51 réponses à ce sujet

[Elfyoth]

WARNING! THIS THREAD MAY CONTAIN SPOILERS FROM DRAGON AGE BOOKS AND GAMES! It have been formally confirmed (at least in the wiki) that the Elven insparation came from the Jewish pepole in the Middle Ages, 

And as a jew myself I can clearly see that, lost homeland ghettos and second class, 2 homelands destroyed. Arlathan and the Dales are like the holy tempales in Jerusalem that were destroyed, but I suppouse bioware have wantedf it to look a litle diffrent, The exile, after the dales were destroyed the dalish ran away and they always say "When the time is right we will have a homeland" Totally middle ages Jewish thinkingm, i'm VERY glad that they chose Elves to be jewish Elves Are my favorite race . And if I'm right the Qunari are the Moors, it means they are more friendly with the elves, you can even notice it in DA2.  Another nice thing of elves in DA world, The insult on the Jewish pepole was "Big nose" and in DA the humans insult elves and call the "Knife Ears" Another intrensting point of view, The fall of Arlathan has been tevinter work, the fall of the first holy temple has been Roman Work. I have a theory I;m not sure if it will actually happen in future DA games, take the Dales for example, the elves left humans have settled and when the elves will return there will be war (Israeli-Palestinian Conflict) That is why I dont count Thedas as Eroupe I think they've taken some locations from around the world and putted it in one continent, of course most of the nations on Thedas looks like from eroupe. Please I ask you DO NOT POST HERE POSTS OF "FREE PALESTINE" OR "DEATH TO ALL ARABS" or anything that can insult anyone in anyway! thank you  

[Navasha]

Well, you are jewish so you tend to see similarities to jewish history in it.    I am sure someone with a native American background could find just as many similarities between the elves and the colonization of America.  

 

I am not sure where or if any similarity was used as inspiration to model the elven history.    Oppressed people driven out by an overwhelming force is a pretty common occurrence through our history and anyone of them (or even all or none of them) could have been used to draw references. 

 

Drawing references from real historical events adds a level of realism to a game, but pretty sure developers are also careful not to draw to closely a comparison to any one event or people else they will end up offending someone out there. 

[CuriousArtemis]

Another nice thing of elves in DA world, The insult on the Jewish pepole was "Big nose" and in DA the humans insult elves and call the "Knife Ears" Another intrensting point of view, The fall of Arlathan has been tevinter work, the fall of the first holy temple has been Roman Work.

 

Oh, very nice, these are two comparisons I hadn't thought of ^^

 

Yeah I did see that in the wiki (and I think it's properly sourced, too). Writers take inspiration from interesting sources sometimes I'm sure it's not meant to be an exact copy of historical events, but more as just "inspiration," so not sure we can predict what the future holds for the elves.

[EmperorKarino]

Elves are my favorite race in Dragonage mostly because i don't like the injustices done against them, what can i say, i like the underdog and i try to have my characters change the world and make it a better place for Elves, my Dalish Warden got the Boon from King Alistair to give Dalish land in the hinterlands in ferelden. i hear a bunch of people say that the boon got retconned or something, i'm hoping not, or it will be at the very least explained in Inquisition. and My Inquisitior will be able to help the elves get land of their own or something.

[Master Warder Z_]

Elves are my least favorite race in dragon age mostly because i don't like just how whiny, self superior, jingoistic, racially insensitive  they are.

 

Also their tattoo's look stupid.

 

And Emperor Karino: The Hinterland Boon like the Magi Boon is dead in the water.

[Drasanil]

Well, you are jewish so you tend to see similarities to jewish history in it.    I am sure someone with a native American background could find just as many similarities between the elves and the colonization of America.  

 

Its funny given elves in other settings tend to be analogous to the modern west with high standards of living, declining population, good education and health, callousness/arrogance vis-a-vis less civilized people etc etc.. I never associated DA's elves with any particular people or their history, but rather saw them as the logical follow through of the dying race trope and the equivalent of some future nightmare scenario of western collapse.  

[Medhia_Nox]

I see them more as a Total Failure Mash-Up.  Almost an indictment of everything that is wrong with people who ritualize their own victimization.  

 

Any oppressed people who have succeeded have held on to what traditions they could while moving forward (making them very much NOT like Jews and Native Americans).  The Dalish do not want to move forward at all - they want to incessantly stare backward and wonder "what went wrong"?  

 

The City Elves are ready however.  It's time for them to organize and join the populace as peacefully as possible.  My recommendation is that they actually mass exodus into the webway - err... Eluvians.  The City elves becoming an almost extra dimensional people who can appear and disappear at will seems FAR more interesting to me than the Dalish ever will.  

 

I just can't get past the very bourgeois vegan hipster aspect of the Dalish.  "You hate us cause we're better than you." mentality. 

Yes, I'm aware dissenting viewpoints are generally not welcome in elven fan threads.

[Master Warder Z_]

I just can't get past the very bourgeois vegan hipster aspect of the Dalish.  "You hate us cause we're better than you." mentality. 

Yes, I'm aware dissenting viewpoints are generally not welcome in elven fan threads.

 

[Master Warder Z_]

Parallels can be drawn from more than one source. The Long Walk of the Dales could have easily been inspired by both the Exodus and the Trail of Tears for example.

