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Help needed: I played DA2 first, and now I'm really struggling with combat


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#1
Alan Drifter13

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Hi everyone,

 

I finished DA2 a few months ago, and got DA:O (ultimate edition) after reading that it was better, and that there was more strategy involved in the combat. After a week playing it, I'm very disappointed with the combat system. While enemies don't randomly spawn behind your team (I agree this is the main flaw in DA2 combats), everything else in the combat system seems worse. I'm especially struggling with 2 things:

 

1) I play a two-daggers melee rogue, and this character seems way weaker than it was in DA2 .

2) There are fewer tactic slots, which means I have to control the other characters much more. Not only does this ruin the immersion, but it also makes combats much slower.

 

So, what I'm asking is:

 

1) Is there a good guide on how to configure your companions' tactics so you don't have to control them so much? Considering the main character is a two weapons rogue.

 

2)  I'm going with a warrior (I know Alistair is the best tank, but I hate him, so I welcome good guides to play Oghren or Sten as efficient tanks), a mage and a rogue as companions. However, it looks like Leliana is completely useless (is this just me? Any tips about this? Or are archers in this game just rubbish?) and Zevran is not too good (he's similar to my character, but worse), so I'm considering playing the rest of the game with Morrigan and Whynne in the team every time, since mages seem really overpowered in this game. Will this make combats easier? Also, how about the dog? Is he a good alternative? I definitely like him better than all the warriors in this game (although I didn't meet Shale yet).

 

3) I specialized as a ranger because I like having a second tank. Any guide on how to use this pets? I couldn't find a way to tell them what to do, so I guess I just can't? Also, the bear seems to be the best by far, but maybe I'm missing something.

 

4) Any useful guides on how to use traps and poisons? Bombs seem pretty straight forward, but I don't know which traps/poisons are the best for each type of enemy. And since we are on it, how about those protection balms? When should I use them?

 

Since this game is very old, I assume someone already answered all of these questions, but if I just google the stuff I get all kind of strategies, and I don't know which ones are good. So, if anyone here could tell me where the good guides are, I'll appreciate it a lot. I'm getting my ass kicked, quite often, in the "normal" difficulty, and I would like to remedy that.

 

 


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#2
TheMadHarridan

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I'm not a combat master like some people on here, but I'll be glad to tell you how I handle things. A dual-wielding rogue is actually my favorite build in DAO, and I favor it over the dual-wield rogue in DA2. One of the coolest things about the DAO dual-wielder is that you don't have to use two daggers. You can actually use a one-handed sword and a dagger from the beginning of the game (giving you more damage than just two daggers), and if you upgrade the dual-wield tree to "Dual Mastery" (I think that's what it's called), you can actually wield two one-handed swords, thereby completely eliminating the need for daggers and greatly increasing your damage. Wielding two big swords (like Starfang and Blightblood or Duncan's sword and Maric's sword) make your possible damage higher than pretty much anyone else's.

 

1) For your companions' tactics, I usually set them at "aggressive" or "ranged" depending on their build, then set them as either "defender" (for tanks), "scrapper" (for damage dealers) or "archer." When it comes to mages, it depends. I usually set Wynne to "healer" and Morrigan usually as "damager" or "debilitator." After that, I see what the game sets for their tactics, and then alter them if I don't like them. I hate micro-managing, and most of the time, if I do these steps, I don't have to take control of the companions, unless I want them to do something very specific (like "revival" for Wynne).

 

2) Alistair is definitely your best tank, but you can make Sten, Oghren, or Shale tanks as well. Just set your tank's tactics to "defender." Two-handed weapon users like Oghren and Sten usually have two sustained modes that they can use to alter their fighting style: "Indomitable" is usually used by defenders, and "Powerful Swings" is used by scrappers. If you read the description of each ability, you'll see why. Make sure if you use one of them as a tank that you give them some constitution points, as they often don't start with the best constitution stats for tanking (particularly Sten because you get him so early).

 

If you are playing on the PC, I would suggest using the Character Respec mod to completely respec Leliana and Zevran, as their defaults often aren't the greatest. Leliana is a good archer (set her to "ranged" and "archer"), but Zevran's default specifications kind of suck, in my opinion. But since you are playing a rogue, if you don't bring one of them along, you can unlock doors/chests and spring traps yourself.

 

Wynne is an excellent healer, and I very rarely die when she's in my party. I rarely die anyway, but she makes it much better, and she keeps the other companions alive longer. Morrigan can do a great deal of damage, but it depends on what spells you give her and how you set up her tactics. I would suggest making sure you get "Crushing Prison" with her, as that spell is a killer.

