4203 réponses à ce sujet

[LiaraShepard]

I can see your point when it comes to characters like Cassandra and even the advisors, but I tend to look at party members differently in DA.  The ones that mean something to the plot sometimes never see combat for one reason or another, so I am hesitant to label Dorian as a "sidekick" just yet... I mean, I plan to take him on several missions, and based on what little I know about him he seems like one of the companions whose opinion I'd be more inclined to listen to when making decisions.  My overall point is that these companions are all considered heroes in one way or another, and were important long before the Inquisition forms.  I wouldn't sell any of them short just yet.

 

well, I hope you're right and he's not a sidekick. But I don't really have any hope left. They can't make everyone story important. It has always been one male and one female character (Alistar and Morrigan / Isabella and Anders). The plot relevant female character this time will be Cassandra... well, let's see who the male turns out to be.

[Maria Caliban]

I'm just glad they revealed Cassandra early.

[Hellion Rex]

I admit that I have no other social media sites active, so I don't know what's going on over there. I don't advocate flinging irrational hatred at anyone. I'm just saying, it's not like they were bystanders in the situation. (Well, yes to devs like Epler and Allan, obviously not everyone at Bioware in any capacity has a choice in this.) I think the issue should be handled with some measure of maturity, but the fact is, they made a choice to write the game the way they did. It isn't like it was out of their hands as to whether things would be equal. Criticism of the distribution is, ultimately, criticism of the choices made by select Bioware employees. That's not to say "YOU'RE A HOMOPHOBIC RACIST KILL YOURSELF" is acceptable criticism, don't get me wrong.    

From what I can tell, the writers are taking the brunt of it, as well as Mike and Mark.

[SofaJockey]

All things considered a great selection of LI's.

And on top of the 2 options everyone has, I'm not going to begrudge the straight women a couple of bonuses this time.

 

... because I plan to romance the lot of them anyway if I have enough play-through energy.

 

It's not everyone's choice or preference, 

but I've always felt perfectly comfortable role-playing as both m/f.

I've not previously role played m/m but Dorian is awesome, so no-one goes un-romanced.

 

 

Of course this is role-play, I'm not an assassin or mage in real life either...

[Ynqve]

In all honesty, this^. I got lucky with Dorian and Bull. I feel really bad for the Viv fans and male Blackwall fans. It's a drinking kind of night lol.

 

As a Varricmancer, I thought our NO! was bad. But I dealt with it, I got over it. But this? I just don't know what to do... 

[The Elder King]

We should give Vivienne a break. She just got off a long standing relationship, her boyfriend had his head cracked open like an overripen melon. She needs a grieving period.

Who ?

[Who Knows]

Sigh.

I wouldn't be surprised if there were people pretending to be haters when in fact they're just trolls trying to make fans/others look bad.

[Hellion Rex]

As a Varricmancer, I thought our NO! was bad. But I dealt with it, I got over it. But this? I just don't know what to do... 

Yeah, I'm kinda drifting here. Not sure how to really act right now.

[WildOrchid]

Sigh.

I wouldn't be surprised if there were people pretending to be haters when in fact they're just trolls trying to make fans/others look bad.

 

This wouldn't be the first time. That's how internet works.

[Ryzaki]

I admit that I have no other social media sites active, so I don't know what's going on over there. I don't advocate flinging irrational hatred at anyone. I'm just saying, it's not like they were bystanders in the situation. (Well, yes to devs like Epler and Allan, obviously not everyone at Bioware in any capacity has a choice in this.) I think the issue should be handled with some measure of maturity, but the fact is, they made a choice to write the game the way they did. It isn't like it was out of their hands as to whether things would be equal. Criticism of the distribution is, ultimately, criticism of the choices made by select Bioware employees. That's not to say "YOU'RE A HOMOPHOBIC RACIST KILL YOURSELF" is acceptable criticism, don't get me wrong.    

 

No one deserves to be harassed period. It's simply not acceptable. (The only time I can see it is if someone was harassing/slinging insults first and that's clearly not the case here).

 

You don't get someone to listen to you by doing such things. You just get them to tune you out.

 

I mean no this is not something that earns a "you kind of brought it on yourself." yell. Anymore than them having made more s/s romances would have them have brought the rage of straight gamers down on their head would've been anymore deserved.

 

I could see some trolling via the RGB cupcakes (It was a clever criticism without delving into cave man mode) so by no means am I saying the devs don't earn criticism but this is really not the way to do it. It's the best way of getting you ignored really. So no I don't feel the devs brought that on themselves. Normal criticism and snarky forum remarks? Yep. Abuse on twitter? Nope.

[MisterJB]

Who ?

