351 réponses à ce sujet

[Mr.House]

I'm not sure what else people expect Hawke to have done about Corypheus. The seals were failing anyway. Hawke did their best to kill him, and believes that they succeeded.

 

It's blindingly obvious to us that he jumped bodies, but what reason does Hawke have to think that's even possible? We only know that type of magic exists because we learned in DAO that it's how Archdemons work. Hawke lacks our metaknowledge of the system.

Kill the surviving Warden. Done. They where acting extremely weird and Hawke was just lolokgo. Hawke is to blame for Cory's release. Hawke can be held responsible for Corys actions because it's Hawkes fault Cory is running around  now.

[Mihura]

The problem with Hawke is that he is portraid in the game as someone who achieves his/her goal by simply killing everyone that stand in his way (to put it simply). He is also portraid as a person that simply deals with the different threats b/c he has no other choice than do it without ending up dead or making it worse for him (e.g. the Qunari during act 2, the Mage/Templar incident in act 3). He is portraid as a lazy person that instead of doing something about it (during the years between the acts), he waits it to simply fall to him 'til he has no other way. In act 2, Hawke kills the Arishok (in one outcome that is). That doesn't necessarily make him--as some would call him-- "ineffectual". But it's the fact that he saves Kirkwall by simply killing many Qunari by himself that makes it a bit unbelievable.

 

That was not the impression I (and the majority of people I would bet) got from the marketing and BW was giving us when they introduced Hawke and his "rise to power". A rise to power is about building connections you can rely on. A rise to power is about politics. Most of the people Hawke interacts with could in fact help him save the city. The smugglers or mercenaries, Vanard's forces (if he has any) or the elves of the alienage, etc. That's what DAII should've been about, in my opinion. Story changing. How did Hawke rise to power? Who did he ally with that helped him? Who were his allies outside of the companions that he could call on when he needed them? Not through what important person(s) he killed to achieve it.

 

He's not proactive, and that's the major problem I have with him. A shortsighted character that has the inability to look forward and anticipate the consequences of his actions. Sure, you could call him a survivor - that's cool, if you want to believe that. But he can hardly take credit for being "the person who changed Thedas". In fact, I think Aveline said it best; "you stumbled into being Champion."

 

The Corypheus incident can't be blamed on Hawke, since our metaknowledge about the whole situation is what makes us doubt Cory is dead. However, letting Tallis go in Mark of the Assassin just further portrays Hawke as the idiot he / she is.

 

So while I might loathe Hawke, I have no sort of 'vendetta' against him. If Hawke shows up and actually does something proactive for once or something similar, then I won't have any problem with him. 

 

I do not disagree with this but I blame it more on the marketing than on Hawke itself, not every person has a political mind or can anticipate this or that situation and sometimes people do **** up really bad and a lot. The only thing that I find kinda unbelievable is how they survive for so long, it is like they had a lot of luck but than again Hawke gets punished for their mistake and heavily too, the murder of their mother is one. Anders situations is other. They are not pro-active, they let things happen than react.

[Paul E Dangerously]

Kill the surviving Warden. Done. They where acting extremely weird and Hawke was just lolokgo. Hawke is to blame for Cory's release. Hawke can be held responsible for Corys actions because it's Hawkes fault Cory is running around  now.

 

This assumes that surviving Warden is the only one Corypheus can jump to. Anyone who has the taint may be vulnerable - which could be Anders, Bethany, or Carver depending on your choices. Not to mention, your PC and party members pretty much bathed in Darkspawn blood through that little jaunt in the Deep Roads.

[Mr.House]

This assumes that surviving Warden is the only one Corypheus can jump to. Anyone who has the taint may be vulnerable - which could be Anders, Bethany, or Carver depending on your choices. Not to mention, your PC and party members pretty much bathed in Darkspawn blood through that little jaunt in the Deep Roads.

Killing Anders would in fact be a good thing.

 

Not to mention Hawke killed people for less during the game.

