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[Dusksworn]

Anyway...I think should just elude Either the Maker and the Creators and not address them. If they do that they may risk making the Maker or Creators Unambiguous.

Oh, I agree.

 

However, I would like more instory perspectives and theories on both those matters, as well as more "potential evidences". Things that give you more discussion material and the like.

 

Anyhow, it's interesting to note that some Ancient Demons seem to identify themselves by unusual terms. Imshael, one of the Forbidden Ones, considered himself to be a "Spirit of Choice".

 

So, Demons and Spirits aren't really limited to any of the typical emotions, and some apparently favor concepts that really can't be considered emotions at all.

 

The Elder One, if he's an Ancient Demon of some sort, could easily have an atypical emotional/conceptual association, though right now "arrogance" is the most we really have to work with.

[raging_monkey]

Oh, I agree. However, I would like more instory perspectives and theories on both those matters, as well as more "potential evidences". Things that give you more discussion material and the like. Anyhow, it's interesting to note that some Ancient Demons seem to identify themselves by unusual terms. Imshael, one of the Forbidden Ones, considered himself to be a "Spirit of Choice". So, Demons and Spirits aren't really limited to any of the typical emotions, and some apparently favor concepts that really can't be considered emotions at all. The Elder One, if he's an Ancient Demon of some sort, could easily have an atypical emotional/conceptual association, though right now "arrogance" is the most we really have to work with.

what concept goes with arrogance

[Dusksworn]

what concept goes with arrogance

Well, it depends if that's actualy his central concept or simply what he shows us. If Arrogance is just his thing, than he would just be a variation of Pride Demon.

 

It's possible that he's something else and just very arrogant about it.

[raging_monkey]

Mortal seems a bit obvious and fade being is even more... we've spent weeks at this and i believe we are so close i can taste it

[Dusksworn]

Mortal seems a bit obvious and fade being is even more... we've spent weeks at this and i believe we are so close i can taste it

Well, that's sort of the thing...

 

What different sorts of beings even exist in Thedas besides Mortals, Fade Spirits, Abominations, and whatever the hell Old Gods are?

 

Personally I doubt he's an Old God, and I don't think he's Darkspawn, so he's probably one of the other three. Well, unless he's something entirely new that we haven't seen before, or maybe Flemeth.

 

So. Mortal, Fade Spirit, or Abomination.

 

As "The Elder One", he probably isn't a Mortal with a Mortal's lifespan, unless he's found a way to extend his life. Without being some form of Abomination or ancient Elf, that doesn't seem like it would be easy. A Fade Spirit or Abomination could survive long enough to be an Elder One, and his association with the Fade and interest in spreading it to Thedas makes it seem likely that he gains some advantage by weakening the Veil, so he's probably some form of Spirit.

 

It's really unfortunate that we know so little about things that aren't just Fade Spirits or Mortals. I would actually like to know what the hell an Old God is supposed to be, what Flemeth supposedly is, and so on.

[raging_monkey]

One of my many many theories is that the elder one is similar to flemeth. Not a abomination but not a mortal race either... they only differ on methods and goals.
He's what a abomination that hasnt been killed but the mortal half actually reasserted itself through sheer will and then literally became a perfect melding of spirit/mortal. I remember uldred saying a mage is a larvel form of something more! Back then i thought he was just jerking me around but now it might have a small piece of truth. But since we dont study abominations its only pre-theory

[Dusksworn]

One of my many many theories is that the elder one is similar to flemeth. Not a abomination but not a mortal race either... they only differ on methods and goals.
He's what a abomination that hasnt been killed but the mortal half actually reasserted itself through sheer will and then literally became a perfect melding of spirit/mortal. I remember uldred saying a mage is a larvel form of something more! Back then i thought he was just jerking me around but now it might have a small piece of truth. But since we dont study abominations its only pre-theory

Is such a thing really not an Abomination?

 

Anders and Wynne didn't seem to have a clear separation between themselves and their bonded Spirits.

 

I suppose there might be such a thing as a "Mature Abomination", for lack of a better term. If such a thing exists, I would probably assume that's what the Old Gods are. A near-perfect bond between Spirit and Mortal that eliminates most of the weaknesses of both in the process.

 

Edit: Though, it might make possessing another person a bit of a trickier procedure, as it would make there be more that needed to be fit in.

[myahele]

In elven lore some of their gods were regular people that was then uplifted to god-hood by other gods.

[Dusksworn]

In elven lore some of their gods were regular people that was then uplifted to god-hood by other gods.

Sounds reasonable, but what is a "God" in Dragon Age lore?

