I don't consider Iron Bull to be an "honest" option, so I'd still be a bit put out that there's only one for gay guys, but I guess those are limitations we should be used to by now (and I stick with David anyway, so I already know which two romances are going to be the best for me).
What do you mean by honest?
That's beyond the games industry. That's writing in general. Speaking as someone who's a bit of an amateur writer, it... really isn't as easy as just making a character gay. Not if you've already made them. Somethings just don't feel... right with a character.
To clarify, I'm speaking as an honours student whose project and research is about LGBTQ characters and representation. Progress is slow and it's a long road. We are getting there. Maybe it would have to come from an independent developer. Who knows? But it's not a nice feeling if all you can do is talk about it, and not actively try to change it. For me, personally.
No offense, but not being able to please everyone doesn't count as a mistake.
This is a false scenario. I keep seeing people say this, "you can't please everyone". It's misrepresenting the situation. People are saying they want an equal distribution of options. That wouldn't be terribly difficult for them to do. In the sense of what people are asking, they definitely could have pleased everyone. The fact that some people may not like their choices, or whatever tangential situation you can think of, doesn't write off actively choosing inequal options.
Well, you're always free to play games by companies who meet this standard so much better than Bioware does :3When BioWare messes up, they mess up. Their threshold for mistakes and bad choices does not hinge on what other game developers are doing. They are not flawless, and they do not deserve especial praise for meeting the minimum standard of decency.
This is a false scenario. I keep seeing people say this, "you can't please everyone". It's misrepresenting the situation. People are saying they want an equal distribution of options. That wouldn't be terribly difficult for them to do. In the sense of what people are asking, they definitely could have pleased everyone. The fact that some people may not like their choices, or whatever tangential situation you can think of, doesn't write off actively choosing inequal options.
I'm out of likes but that's exactly how I feel.
Doesn't mean that it's a good thing when they always please the straight audience more than the homosexual one.
I find it interesting they chose to avoid the "everyone's bisexual" bit because they wanted to be more realistic. That makes it an artistic choice rather than a financial choice since I'm fairly sure that would have pleased both homophobes and those who wanted same-sex romances. I think it's a good thing that they made some characters gay and not bisexual or "Player Sexual" because it helps diffuse a lot of the criticism they got for previous games reducing romance to a sex mini-game.
Dragon Age Companions are not real people. They are, however, real characters and the attempt to treat them as real people in-universe works well for making some interesting statements.
I.e. they're not slot machines you put in quarters in until you "win."
Gay people will not turn straight even if you like them sexually. Which is a fictional version of a lot of the controversy on these boards regarding straight and gay romances.
And that's a good message to give to some of the neanderthal Gamers out there who may not realize this obvious fact.
I find it interesting they chose to avoid the "everyone's bisexual" bit because they wanted to be more realistic. That makes it an artistic choice rather than a financial choice since I'm fairly sure that would have pleased both homophobes and those who wanted same-sex romances. I think it's a good thing that they made some characters gay and not bisexual or "Player Sexual" because it helps diffuse a lot of the criticism they got for previous games reducing romance to a sex mini-game.
I'm not complaining about the gay or straight exclusive characters. I'm complaining about the fact that straight gamers alsways get more choices if not all characters are made bisexual.....
Well, you're always free to play games by companies who meet this standard so much better than Bioware does :3
Basically no one does. That's the problem.
I'm not complaining about the gay or straight exclusive characters. I'm complaining about the fact that straight gamers alsways get more choices if not all characters are made bisexual.....
Which is a valid complaint and a consequence of this.
How would you have done it?
Bioware actually tries and does become better for what I am gratefulBasically no one does. That's the problem.
Bioware actually tries and does become better for what I am grateful
It occurred to me when I was thinking of similar games. NOBODY does it like Bioware.
Bioware actually tries and does become better for what I am grateful
That's something I'm not going to deny. They do try. They really do. I'll give them that. We haven't had homosexual companions before, and here they are.
