494 réponses à ce sujet

[Eveangaline]

I can understand people wishing there was a city elf origin, I wish there was too, I also wish there was a human option that wasn't nobility or related to nobility and that our dwarves could have been merchants. But thems the breaks, we got dalish and they're going to be dalish whether we give them the tattoos or not and forcing the tattoos makes sense lorewise.

[n7stormrunner]

Yeah....still, the dream of a hardcore renegade Dalish elf is gone. It was a nice dream. Still, it could add to my Dalish Inquisitor's resentment of his culture, having to tattoo his face in order to be taken seriously. "I've done everything you've asked me to do, but unless I put some dumb writing on my face, I'm not an adult? Screw you!"

 

I was also taking a picture from Merril's book, and having him being taken from his clan to serve as apprentice in his current clan due to a lack of mages in the Lavallan clan. Course, if Bioware actually features your family in DA:I, that idea is up in smoke too. *sigh* Such are the risks of creating a character's background without actually playing the game. Bioware has driven me to this, though. Constant delays, almost no detailed info on the backgrounds until now...I had no choice. I had no choice!

 

I've also got another 'less-traditional' Dalish warrior who is going to have the most ornate tattoo possible, though. She's going to be a lot of fun. Very snarky. The idea of a Dalish with a good sense of humor is very funny to me, for some reason. They always seem so serious in previous games.

 

 

this why I never plan character except in the most basic sense. first character is going to be a snarky elf reaver, probably two handed weapon though a sword and shield one worked out well in DA: 2, but nothing more let the rest come as I play. no getting mad/upset/disappointed because I got ahead of mself.

 

plus a renegade dalish would probably find themselves a city elf in fairly short order look at merrill, first to outcast in a year. actual since she probably hide what she was doing for a while, probably less then that.

[BubbleDncr]

I'm glad the Dalish tattoos are mandatory this time around. In Origins, I was Dalish my first playthrough, and had no idea they were supposed to have tattoos. So I didn't give myself one, and then felt like I was breaking lore through the entire game, once I found out they were a thing. 

 

I just hope there's more tattoo patterns than in Origins. 

[LobselVith8]

Well I'm not a Dalish defender usually but I find it odd that people think Dalish pc=racist ******* drone when even in Origins you could be tolerant and question a key point of your history.*whether the March was unprovoked or not*

 

Plus most of them in Origins were alright.

 

in 2 I only liked Merril,Feynriel's mom and the Keeper though...

 

Some people just don't like the Dalish, and it's doubtful anything will change their minds. What's odd is how no one treats the human protagonist like that, but it's a double-standard. Mahariel is pretty much defined by the player, so there's a lot of agency with the main character. Most of the Dalish in Zathrian's camp were good people; there's apprehension simply because the Warden is an outsider, and outsiders tend to be a threat to the clans, but even Sarel openly shows approval once the Warden demonstrates that he (or she) is a friend, such as helping Elora with the halla, or helping Cammen and Gheyna get together.

 

As for Dragon Age II, Marethari, Merrill, and Arianni were pretty much the only Dalish elves we really got any extended exposure to; everyone else barely said anything to us.

[HK-90210]

this why I never plan character except in the most basic sense. first character is going to be a snarky elf reaver, probably two handed weapon though a sword and shield one worked out well in DA: 2, but nothing more let the rest come as I play. no getting mad/upset/disappointed because I got ahead of mself.

 

plus a renegade dalish would probably find themselves a city elf in fairly short order look at merrill, first to outcast in a year. actual since she probably hide what she was doing for a while, probably less then that.

 

See me, I actually enjoy coming up character concepts that get crushed as more info comes out. It forces me to mold and shape my character like a piece of clay. And with little else to do before the next game comes out, and no Keep access, I don't have much else to do, Dragon Age-wise.

 

I do shake my head when other folks get genuinely upset and angry when their over-complicated headcannons are crushed by one announcement or another. They knew the risk when they got attached to a character concept.

[mashasi]

I'm not upset elves have to have tattoos, I just hope the designs are nice. The one that female elf Inquisitor is wearing is just horribly tacky. I like the DAO and DA2 ones.

