Yeah I criticize because the dalish smug "last of the elvenhan." and flat ear remarks pissed me off.
I can't help it. I feel more empathy with CEs far more than dalish. The dalish can vanish from the setting and zero damns would be given from me. The CEs though? I'd probably stop playing
The worthwhile dalish should be assimilated into the CEs and the rest wiped from existence. Just like how Caeser in New Vegas handled tribes he assimilated into the Legion.
Yeah I criticize because the dalish smug "last of the elvenhan." and flat ear remarks pissed me off.
I can't help it. I feel more empathy with CEs far more than dalish. The dalish can vanish from the setting and zero damns would be given from me. The CEs though? I'd probably stop playing
But City Elves also use the term "flat ears." And Elvhenan was a nation, of course the city elves aren't part of it.
Yes this! I might be a little more trollish about it at times but this is exactly my position on the Dalish problem.
Fenris pretty much echoes my thoughts on the dalish at times.
Pretty much that bullied kid at school who decides to be patronizing and arrogant towards other bullied kids. ****** your ass is being bullied too. You don't exactly have a leg to stand on.
But City Elves also use the term "flat ears." And Elvhenan was a nation, of course the city elves aren't part of it.
They use it for the dalish?
Edit: read the wiki lol it seems they're equally patronizing. That fits.
Dalish elves seek to recover, inherit and preserve the knowledge and sacred treasures of the two fallen kingdoms. They lead nomadic lives, wandering throughout Thedas. Their clans date back to the ruling clans of the Dales and the Dalish themselves are their descendants.
The Dalish elves and city elves in particular have a strange and bitter relationship, dating from the splitting of the People after the fall of the Dales. Some Dalish view their city brethren suspiciously and with pity as "flat-ears,"[16] culturally human elves who are no different "than their shemlen masters."[18] To some, they are seen as having given up on and forgotten their culture, and the hope is to teach these elves their past when a new homeland is founded.[19] Not all Dalish share this view of the city elves, however.
On the other hand, some city elves see the Dalish as near-myths: strange and savage "wood elves"[20] living far from humans and preying upon the unwary;[21] and yet somehow noble, as well.[22] To others, the Dalish are seen as "savages", primitive elves who refuse to see the promise of the alienage, and live off the land in ways the average city elf could not.[23] Indeed, city elves who choose to leave or live beyond the Alienage are labeled "flat-ears" as well by their city kin[16], ironically similar to how some Dalish view the Andrastian elves, and subject to violence or resentment from other city elves.
And yet, for all this uncertainty, city and Dalish elves still interact positively now and then. For Alienage elves who seek to leave their home due to desperation, poverty or abuse, wandering Dalish clans are often seen as a sort of "last resort" haven. They are normally willing to take in a refugee from the cities and to largely refrain from attacking a city elf on the road[24], despite their uncertainty, and train them in the ways of their Creators and culture.[25] Similarly, Alienages may take in a Dalish elf who has broken with their clan voluntarily or involuntarily.[26]
Elven mages tend to be grouped to the Dalish mindset along with city elves.[27] This is particularly the case as they have turned not only their lives but their magic over to the human Chantry and Maker, and the Circle of Magi, with the Circles being implied to have played a role in the fall of the Dales. [28]
Didn't all elves come from there? Looking it up in the wiki it says
Elvhenan, meaning "place of our people" in the elven language, was the civilization of the elves, or elvhen, in the time when elves were reportedly still immortal and the dominant race on the surface of Thedas. Elvhenan covered most of Thedas; particularly Ferelden, Orlais, and lands west of Orlais.[2]
Just because some were enslaved and moved means they weren't as part of the country when elves were still immortal as the current dalish are? Saying we're the last of the elvhenan pretty much is denying the CEs ancestors originated from there. Cause the current dalish elves aren't anymore Elvehenan than they are considering that place was nuked a while ago.
Honestly it'd be hilarious if the dalish originated from the noble rich classes and the CEs the lower classes/slaves. It'd certainly put that superiority in a different light.