Which is a valid complaint and a consequence of this.
How would you have done it?
Making the last romances Vivienne and Solas bisexual with Vivienne gated against dwarfs and elves, and Solas gated against humans and Qunaris.
Making the last romances Vivienne and Solas bisexual with Vivienne gated against dwarfs and elves, and Solas gated against humans and Qunaris.
That would've been awesome.
Although my ideal way would be everyone open to both genders and all races tbh.
You see?It occurred to me when I was thinking of similar games. NOBODY does it like Bioware.
Making the last romances Vivienne and Solas bisexual with Vivienne gated against dwarfs and elves, and Solas gated against humans and Qunaris.
I'm interested in whether Blackwall will be bisexual or not rather than Solas.
That would've been awesome.
Although my ideal way would be everyone open to both genders and all races tbh.
Yeah, that would have probably been the most popular but opens to "Unfortunate ImplicationsTM."
Which is, of course, something Bioware is wary of.
I'm on the fence, personally.
Guest_john_sheparrd_*
When BioWare messes up, they mess up. Their threshold for mistakes and bad choices does not hinge on what other game developers are doing. They are not flawless, and they do not deserve especial praise for meeting the minimum standard of decency.
how did they mess up? just because they didn'T do exactly what you wanted in terms of LI's?
man thats just silly there is more to the game then romances you know that right?
and they should be praised because they are the only one's who even offer to play as a gay protagonist and have gay LI's
I doubt we will see a gay Assassin Protagonist (Assassins Creed Series) in many years to come
sure Bioware could have done some things better (regarding the gay LI's) BUT I really appreciate their effort
but nope lets go on whining about how they don't treat people equal .... 
When BioWare messes up, they mess up. Their threshold for mistakes and bad choices does not hinge on what other game developers are doing. They are not flawless, and they do not deserve especial praise for meeting the minimum standard of decency.
It's not their job to right the injustices of the real world in Thedas or to cater to your demands. They've done a lot for inclusion and no one held a gun to their head to get them to do it.
They just did it because they wanted to.
I'm interested in whether Blackwall will be bisexual or not rather than Solas.
I'd rather have him gay than bisexual. If he's bisexual, straight women would get twice as many options than lesbians. That'd be over the top, even with race gating. If he's gay, gay men and straight women have three options and straight men and lesbian women two options...The distribution would be closer, still not fair but at least not as bad as with one group getting 4 options.
how did they mess up? just because they didn'T do exactly what you wanted in terms of LI's?
I didn't say that. Please actually read what I'm responding to. When BioWare does something problematic, whether it's related to LGBTQ+ people, women, or people of color, they should be called out on it.
Bioware actually tries and does become better for what I am grateful
They do try, and I don't think many people are denying that. There are other games that I think try. Bethesda is pretty good about including gay characters. New Vegas had gay companions and NPCs. Skyrim allows same sex relationships equally. Fable games allow same sex relationships. Borderlands 2 has a bisexual male protag that you can choose, plus other LGB characters in the world, some of them major NPCs. The Last of Us had Ellie, a main lesbian character. It's not just Bioware, at this point, but I do appreciate what they do for the LGBT community and what these other developers do, as well as those I didn't happen to mention.
The thing is, we're making baby steps on representation for the LGBT community. Doing a little seems like doing a lot right now. It doesn't mean we shouldn't ever expect any games to equally represent LGBT characters and offer equal options for those players. I appreciate that Bioware is leading the pack with a select few others, but that doesn't mean I want that progress to become stagnant.
I have a trans friend, and he won't get any options.so at least the LBG get something, trans people get nothing at all.
My apolagize for my ignorance, but do Trans people not like nontrans people sexually?
Apolagoze for my ignorance, but do Trans people not like nontrans people sexually?
Not trans myself, but I'm pretty sure it varies like pretty much everything else when it comes to sexuality.
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