Aye, these be dark days indeed.

People missing Game of Thrones reference...what are these forums heading to?

[Nocte ad Mortem]

Sigh.

I wouldn't be surprised if there were people pretending to be haters when in fact they're just trolls trying to make fans/others look bad.

I'll be honest, I know a lot of people who are genuinely livid. I try to always approach this issue with as much patience and maturity as I can muster, and I like to think I come across as a sane, rational human being, but I'm personally acquainted with a lot of people who I wouldn't be surprised to know are raining down wrath on Twitter and Trumblr right now. I don't agree with it, but it's just.. difficult. 

 

Individually, I feel just as bad for straight men right now, but a lot of LGB players just see this as another let down that compounds with a lot of other disappointments in their life related to their sexuality. It's often anger backed by a lot of things that are unrelated. People say, "it's just a video game", but for a lot of LGB posters, the rage is the video game, and being sent to conversion therapy where they did things to you that the Geneva Convention doesn't allow for prisoners of war, and the gay bashers who beat them, and their parents, who play FOX News all day and tell them they're going to hell, and a hundred other things. It's not fair to direct all of that at this, but sometimes people just have to let out all of that and "just a video game" can be the breaking point. I've seen this a lot with people I know, and it's always sad.         

[Ynqve]

Yeah, I'm kinda drifting here. Not sure how to really act right now.

 

I feel for you, I really do! I wanted him to be bi, I know so many male fans who wanted him. I'm heartbroken. On the other hand, if this is what the devs want, we have to accept it. They don't turn characters bi, straight or gay because of numbers. They do it because that's the story they want to tell. And I do support that... 

 

Still, this is my nightmare scenario. I just hope that they'll do better in the next game! As a straight female, I do not want the same kind of special treatment that straight men used to have. I want everyone to have the same amount of options.

[Nocte ad Mortem]

No one deserves to be harassed period. It's simply not acceptable. (The only time I can see it is if someone was harassing/slinging insults first and that's clearly not the case here).

 

You don't get someone to listen to you by doing such things. You just get them to tune you out.

 

I mean no this is not something that earns a "you kind of brought it on yourself." yell. Anymore than them having made more s/s romances would have them have brought the rage of straight gamers down on their head would've been anymore deserved.

 

I could see some trolling via the RGB cupcakes (It was a clever criticism without delving into cave man mode) so by no means am I saying the devs don't earn criticism but this is really not the way to do it. It's the best way of getting you ignored really. So no I don't feel the devs brought that on themselves. Normal criticism and snarky forum remarks? Yep. Abuse on twitter? Nope.

Well, I definitely agree that you need to be rational to get your point actually heard. There's a level at which "criticism" stops actually being "constructive". 

[Maria Caliban]

All things considered a great selection of LI's.
And on top of the 2 options everyone has, I'm not going to begrudge the straight women a couple of bonuses this time.
 
... because I plan to romance the lot of them anyway if I have enough play-through energy.
 
It's not everyone's choice or preference, 
but I've always felt perfectly comfortable role-playing as both m/f.
I've not previously role played m/m but Dorian is awesome, so no-one goes un-romanced.
 

 
Of course this is role-play, I'm not an assassin or mage in real life either...

The romance chart.

This is horribly geeky and fannish, but also very cool.

[Nohvarr]

I'll be honest, I know a lot of people who are genuinely livid. I try to always approach this issue with as much patience and maturity as I can muster, and I like to think I come across as a sane, rational human being, but I'm personally acquainted with a lot of people who I wouldn't be surprised to know are raining down wrath on Twitter and Trumblr right now. I don't agree with it, but it's just.. difficult. 

 

Individually, I feel just as bad for straight men right now, but a lot of LGB players just see this as another let down that compounds with a lot of other disappointments in their life related to their sexuality. It's often anger backed by a lot of things that are unrelated. People say, "it's just a video game", but for a lot of LGB posters, the rage is the video game, and being sent to conversion therapy where they did things to you that the Geneva Convention doesn't allow for prisoners of war, and the gay bashers who beat them, and their parents, who play FOX News all day and tell them they're going to hell, and a hundred other things. It's not fair to direct all of that at this, but sometimes people just have to let out all of that and "just a video game" can be the breaking point. I've seen this a lot with people I know, and it's always sad.         

Taking out this anger on people who have actually shown an inclination to listen and provide what they think are valid options for said gamers is not a good move. If you're that angery, you need to stop posting and go do something else, before you say something you will be unable to take back, and possibly burn a bridge.

[The Elder King]

Aye, these be dark days indeed.
People missing Game of Thrones reference...what are these forums heading to?

To be fair, I often miss references of things I like .