 

All we've seen is mortals and spirits, in various combinations. Well, there were also Old Gods, but all we know about are Mortals, Spirits, and Darkspawn.

 

So. What is a God?

 

The Maker of the Chantry sounds like the first Spirit, greater than any that came after. The Elven Gods sound quite a bit different, and the Old Gods appear to be somewhat different as well. The Elven Gods were never described as Dragons, after all.

 

So, the only visible Gods we have are the Old Gods and Archdemons, who we have tangible evidence of their existence. But what are they? Dragon Mages? Dragon Mage Abominations? Some other sort of being shapeshifted into a Dragon?

[Wolfen09]

Sounds reasonable, but what is a "God" in Dragon Age lore?

 

All we've seen is mortals and spirits, in various combinations. Well, there were also Old Gods, but all we know about are Mortals, Spirits, and Darkspawn.

 

So. What is a God?

 

The Maker of the Chantry sounds like the first Spirit, greater than any that came after. The Elven Gods sound quite a bit different, and the Old Gods appear to be somewhat different as well. The Elven Gods were never described as Dragons, after all.

 

So, the only visible Gods we have are the Old Gods and Archdemons, who we have tangible evidence of their existence. But what are they? Dragon Mages? Dragon Mage Abominations? Some other sort of being shapeshifted into a Dragon?

 

you're asking that in the dragon age universe when not many people in the real world can give you a proper answer to that question

[Keroko]

you're asking that in the dragon age universe when not many people in the real world can give you a proper answer to that question

Sure, but the difference is that being a fictional universe, dragon age van give us an answer to this question.

[raging_monkey]

In elven lore some of their gods were regular people that was then uplifted to god-hood by other gods.

if apothesis is possivle the thats a big clue

[Dusksworn]

Sure, but the difference is that being a fictional universe, dragon age van give us an answer to this question.

Exactly!

 

Dragon Age can tell us the exact "anatomy", as it were, of every specific sort of God we encounter. That would be very useful.

 

Whatever the case is, it seems like the Elder One is trying to become a God. Whatever the **** that means by Dragon Age standards.

[raging_monkey]

Probably just strong mage

[Killdren88]

Probably just strong mage

 

Possibly...But will be getting plenty of evil mages when we deal with Tevintir. That would risk being overkill with mages.

[raging_monkey]

Possibly...But will be getting plenty of evil mages when we deal with Tevintir. That would risk being overkill with mages.

then the forums will burn some more.

[Dusksworn]

Possibly...But will be getting plenty of evil mages when we deal with Tevintir. That would risk being overkill with mages.

We've seen powerful Mages before. Mages like Corypheus who are likely more adept at their craft than most modern mages.

 

So, I'm not expecting a simple Mage, or at least not a Human one.

[raging_monkey]

If he's mortal i assume he's like javik but evil... a remnant of the time before the viel the adam of mortals, if you allow me to be poetic

[Dusksworn]

If he's mortal i assume he's like javik but evil... a remnant of the time before the viel the adam of mortals, if you allow me to be poetic

Well, what methods are there for a mere mortal to become a God in Dragon Age?

 

We don't really know. Well, actually we do know one supposed method. However, the last guys who tried that fucked up so completely that it changed the world forever.

 

We've already discussed it quite extensively. Oh, the Elder One could probably become a Super-Abomination easily enough, and maybe pose as a God well enough. So too could the Tevinter Magisters if they so bothered.

 

But no. What the Tevinters and their Old God masters went looking for, in order to seize the power of the gods, was the Light of the Golden City. Now, their attempt was clearly crude and had horrific unintended consequences, but maybe that power is still there and maybe the Elder One has put together a plan to truly seize the City for himself?

 

I mean, how can you make yourself God without claiming the Golden City? You can deny the Maker's existence, but that City will always be hanging overhead with the promise that it once, or maybe still does, housed the power of the gods. Oh, maybe you can have unprecedented power over Fade energies, and drag Thedas into the Fade so you can rule over it with your demon armies...

 

But no matter where you go, that City will be hanging over your head, taunting you with one thing beyond your control. All of your mortal slaves or whatever will be able to raise their heads up and see it there, and know you're nothing more than a powerful fraud if you can't take that city for yourself.

 

If the Elder One wants to be God, he has to prove that he can succeed where the Magisters failed and take for himself the secrets of "Heaven".

[raging_monkey]

I like you always know how to spin a theory and have it seem plausible with a bit of dramitic flare

[Dusksworn]

I like you always know how to spin a theory and have it seem plausible with a bit of dramitic flare

I like drama. But really, not even the Old Gods could resist trying to take whatever they thought was in that City, so how could the Elder One just ignore it?