[Patchwork]

I haven't planned much for my dalish mage (she'll probably be my first run so she'll be outwardly polite just so I don't alienate anyone accidentally) but I am disappointed we're the clan's First. I would have preferred not to have that responsibility when choosing to form the Inquisition rather than returning to the clan and being a mage who lost out to someone more powerful/knowledgeable/better liked etc has a lot of roleplay possibilities. 

 

The new tattoos might look nicer but without an explanation of what they mean I'll probably pick out one of the older ones, those at least we have a guesstimate for. 

[Serza]

Well, the whole Becoming the Inquisitor might force your Keeper to rethink a few things, and appoint a new First - who knows if you'll ever have the chance again to live among the Dalish, being a leader of such a powerful organization?

 

Kinda like Merrill. Marethari HAD to get a new First, considering that Merrill was (more or less...) exiled. Otherwise the clan would be left without a Keeper when she comes of age.

[Gervaise]

The fact we have to have tattoos seems to confirm the reason why we have to be Dalish; there are going to be points in the story where this is important if you are, may be dealing with a Dalish clan in the Dales for example, and you are more likely to be trusted if you are Dalish.   However, if you claim to be Dalish and have no tattoos, they are going to be suspicious or at the very least will not respect you because in their traditions you are still a child.   People may also make reference to your appearance, which wouldn't make sense if you had opted not to have tattoos.

 

I had been hoping to play a city elf who had run away to the Dalish, thus allowing her a perspective on both, but they say you were raised among the Dalish, so I'm assuming that for my background to work, I would have to have run to them as a child.   Mind you, I believe Zevran was quite young when he tried living among the Dalish and then thought better of it.

 

As for the spy aspect, originally that occurred to me but it is true that you could be there in order to trade, which the Dalish do with humans in order to get the things they cannot make or find for themselves.   It would be easier to pretend to be a simple Dalish trader, than to try and pass yourself off as a city elf.    Felassen managed to get around Val Royeaux without revealing himself unless he wanted to, simply by keeping up his hood, so I presume they will have made our presence believable. 

 

It is a pity that they won't be giving us tattoo options specific to elven gods in the character creator because that is part of the law, so I suppose I'll have to go with whichever design I find most pleasing, as in Origins.      I kept it fairly muted there but liked the way it made my Dalish Warden distinctive.

[Magdalena11]

I hadn't thought of Gervaise's point, but it's a good one.  The reason everyone is assembled is a peace talk, so of course the Dalish would be sending a representative, since the elven uprising is one of the wars disturbing Thedas.  The city elves would be represented (effectively or not) by the human leaders of their cities.  That makes sense.

[OriginOfWaves]

people seem to forget that the elven PC is a member of the Keeper family, the most prominent family in the clan. getting a vallaslin is not a choice in that situation it's a duty and an obligation. if the PC is a mage then he is being trained to take over as the Keeper of the clan. rebelling against it means abandoning your people and your clan. The Dalish rely on staying together and being of one goal and mind to survive.

 

as for the city elf origin, i don't think that it was left out just because. if you look at all of the backgrounds: human - noble, chantry forces or circle mage; dwarf - carta family member; qunari - mercenary band and elf - dalish, first to the keeper or the clan hunter. City elf - servant? It just doesn't work for the game, what would a city elf be doing at the chantry conclave unless they were someone's servant. all of the other origins have some sort of combat training, but a servant? a spy for an orlesian noble? that just opens a can of worms you don't want to open.

[TheEternalStudent]

I hadn't thought of Gervaise's point, but it's a good one.  The reason everyone is assembled is a peace talk, so of course the Dalish would be sending a representative, since the elven uprising is one of the wars disturbing Thedas.  The city elves would be represented (effectively or not) by the human leaders of their cities.  That makes sense.

 

This isn't a peace talk to hash out all the problems in Thedas, it's between the Templars and mages, that's it.

people seem to forget that the elven PC is a member of the Keeper family, the most prominent family in the clan. getting a vallaslin is not a choice in that situation it's a duty and an obligation. if the PC is a mage then he is being trained to take over as the Keeper of the clan. rebelling against it means abandoning your people and your clan. The Dalish rely on staying together and being of one goal and mind to survive.

 

as for the city elf origin, i don't think that it was left out just because. if you look at all of the backgrounds: human - noble, chantry forces or circle mage; dwarf - carta family member; qunari - mercenary band and elf - dalish, first to the keeper or the clan hunter. City elf - servant? It just doesn't work for the game, what would a city elf be doing at the chantry conclave unless they were someone's servant. all of the other origins have some sort of combat training, but a servant? a spy for an orlesian noble? that just opens a can of worms you don't want to open.