[KaiserShep]

Kill the surviving Warden. Done. They where acting extremely weird and Hawke was just lolokgo. Hawke is to blame for Cory's release. Hawke can be held responsible for Corys actions because it's Hawkes fault Cory is running around now.

All of the Wardens were acting weird. The only one that never has a freak out is Warden sibling. Hawke can't hear the ominous score or see Corypheus' creepy smile, nor is he/she blessed with meta- knowledge.

Anyway, none of this matters unless something actually becomes of Corypheus in the future, again, assuming that Corypheus is truly alive. I'm not really concerned about obvious this and obvious that. Corypheus has to come back and actually do something, like that demon that the Warden can set loose in the Asunder quest.

[Mr.House]

All of the Wardens were acting weird. The only one that never has a freak out is Warden sibling. Hawke can't hear the ominous score or see Corypheus' creepy smile, nor is he/she blessed with meta- knowledge.

Anyway, none of this matters unless something actually becomes of Corypheus in the future, again, assuming that Corypheus is truly alive. I'm not really concerned about obvious this and obvious that. Corypheus has to come back and actually do something, like that demon that the Warden can set loose in the Asunder quest.

The fact that Legacy is now canon, the surviving warden from Legacy never made contact with the wardens like they said they would,  Corys possible survival is in the official timeline, we are attacking the wardens for a reason and the wardens are fearing possible mind control in Last Flight, put this with the leak achievement that is most likely true. Cory is back and he is causing chaos. That is Hawkes fault for creating this situation.

[Marshal Moriarty]

Note also that until we see DAI, we won't know the long term consequences of actions like putting Bhelan on the throne of Orzammar (as many do), even though he is a despot of the highest order. It also remains to be seen what the long term effects of performing the Dark Ritual with Morrigan were (again, as many people do, simply to save their Warden's skin). And what about killing Flemeth on Morrigan's say so (again, something which polls suggest most people do, for the loot and EXP if nothing else!) If Flemeth turns to be instrumental in helping save the world in DA:I, then the world is going to owe Hawke a pretty big thank you for correcting the Warden's blunder.

 

I'd like to see how many people admit they werw wrong with these choices, if any of them do end up causing disaster in DA:I. Or will they do what I suspect they'll do - quietly go back to the Dragon Age Keep, create a world state where they didn't make these mistakes and then claim they always knew that those other choices were wrong.

 

Judging either character on what happens in the future is pointless. As Varric's story makes clear, Hawke made the decisions he thought was best, and they stand by them. Cassandra wasn't there, so she doesn't know what the pressures were or the realities were. Good, bad or otherwise, their decisions and motives are now on record, and if people don't like it, then that's just tough - because they did all they could, and frankly more than anyone had a right to expect them to. Kirkwall heaps a lot of injustice on Hawke's shoulders, with the fate of his/her siblings and mother etc. It would have served some people in the city right if Hawke had just said 'Sod the lot of you' and left them to burn in any of the dozens and dozerns of deadly crises that arise. But instead, Hawke helps out - what more did people want?!

[Killdren88]

If Cory and the red lyruim are involve,d then yes. Hawke is responsible for that. You can maybe argue that Hawke didn't know the effect the red lyruim would have but there's no excuse for Cory.

 

The Wardens were planning on releasing him to either kill or control him anyway. You can't blame Hawke for that.

[KaiserShep]

The Wardens were planning on releasing him to either kill or control him anyway. You can't blame Hawke for that.

Pretty much. It would be Hawke's fault for doing nothing too. There's no way to win.

[Drasanil]

 

Its just easier to blame the player character, than the failings of the story that Bioware choose to tell with that character. How a lot of events could have being easily nipped in the bud by Hawke, if only the developers had allowed you to have a choice in the matter.

 

Well Bioware's obnoxious marketing and over-hype of Hawke's rise to power didn't exactly do them any favours when it came time to actually experience what their finished product was like. 