 

Dog is actually a pretty good companion, particularly his "overwhelm" ability, which is where he can knock people down and shred them to ribbons. If you are on the PC, I'd recommend the Extra Dog Slot mod, which gives you the ability to have Dog as an extra party member at all times (he fills up the slot a ranger uses for their wolf, bear, spider).

 

Shale is a pretty awesome companion. She actually has four modes she can use: scrapper, defender, ranged, and a support mode (fourth line on her tree). Plus, I adore her personality.

 

3) The Ranger spec is quite nice, and each of the pets have their own strengths/weaknesses. They are all better once you max out the tree because they all become "corrupted" versions of themselves. As for using them, I honestly just summon the best one for the situation and let them do their thing. I would suggest summoning each of them at some point when you're not in combat, take control of them, and then see what talents they have. That will help you determine when the best time is to use each.

 

4) As for poisons, I usually only use them on bosses. The cool thing is that you can double up on poisons. I took out the Broodmother yesterday and had four different poisons on my weapons at the same time. She went down fairly quickly. Each poison will tell you what kind of damage they do, and they will also tell you if they do mild, moderate, or potent damage. Choose the one appropriate for the situation.

 

I do not use traps. I hate them, so I can't really advise you there.

 

As for the balms, you have to decide when to use them based on the situation. Like for the High Dragon "Andraste," use the warmth balms, as she does fire damage. For the "Archdemon," use spirit balms, because he does a lot of spirit damage (most darkspawn do spirit damage). I use the nature balms in the Brecilian Forest if things get hairy. I have never used the ice or grounding balms, because I've never needed them. There just aren't a lot of big bads that do ice or electricity damage. Swift salves are great for bosses or really large groups of enemies because they greatly speed up your movement, so you can do more damage faster. I don't use Rock salves because I don't like how slow it makes you, and I've never really used the Incense of Awareness.

 

I hope that helps!


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#3
cJohnOne

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DW Rogues in DA2 are like ginsu knives cutting through everything.  But once you're use to DW rogues in DAO you should like them too.  DW rogues in DAO do backstab damage so I get coup de grace so I get the damage from attacking a stunned opponent from the front. I don't remember but if you choose to go with knives you should increase dexterity but if you go with sword and dagger you increase mostly strength and enough dexterity for talents.

 

I think archery is underpowered in DAO but  I think it's fun.  I think a 50 dex. 50 cunning works fine.

 

I think the next best tank after Alistair is Shale but she's a constitution tank.  She leaves you in the deep roads if you side with Branka but I've never done that with her, ha ha.

 

I love Ranger but not sure how they tank.


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#4
luna1124

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I have set traps outside doors and at the point in Redcliffe walking corpse battle where they come down the hill. Some traps work really well, like grease (also can be set on fire by a bomb or mage) to make the enemy slip and fall. Just remember your party will also slip and fall (and if on fire, have plenty of warmth balms to take) :P

I also don't use incense of awareness but have used rock salve. It does slow you down, but is great protection.


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#5
mousestalker

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If you do use Shale as your tank (And why wouldn't you? She is that awesome), fill out her 'Stoneheart' tree ASAP and adjust her tactics to use the various taunts that makes available.

 

Optionally, you may want to consider using Zevran, Dog and Morrigan as your companions. The idea with that group is to kill things very very quickly. Set everyone to target mages first if you do that.


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#6
Blazomancer

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Hah.... the speed at which dual wielder Hawke moves those arms, especially when Hasted, one would think he/she is a serious candidate for tennis elbow.

You can find some very useful info in the stickied thread in the Classes and Builds section of the forum. The wikia can also be helpful for finding out about things like elemental resistances and pretty much anything dragon age.

Regarding the number of available tactics slot, IKR. If you are in the PC, you have mods at your disposal though to solve that.
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#7
luna1124

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Mana-Clash!!! Best spell against pesky enemy mages!!!


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#8
Pateu

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Well, here's some brotips.

 

As a rogue, get Momentum, stay behind enemies and backstab away. You have incredible damage when you attack that fast and always crit.

 

For mages, rush Mana Clash ( kills most mages instantly ) and then Haste. I level up magic to 34 for those, then pump Willpower.


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#9
Elhanan

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1 - Tactics: I tend to place personal defense at the top, any healing next, followed by attacks generally using non-AoE preferences as a way to prioritize with a standard Enemy > Nearest Visible > Attack at the bottom; followed by buff deactivations if desired.

2 - 2H was enjoyable for me as a PC and with Followers; Sunder talents being key to help speed attacks. For Leliana, one can improve her STR to improve armor choices; helps with durability, and I almost always use her as an Archer.

3 - Not a fan of Ranger; never used.

4 - Traps and poisons were rarely used; mostly for specific quests, if at all.