Where do we learn the Dalish is related to the Keeper?

[Mistic]

Where do we learn the Dalish is related to the Keeper?

 

We don't. We know the Mage is her apprentice, nothing more. I think people are making assumptions because the family name is Lavellan and the name of the clan is also Lavellan, so maybe they could be descendants of the clan's founder, but that's all. And it might not be even that, since the Dalish Inquisitor could lack a true family name and just use the clan's name instead.

 

Now that I think about it, we don't see Dalish with surnames. The Dalish Warden was an exception, though, but it may be because he/she was the previous Keeper's child.

[LobselVith8]

We don't. We know the Mage is her apprentice, nothing more. I think people are making assumptions because the family name is Lavellan and the name of the clan is also Lavellan, so maybe they could be descendants of the clan's founder, but that's all. And it might not be even that, since the Dalish Inquisitor could lack a true family name and just use the clan's name instead.

 

Now that I think about it, we don't see Dalish with surnames. The Dalish Warden was an exception, though, but it may be because he/she was the previous Keeper's child.

 

At this point, it does seem like the Dalish protagonist is pretty much the only one who really uses a surname (including the previous example of Mahariel you brought up); almost everyone else seems to identify with a singular name, like Lanaya or Merrill.

 

Allan also mentioned in another thread that our background will come into play. He said, "They are referenced. You can also get war room side missions that are related to them as well."

[XxPrincess(x)ThreatxX]

A lot of people tend to disregard the fact that the Dalish are varied and different, and look down on them because they conflate the actions of some of the Dalish with the behavior of the entirety of the People. People ignore how Dalish elves like Lanaya, Elora, Cammen, Merrill, Gheyna, Athras, and Deygan didn't treat the protagonist with scorn, instead thinking that everyone acted like Sarel - disregarding how the story-teller only acted that way because his wife was recently murdered by the werewolves. At this point, you should simply focus on the positive (which is that a Dalish protagonist is once again available), because some people won't change their minds no matter what you say.

Elves like the Dalish are the reason the Dales got invaded in the 1st place with their anti human isolationist beliefs & obsession with immortality, & tbh, the non elven warden & Hawke would have likely faced death by arrow without MC plot armour.

[TheEternalStudent]

Elves like the Dalish are the reason the Dales got invaded in the 1st place with their anti human isolationist beliefs & obsession with immortality, & tbh, the non elven warden & Hawke would have likely faced death by arrow without MC plot armour.

You're saying the reason the Dales got invaded was because the people who lived in the Dales lived in the Dales.
And yeah, the enslaved people who lost an empire and imortality might not be super keen on singing kumbaya with humans.
Though I don't know where you get the obsession with immortality, obsessed with thier history yes, not immortality.
And I have no idea what arrow you're talking about.

[Hanako Ikezawa]

You're saying the reason the Dales got invaded was because the people who lived in the Dales lived in the Dales.
And yeah, the enslaved people who lost an empire and imortality might not be super keen on singing kumbaya with humans.
Though I don't know where you get the obsession with immortality, obsessed with thier history yes, not immortality.
And I have no idea what arrow you're talking about.

The Dalish want to reclaim the glory of the Dales and Arlathan, the latter of which had them immortal. That is one reason to stay away from humans because it was being near humans that caused their blood to quicken and made them mortal. So if that happened, then they believe staying away from humans will cause their blood to slow again. 

And the arrow they mean is the one the Dalish hunters would use to kill you. 

[Sylvius the Mad]

Perhaps, but there are many solid reasons for them to be mandatory.

But they're all in-game reasons. If a player doesn't care about that, why force him to play in that way?

[TheEternalStudent]

The Dalish want to reclaim the glory of the Dales and Arlathan, the latter of which had them immortal. That is one reason to stay away from humans because it was being near humans that caused their blood to quicken and made them mortal. So if that happened, then they believe staying away from humans will cause their blood to slow again. 

And the arrow they mean is the one the Dalish hunters would use to kill you. 