 

That said, I didn't go in with particularly high expectations or hopes for Hawke, but the game still somehow managed to disappoint. I'm not normally one for killing NPC/PCs willy nilly (only DAO character that I dislike and can come up with a decent reason to follow through on it and kill is Wynne), but yes Bioware's failure in DA2 pushed me over from being apathetic about Hawke to actively disliking her. 

 

And I make no qualms about the fact part of the reason I want to kill her is because she is in essence an avatar of the entire general badness that was DA2. The other reason is her just flat out being an idiot. 

 

 

Really, the most Hawke is guilty of is being written like a moron. Can you really hate a character because they're forced to carry the Idiot Ball because the game shipped a year or so too early and he's the only thing holding the plot (such as it is) together?

 

 

I agree you should always make a few allowances for plot mandated idiots balls. But, at what point do you go from being forced to carry the Idiot Ball, to simply being an an idiot who happens to carry a ball? I think Hawke managed to cross over into the latter category and that is good enough reason to hate her in my books. 

[Mr.House]

The Wardens were planning on releasing him to either kill or control him anyway. You can't blame Hawke for that.

Hawke failed to kill him so yes you can blame her.

[Killdren88]

So what I'm getting from you all..Regardless of Hawke trying to his/her best. They still must die for it? That's like saying you failed to complete a task, but failed to do it but tried your best. Do you deserve death?

[Mr.House]

So what I'm getting from you all..Regardless of Hawke trying to his/her best. They still must die for it? That's like saying you failed to complete a task, but failed to do it but tried your best. Do you deserve death?

I like Hawke, but  Hawke should redeem herself for her actions, that does not mean she has to die. There's many ways to redeem yourself.

[Drasanil]

So what I'm getting from you all..Regardless of Hawke trying to his/her best. They still must die for it? That's like saying you failed to complete a task, but failed to do it but tried your best. Do you deserve death?

 

If you're gross negligence and incompetence lead to the deaths of thousands of people....

[wicked cool]

Any chance Hawke and warden are in the game but end up like Duncan ?

[WildOrchid]

The Wardens were planning on releasing him to either kill or control him anyway. You can't blame Hawke for that.

 

 

Even if Flemeth sneezed, it would be Hawke's fault.

 

 

They blame Hawke for everything, nothing new here.

[Teddie Sage]

If you're gross negligence and incompetence lead to the deaths of thousands of people....

Shepard did worse with Arrival DLC, did you want to kill him/her for what he did to the Batarians? I know I didn't.

[WildOrchid]

Shepard did worse with Arrival DLC, did you want to kill him/her for what he did to the Batarians? I know I didn't.

 

Pshhhhh, nobody hates Shepard for that.

[ReadingRambo220]

I watched the trailer several times and didnt see Hawke. I feel like a derp. Can someone explain where she/he is?

[Teddie Sage]

Pshhhhh, nobody hates Shepard for that.

Yeah, that's why I said that. There are plenty of gamers who played both franchises and praise Shepard as a character even with all his flaws, then they bash Hawke because he did a lot of those things on smaller scales. *slow claps*

[Killdren88]

People hate DA2 So much they want anything having to do with it dead. Crushed and forgotten.

[Teddie Sage]

I watched the trailer several times and didnt see Hawke. I feel like a derp. Can someone explain where she/he is?

Near the end, female Hawke with a blood smear on her face. She's next to a grey warden, they're both in the Fade apparently fighting a demon.

[Teddie Sage]

For me Dragon Age II is a great game, besides what others think. I've played through at least three times and I wouldn't mind doing a fourth playthrough while waiting for Inquisition. I love each of my Hawkes.

[WildOrchid]

People hate DA2 So much they want anything having to do with it dead. Crushed and forgotten.

 

Not all of them, thankfully.

I loved DA2 even with it's flaws and i'll play it again in a heartbeat.

[Killdren88]

Not all of them, thankfully.
I loved DA2 even with it's flaws and i'll play it again in a heartbeat.

Nothing compared to Origins. But I liked it for what it was.