[Nocte ad Mortem]

Taking out this anger on people who have actually shown an inclination to listen and provide what they think are valid options for said gamers is not a good move. If you're that angery, you need to stop posting and go do something else, before you say something you will be unable to take back, and possibly burn a bridge.

I don't disagree with you, which is why I'm not on Tumblr or Twitter right now calling for David Gaider's head on a pike, or whatever the going thing is right now. But people who have been through hell have to get it out somehow, sometimes. It's not that I support what they're doing, but I can't help but understand where it's coming from, in some cases.

[Ryzaki]

Well, I definitely agree that you need to be rational to get your point actually heard. There's a level at which "criticism" stops actually being "constructive". 

 

Yep.

 

I can get people asking the devs can they get a turn on top of the pyramid (indeed I support this.) as well as requesting equal spreads in the next game (Support this too I do). And pointing out why to the devs this means so much to them without needing to hurl insults (or at the very least be subtle about them). Make them contemplative instead of aggravated really.

 

By no means does this mean you have to be sickeningly polite about it or thanking BW for what they did give you but not being a rude ass usually helps (Some people want to confuse not being rude with not being assertive though thus the lol nice guys finish last crapola).

[SofaJockey]

As for insulting the devs, I wouldn't do it and insulting them isn't going to change anything or get any marginally decent point across. But it was their choice to continue making unbalanced options. Unless they're saying they had no say in what happened, yeah, it is on them that it happened. They could have chose equal options for everyone and they didn't think it was important. So, what is everyone supposed to think about that? 

 

It's not a democracy. BioWare are entitled to make the game they think is best. People then buy it or don't.

Yesterday your eloquent arguments moved my own thinking to believe that a full equal balance is the best option and well worth arguing on behalf of, even if BioWare are much better than most (recognising the low bar). Next time. This game has been in development nearly 4 years, I'm sure DA4's development process has already kicked off.

 

Whilst you say you would not insult the devs yourself, your disappointing inference that the devs may have deserved insult goes too far in my opinion. I'm sorry Nocte, the choices made in an RPG game (however much people might be looking forward to it) don't justify insulting people doing their jobs. I mostly like what you've had to say the last few days but please don't sympathise with those bashing the devs.    

[devSin]

I dunno, Cortez's 360 degree turn from grieving husband to totally down-to-----, in "one mission" of time scared me so much that I put down the controller and promised to never romance him. I still haven't.

The decision to make him a romance came a bit later (apparently after Dusty had already started writing him), so I think that's why the story can be a bit awkward. He was already a grieving husband before he was a romance option.

Plus he got half the content of everything compared to the other squadmates (they probably shared his VO budget with Ash), think of even Citadel's DLC, most current squadmates and romance options got two cutscenes, Kaidan (and Ash) both got one short one. You couldn't even invite Ash to your apartment. Plus he could be dead. And that's literally all I can talk about because ME3 was the only game with m/m options.

This is mostly false. He has a good deal of content, however some of his exposition is split up with the plot nonsense (Mars, recovering in Huerta, and then the idiotic coup), leaving him with only two conversations once he's back on the ship (but there's still a lot of content before that).

It's not substantially less than any other squad mate, and it had nothing to do with Ashley. His romance content is a bit pared down since it's mostly adapted from the female version, but it's not as severe as some make it out to be (just a few scenes that wouldn't make sense for two guys).

And for the Citadel DLC, all ME3 companions only get one scene after the mission. The ME2 romance characters and Sam and Steve both get two, to make up for the lack of content they had in the main game.

Finally, if a gay player chooses for Kaidan to be dead in their playthrough, they get what they deserve, to be frank.

[Br3admax]

I don't disagree with you, which is why I'm not on Tumblr or Twitter right now calling for David Gaider's head on a pike, or whatever the going thing is right now. But people who have been through hell have to get it out somehow, sometimes. It's not that I support what they're doing, but I can't help but understand where it's coming from, in some cases.

lol@Gaider's head needing to be on pike for giving women more romances. If you can't control your anger, you should go seek professional help. Not to be rude, or unkind, or to insult, but you really need a psychiatrist to discuss your problems or built up emotions, not a game dev to take it out on. 

[TheTurtle]

lol@Gaider's head needing to be on pike for giving women more romances. If you can't control your anger, you should go seek professional help. Not to be rude, or unkind, or to insult, but you really need a psychiatrist to discuss your problems or built up emotions, not a game dev to take it out on. 

That's exactly what he said he was not doing..

[jtav]

Attacking the devs is unacceptable. Period.

[Br3admax]

That's exactly what he said he was not doing..

I'm using you in general. I'm not talking about him.