I sympathize more with the elves in general, because they don't have a homeland. Reminds me of the Quarians from Mass Effect.
More like the same 3 or 4 people that argue against each other in these threads from what I've seen. That's hardly most. I still remember 40 pages of Quarian and Geth debate being done by the same three people.
Probably because they guessed the ancient elves weren't as innocent as previously believed.
The worthwhile dalish should be assimilated into the CEs and the rest wiped from existence. Just like how Caeser in New Vegas handled tribes he assimilated into the Legion.
Yikes. Seriously destroying the Legion with a female PC was the only interaction I enjoyed with those sexist douchecanoes.
Nah I'd rather they just peacefully separate. No need to start none unnecessarily.
From the Masked Empire, it seems like the ancient elves were pretty much Proto - Tevinter
lol yeah I heard about that. Them and Orlais weren't that different.
They use it for the dalish?
Edit: read the wiki lol it seems they're equally patronizing. That fits.
Didn't all elves come from there? Looking it up in the wiki it says
Elvhenan, meaning "place of our people" in the elven language, was the civilization of the elves, or elvhen, in the time when elves were reportedly still immortal and the dominant race on the surface of Thedas. Elvhenan covered most of Thedas; particularly Ferelden, Orlais, and lands west of Orlais.[2]
Just because some were enslaved and moved means they weren't as part of the country when elves were still immortal as the current dalish are? Saying we're the last of the elvhenan pretty much is denying the CEs ancestors originated from there. Cause the current dalish elves aren't anymore Elvehenan than they are considering that place was nuked a while ago.
Honestly it'd be hilarious if the dalish originated from the noble rich classes and the CEs the lower classes/slaves. It'd certainly put that superiority in a different light.
Why does it matter who they use it on? They still use it to denote people they consider to be "insufficiently elven." They don't use it for the Dalish but many of them consider the Dalish to be savages and not being real elves either.
Yeah all elves did, at one point, come from the Elvhenan. But it was an Elven Empire. City Elves are citizens of Human empires and kingdoms. The nomadic Dalish clans are the last tiny shred of an elven nation. Although whatever social status existed in the Elvhenan was wiped out by 800 years of slavery in the Imperium. If anything, differences between the Dalish and City elves would have started in the Dales.
I'm admit to being among those who sympathize with the City Elves than with the Dalish. The Dalish talk of human oppression with every other breath. The City Elves live it.
And the fact that the City Elves are so oppressed suggests there is merit to the Dalish decision to live apart from humans.
I really don't understand the hate for the Dalish. Sure allot of them are very annoying but there are plenty of other groups that are worse then them and the city elves are far from perfect.
My Hawke just told the elves what she knew they wanted to hear. I followed the friendship path but you could tell that if you praised her or let her handle the situation at that moment it wasn't going to work at well because they don't trust her.
I wouldn't really call it throwing her under the bus...
You tell them what they want to hear.
Romances in a nutshell.
Why does it matter who they use it on? They still use it to denote people they consider to be "insufficiently elven." They don't use it for the Dalish but many of them consider the Dalish to be savages and not being real elves either.
Yeah all elves did, at one point, come from the Elvhenan. But it was an Elven Empire. City Elves are citizens of Human empires and kingdoms. The nomadic Dalish clans are the last tiny shred of an elven nation.
Because it's denying the CEs their elven heritage in a partonizing "you act too much like humans." way. As if they're the only judge on what makes an elf an elf.
They're still elves. And the Dalish clans probably have as much as common with the elvehenan lands as the CEs do considering the land was similar to freaking Orlais. What about dalish society reminds you of Orlais?
I really don't understand the hate for the Dalish. Sure allot of them are very annoying but there are plenty of other groups that are worse then them and the city elves are far from perfect.
Most of the hate directed at the Dalish seems mostly to come from one set of posters trying to get a rise out of another set of posters.