They only bring up immortality when talking about Zathrian, they never mention how they want to be immortal, they want to regain the lost culture, and not have to deal with humans coming to ruin things again.
And when do Dalish hunters try and kill the Dalish elf?
Unless you're talking about the first cutscene, where you can shoot some random human treasure hunters.

[90s Luke]

But they're all in-game reasons. If a player doesn't care about that, why force him to play in that way?

 

Perhaps because lore trumps personal preference (which is incredibly diverse)?

[XxPrincess(x)ThreatxX]

You're saying the reason the Dales got invaded was because the people who lived in the Dales lived in the Dales.
And yeah, the enslaved people who lost an empire and imortality might not be super keen on singing kumbaya with humans.
Though I don't know where you get the obsession with immortality, obsessed with thier history yes, not immortality.
And I have no idea what arrow you're talking about.

The main reason they avoid & in alot of cases hate humans is cos they blame them for taking their immortality away. The "death by arrow" thing is about the fact that they can be shown killing unarmed humans who just stray close to their camp but seem fine with Warden/Hawke & co walking heavily armed directly up to their camp, id have thought they'd shout a warning then attack if it wasn't the PC.

Anyway, i don't see a problem with mandatory tattoos, the keeper wouldn't send someone still considered a child to do an important task.

[Hanako Ikezawa]

They only bring up immortality when talking about Zathrian, they never mention how they want to be immortal, they want to regain the lost culture, and not have to deal with humans coming to ruin things again.
And when do Dalish hunters try and kill the Dalish elf?
Unless you're talking about the first cutscene, where you can shoot some random human treasure hunters.

They say Zathrian is possibly the first to achieve their goal. 

And the person you quoted said 'non elven Warden'. 

[TheEternalStudent]

The main reason they avoid & in alot of cases hate humans is cos they blame them for taking their immortality away. The "death by arrow" thing is about the fact that they can be shown killing unarmed humans who just stray close to their camp but seem fine with Warden/Hawke & co walking heavily armed directly up to their camp, id have thought they'd shout a warning then attack if it wasn't the PC.

Anyway, i don't see a problem with mandatory tattoos, the keeper wouldn't send someone still considered a child to do an important task.

No, the main reason they avoid them is on account of humans showing up and wrecking thier ****.
That's a real nice empire you have, we'll destroy it, take away your immortality, sink the capital into the ground and enslave you all.
That's a real nice new homeland we gave you, we'll take it back now
That's a real nice ruin, we'll just plunder it for your cultural artifacts
That's a real nice camp you have, we'll run you off now
They want the shems to leave them alone, or in some cases they would like them all dead.

The only time we see unarmed humans being killed is when the Warden-to-be and tamlen stumble across some, they CAN do this. Rather different from humans walking right up to your camp heavily armored.

[LobselVith8]

Elves like the Dalish are the reason the Dales got invaded in the 1st place with their anti human isolationist beliefs & obsession with immortality, & tbh, the non elven warden & Hawke would have likely faced death by arrow without MC plot armour.

 

Considering that there are two historical accounts about the fall of the Dales, let's not act as though there's only one. The Dalish claim their homeland was invaded because they refused to convert, and the elven Warden can even condemn the Chantry because of this. Even the city elves have a historical account that addresses how the Chantry was upset over the elves of the Dales following another religion. As for modern day clans, they avoid humans because lynch mobs and human lords drive them off the land when they stay too long in a certain area, and templars even pursue the clan (which is one of the reasons they are nomadic in the first place, as Merrill explains). Their religion is also outlawed by the Chantry.

 

I'm not certain why you seem surprised that the Dalish are wary about outsiders when outsiders consistently threaten them century after century. However, we also know that the Dalish don't automatically kill outsiders - the Dalish warn the templars away in Act II, despite how the templars tortured one of their children with fire to extract information about Feynriel, and it's mentioned in Act III that the Sabrae Clan has dealt with harassment from humans who threatened them to convert to the Andrastian faith.

 

There's supposed to be a semi-permanent settlement of Dalish who live near the humans who follow the Natural Order, and the humans are even encouraged to purchase elven goods. Clearly, the Dalish can get along with humans who treat them with respect, which simply isn't the case in Andrastian lands.

[Hanako Ikezawa]

That's a real nice new homeland we gave you, we'll take it back now

You forgot the part where the Dales cut a swath of death and destruction through Orlais first.