such small matters of disagreement. One such example I can think of is a few years back a mother told her teen son to stop playing video games so much and do something else sometimes, he took her opinion about his gaming habits to the extreme and killed her; only after the neighbors complained about a funny smell did police find her body covered only with a bed sheet in the living room where her son had killed her and left her.

 

Now I realize I’ve taken this to somewhat of an extreme, but chill out and relax a bit, stress and anger are the real enemy’s here. Learn to agree to disagree, you’ll feel much better.

 

Cheers          

[MrHyde]

Why again isn't Bioware allowing for modding?  Have they ever come out with an official statement on the matter?

 

Modding is a wonderful addition to games like Dragon Age, Skyrim, Fallout, XCOM, and so forth.  It adapts and tweaks great games and allows for them to have far greater replayability.  How is this a bad thing?  It won't lead to a loss of revenue with DLC's; that's CONTENT, which modders generally aren't after (aside from different armors and weapon skins/gears).  You want to add more quests, more lands, more stuff; Bioware can certainly do that.  Modders are there to give these bland armors a facelift, give my dwarf a proper mohawk, allow me to run around with dual-wield candy canes for Christmas, and lots of other "fluffy" things.

 

If Bioware really isn't going to allow modding to take place, I'll have most likely bought my last Bioware game.  I still play DA:O and Skyrim, and it's only because I can mod them into new forms I've never played with.

[SpiritWolf448]

Why again isn't Bioware allowing for modding?  Have they ever come out with an official statement on the matter?

 

I do not know if anything official has been said, but I think the matter simply revolves around business decisions. See, while some of the Bio staff would be okay with modding (but not all), the main problem is EA. EA needs to please their stockholders/investors first and foremost. And exactly those tend to see mods as direct competition for DLCs. Imagine having a moddable game and not being able to sell your cheaply made weapon and armour reskin DLCs for 10 bucks a pop anymore. To the average Wall Street warrior, that is a horror scenario.

 

Plus, allowing modding in games that have a multiplayer component also opens the doors for unwelcome changes in that particular part of the game. (Which could be circumvented by separating the MP part from the SP part, for example. Just don't know if Frostbite would be able to have separte .exes, really. But I guess it could.)

One could argue that DAI (as well as ME3) did not really need MP, but it was EAs decision to include it (partialy to be able to say "Hey, we have MP." and in all likelyhood partially because it opens an additional market for cheaply produced DLC).

 

 

Mind you, all of this is just guessing/speculation/extrapolation on my part. So take it with a grain of salt.