While combat is perhaps not as immersive as DA2, I still enjoyed the tactical pace DAO provided.
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#10
Alan Drifter13

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Thanks everyone (especially TheMadHarridan for that extensive guide). I'm playing on XBOX so no mods, but I have a lot to start with here. Also, I think I'll go to meet Shale as soon as possible, it looks like she will be my favorite tank.



#11
Pateu

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Her DLC also gives you the best helmet in the game, which gives +2 all stats.



#12
Lulupab

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DW Rogues in DA2 are like ginsu knives cutting through everything. But once you're use to DW rogues in DAO you should like them too. DW rogues in DAO do backstab damage so I get coup de grace so I get the damage from attacking a stunned opponent from the front. I don't remember but if you choose to go with knives you should increase dexterity but if you go with sword and dagger you increase mostly strength and enough dexterity for talents.

I think archery is underpowered in DAO but I think it's fun. I think a 50 dex. 50 cunning works fine.

I think the next best tank after Alistair is Shale but she's a constitution tank. She leaves you in the deep roads if you side with Branka but I've never done that with her, ha ha.

I love Ranger but not sure how they tank.

I'd like to point out that there is a talent which makes rouges use cunning as strength modifier (cunning will increase your damage done instead of strength) and since cunning is more useful for rogues, getting this talent and getting cunning points is better than getting strength on sword rogues.

#13
Sidney

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1. There are fewer slots. It sucks but more will open as you level up. My tactics will always be health < 25% heal, and the last item is Attack > Nearest Visible. Means someone is always doing something. In between I just layer up their powers but any mage cannot use AOE (cones, fireballs, inferno) as a tactic because they will kill you with it. If you want to run mages on scripts be sure to get buff/debuff and single target spells.

 

2. Hate Sten and Oghren, suck it up and use Allistair.

 

3. Pets operate just like the dog in Da2. They make a massive difference in combat but they do run on full auto pilot, oh and they consume stamina which sucks.

 

4. I never use poisons or traps because they aren't needed. Poison in particular doesn't have nearly the duration as DA2 so you need to make a lot of it to be useful.

 

The combat is slow and unresponsive as you have likely figured out. The plodding nature means a lot of things you want to do won't work. The good thing is that you are basically fighting room to room to room in the game so you are getting much smaller sets of bad guys in mostly constricted area other than a few zones

 

Your dual wielder is nowhere near as effective as DA2 so don't play him like that. DAO mages are your killing machines with rogues and warriors in support, in DA2 rogues are the killing power with mages and warriors in support. Adjust to that.

 

Combat can be quite difficult when you are under level 10 especially if you get a foe like wolves who can knock you down.  The most important thing to recall is that unlike DA2 potions aren't on cooldown so you can make and buy a crap ton of them and spam the hades out of them if you need to.


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#14
Magdalena11

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Madharridan's advice is pretty spot on.  Keep an eye on the tactics your companions have preset for various roles as a clue to how to build each role, but bear in mind that most players eventually wind up tweaking them pretty heavily.  DAO combat is a lot different for rogues, primarily because you don't see the teleporting backstab.  This isn't all bad, since backstab is now an automatic bonus that costs no stamina to perform and can be used in combination with actual skills.  Any attack from the shaded part of the ground circle will do the backstab bonus, including something like flurry.  Using a DWR requires more active participation in combat, planning where to move, how to get there (stealth mid combat at higher levels is pretty cool), and how to use your dex to your advantage.

 

I use a lot of poisons and grenades, because as MH pointed out, they stack, cost little, and soften up enemy groups while I'm still out of melee range.  I tend to circle around the back of an all-melee enemy and backstab and tear down foes one by one as the tank draws the mob.  I can usually pick off 2 mooks before Alistair gets done taunting.  On hard difficulty my dual-wielder does at least half the party's damage and kills, and the "greatest damage dealt" is exceeded only by the mages (can't beat 1000 point mana clashes) and 2H warriors.  I can usually take down 3 or 4 mooks before Oghren gets done with his first sweep.

 

Never had any luck playing a ranger.  The animal companions I've got never follow tactics and basically just stand there watching the fight until I order them to attack and which skill to use, etc.  If I'm going to have to control every move, I might as well specialize in something that will help, like assassin or bard.  Duelist is helpful, in the sense that pinpoint strikes guarantees a critical hit with every strike, but pinpoint is the last skill acquired in the chain.

 

If you're setting up mages, use caution with mana clash, depending on what difficulty you're playing on.  At normal or lower, it one-shots just about any enemy spellcaster and most demons (NOT desire demons.)  On hard or nightmare, most enemies' resistances make it a waste of time at higher levels.


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