Honestly it'd be hilarious if the dalish originated from the noble rich classes and the CEs the lower classes/slaves. It'd certainly put that superiority in a different light.
That does seem to be roughly what the split was at the fall of the Dales.
The Nobility and their hangers on refused to submit and went nomadic. The peasant class, abandoned had no choice but to submit.
You tell them what they want to hear.
Romances in a nutshell.
My rivalmance with Merrill was all about telling her what she didn't want to hear.
My rivalmance with Merrill was all about telling her what she didn't want to hear.
Hawke: This is dumb and is going to get people killed.
Merrill:...That's so inconsiderate!
Hawke: We'll bang okay?
*and then they do*
Though I normally kill them off since I don't like Elves(I kill the ones in Origins as well) this is good news as far as I can tel.
So many times the excuse is they don't want to waste resources on content that many people might not see, but if this is all more than just wild speculation it seems BioWare might be taking a different approach this time around, and writing the story the way they want and if only a small fraction of players see something or get some cool side quests than so be it. That's a good thing.
I might actually keep the Dalish around the next time if they provide me with unique rewards.
That does seem to be roughly what the split was at the fall of the Dales.
The Nobility and their hangers on refused to submit and went nomadic. The peasant class, abandoned had no choice but to submit.
That makes a lot of sense. Aww 
Hawke: This is dumb and is going to get people killed.
Merrill:...That's so inconsiderate!
Hawke: We'll bang okay?
*and then they do*
I'd like to point out that it was Merrill who initiates. Hawke never really propositions her.
I'd like to point out that it was Merrill who initiates. Hawke never really propositions her.
It doesn't help that you pretty much hit one flirt that she shows zero reaction to (if male anyway not sure about fem Hawke) then all of a sudden she comes to your house busting the I love you card.
And I can't reject her then cause it's so sad how she crumbles. Even if the romance dialogue makes my ears bleed. >_>
I'd like to point out that it was Merrill who initiates. Hawke never really propositions her.
Yes I know but I found it funnier that way.
It doesn't help that you pretty much hit one flirt that she shows zero reaction to (if male anyway not sure about fem Hawke) then all of a sudden she comes to your house busting the I love you card.
And I can't reject her then cause it's so sad how she crumbles. Even if the romance dialogue makes my ears bleed. >_>
Merrill: You're the bestest most awesome person ever! I'm so glad you like me!
Hawke: Yes about that...
Merrill: I'm so glad I have someone who loves me!!! 
Hawke: Well you see...
Merrill: *humming merrily*
Hawke:...Yes of course 
It doesn't help that you pretty much hit one flirt that she shows zero reaction to (if male anyway not sure about fem Hawke) then all of a sudden she comes to your house busting the I love you card.
And I can't reject her then cause it's so sad how she crumbles. Even if the romance dialogue makes my ears bleed. >_>
I don't know, I actually thought Merrill's rivalmance was the best. I found it really sweet that despite the constant disagreements, Merrill still cared for Hawke.
Because it's denying the CEs their elven heritage in a partonizing "you act too much like humans." way. As if they're the only judge on what makes an elf an elf.
They're still elves. And the Dalish clans probably have as much as common with the elvehenan lands as the CEs do considering the land was similar to freaking Orlais. What about dalish society reminds you of Orlais?
So it's wrong if the Dalish do it to a City Elf but OK if the City Elves do it to other elves?
And saying "We are the last of the Elvhenan" still doesn't necessarily mean that. "Elvhen" are the people. "Elvhenan" is the nation.
So it's wrong if the Dalish do it to a City Elf but OK if the City Elves do it to other elves?
And saying "We are the last of the Elvhenan" still doesn't necessarily mean that. "Elvhen" are the people. "Elvhenan" is the nation.
Nope I said it was pretty equally patronizing earlier. Also the CEs deny the dalish are actual elves?
True but they don't have anymore of a claim to that than the CEs do. They don't share the culture, they don't share the land. The only thing they have is...the blood. And CEs share that.
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