 

Inquisition is a story about something trying to make itself God, and the last time we had that it involved the City. There's not likely to be a better story for the subject matter to be explored. Leaked Achievements suggested that Corypheus is coming back, and he's probably had enough time to settle his head and get everything screwed in right so as to be more lucid when we speak to him next.

 

All of this meaning that we may be able to ask him what the hell happened with the City and how he got there. He's the perfect source of Black City exposition, and since he's likely not living past Inquisition, we won't get another chance to talk with him about the matter.

 

Now, if I may get into empty speculation, I did have a recent thought on how the Elder One might meet his demise. It's a bit of a foolish thought, but it might be fitting if the final confrontation took place in the Black City itself, perhaps protected by his magic green hand. I imagine that the city itself would be eerily beautiful and filled with mysterious music and perhaps a few grotesque oddities.

 

But I digress. It might be fitting, at the moment the Elder One appears triumphant, for a mysterious something to reach out from the heart of the city and tear him apart or pull him into an abyss. Something of that sort. With that mysterious something than proceeding to go after you, maybe as that mysterious green fade lady reappears and tells you to run while she stays behind and starts singing as the presence grows closer and the whole city starts to freak out.

 

This should all preferably happen in the most horrifying manner possible, with the music of the city growing ever more threatening, frantic, and just generally terrifying and wrong as it all happens. You never see what it is that's in the city, except maybe enough of a vague silhouette to know that you don't really want to see it.

 

Later, you wake up without your magic green hand, with all of the rifts sealed and you back on Thedas. Everyone is sure you saved them all, but they want to ask you what you saw in the city and how it all went down.

 

So, you have some of your last remaining dialogue options. You can tell the truth, say nothing at all, or lie. You can say you saw nothing, that you handled everything yourself. or that you saw something good and beautiful. Or you could tell them all what you really saw...

 

Whatever you say, it will have some impact on Chantry beliefs in the next games, even if it isn't obvious. There wouldn't be anything proving the existence of the Maker per se, only a horrifying Eldritch Abomination of tremendous power, kept pacified by the singing of a mysterious woman in the heart of the Black City. Sort of like Azathoth and his flute players.

 

Of course, the Maker was supposed to have left the city, wasn't he? Ah well.

 

EDIT: In case you don't know who Azathoth is: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Azathoth

[raging_monkey]

Again love your flare my friend

[Mr.House]

I'm still with my theory that the Elder one is simply Dumat(wardens say he died in the first blight but as we saw in Last Flight the history with the wardens is not what they seem and the wardens will cover up dark secrets(Cory ect) . Put that with DAI is having a bigger dragon emphasis, Tevinter cult obeying and following the Elder One and if Cory is involved(which at this point it's extremely high) why would he follow some other mage? If it WAS Dumat then Cory would follow with little to no issue.

 

I just can't see Cory following someone when Cory is extremely powerful and has powers close to an archdemon. We saw some of his power and that was when he was not even lucid, just imagine the full might of his powers when he gets it together.

[Fiery Phoenix]

I'm still with my theory that the Elder one is simply Dumat(wardens say he died in the first blight but as we saw in Last Flight the history with the wardens is not what they seem and the wardens will cover up dark secrets(Cory ect) . Put that with DAI is having a bigger dragon emphasis, Tevinter cult obeying and following the Elder One and if Cory is involved(which at this point it's extremely high) why would he follow some other mage? If it WAS Dumat then Cory would follow with little to no issue.

 

I just can't see Cory following someone when Cory is extremely powerful and has powers close to an archdemon. We saw some of his power and that was when he was lucid, just imagine the full might of his powers when he gets it together.

I had something similar cross my mind at some point. Hmm...

[raging_monkey]

I'm still with my theory that the Elder one is simply Dumat(wardens say he died in the first blight but as we saw in Last Flight the history with the wardens is not what they seem and the wardens will cover up dark secrets(Cory ect) . Put that with DAI is having a bigger dragon emphasis, Tevinter cult obeying and following the Elder One and if Cory is involved(which at this point it's extremely high) why would he follow some other mage? If it WAS Dumat then Cory would follow with little to no issue. I just can't see Cory following someone when Cory is extremely powerful and has powers close to an archdemon. We saw some of his power and that was when he was not even lucid, just imagine the full might of his powers when he gets it together.

its probable but he's a side villian due to dlc origin and DA 2s poor dlc sales