 

Or the russians crossing the landbridge way back when and coming to North America to settle it?

[Drasanil]

Or the russians crossing the landbridge way back when and coming to North America to settle it?

 

What about a particularly sadistic PE coach? The jogging the terrible jogging...

[Master Warder Z_]

Nice bait ya got there.

 

._.

 

The folks there were supposedly natives to the plateau's of what is modern day Russia so...what am i supposed to call them?

 

Proto Russians?

[Navasha]

I always saw the destruction of Arlathan similar to what is said historically of the fall of Carthage, myself.     That Rome not only destroyed the city, but buried it and even salted the earth so nothing would ever grow there.    

[Zakhar]

._.

 

The folks there were supposedly natives to the plateau's of what is modern day Russia so...what am i supposed to call them?

 

Proto Russians?

Proto-Proto-Russians.

[LobselVith8]

There are a lot of parallels to the elves that can be made to societies from our own history. To me, the Dalish have some strong similarities to Taino culture; an indigenous group of people who have to deal with dangerous explorers from a distant land who threaten their freedom and way of life, and who fought and failed to maintain their independence from foreign invaders.

 

One of the commonalities with some of these cultures is how the Dalish are holding onto their traditions and religion while moving forward with their lives, in it's own Thedas equivalent. It's not a perfect parallel, of course. The Dalish are keeping true to their traditions and religion while adapting to a nomadic lifestyle, having to be nomadic as a means of survival and living a life of hardship to be free of human rule. So much more could be accomplished if the Dalish had their own homeland - a place where they could settle and build towards the future, and not simply survive day to day.

 

There's also the hostility with the Chantry of Andraste, which has criminalized their culture and religion, the threats to convert to the human religion, and the Order of Templars, with their soldiers pursuing the clans, and being part of the reason for the Dalish to live a nomadic lifestyle. It is unique, while sharing common treads with several other cultures, which is why different people can see some of themselves in the Dalish.

[Master Warder Z_]

It has less to do with the journeys and more to do with why they were undertaken in the first place.

 

Well; Details of that rather sketchy unfortunately.

 

Many folks just assume they moved on due to resources and the like.

 

Still heck of a journey to cross on a land bridge.

[Steelcan]

the Dales remind me most of the nomadic tribal groups of the North American west, and like them they seem to be mostly consigned to the History Books.  An effort to reclaim something every now and then, but for the most part a long defeat, and not even a good one like the Byzantines or the Elves of Middle Earth

[Vereesa]

I see the usual suspects have come out to spew their anti-dalish hate

[Drasanil]

I see the usual suspects have come out to spew their anti-dalish hate

 

I'm not anti-Dalish, in fact [apart for some theoretical bad-arse Arlathan survivors] the Dalish are perhaps my favourite faction. Got to give props to the guys who just refuse to quit even when they are almost sure to lose. However, there seems to be some serious disconnect between what they are supposed to be and how they are portrayed in game. Namely, the weird vegan bourgeois stink they seem to get associated with [when lore-wise they seem to be closer to classy-hillbillies], nor do I care for this weird obsession they have for loudly and proudly proclaiming their 'victimhood' to anyone they meet; that sure as hell is one way to get everyone to hate on you.

 

The Dalish are supposed the remnants of the Dales' noble-blooded clans, I'd like to see them actually act like it for once. There's a difference between remembering and valuing your roots and acting like every other person you ever met personally ran over your puppy and stole your bike. 

[Bayonet Hipshot]

Yawn + Sigh....

 

No, it doesn't.  I see this type of threads on Elder Scrolls forums where they debate if the Khajiit are Persians or Redguards are Arabs or Altmers are Japanese, etc...

 

I have some news for you...Developers like to draw upon multiple real world and fictional cultures to create their own...

 

Elves in Dragon Age are not solely Jewish. It is a mix of cultures. 

 

Personally, I prefer to look at cultures, be it fictional or real, on their own terms and merit.

 

As for Dragon Age Elves, they were once like the humans of Thedas. They were varied, diverse, they lived in different types of places, they had their own social strata, they have their own brand of religion. They had their own magic / technology that allowed them to teleport long distances, be essentially immortal, forge powerful items from wood, etc. 

 

Then **** happened, **** that we are still not fully sure of ( I am not going to take the words of fables, scriptures and legends as truths) and the elves got messed up really badly. Note that I did not say that the elves were wrecked by humans because that only explains part of the story. Humans played a big part in the fall of the Theodosian elves but they are not the ones fully responsible for it. No one party has the full blame of something. There is the Fade, the dwarves underground, etc. Now they are splintered into two main factions, the Dalish and the City Elves. The relations between them vary depending on Dalish clans and the alienages. Some elves think they are doomed forever, some fight to have a land, some just want to help, some go their own way, some are very clannish, etc. 

 

A Jew will look at it and see the Jewish aspects of it. I am born and live in Southeast Asia, a tropical environment that was once the place of powerful civilizations. I could look at this and see the Southeast Asia aspect of it, with the forest, ancient ruins, etc. A Native American will look at this and see the Native American part of the story. 

 

The average human looks at the world from their own vantage point. The wise and intelligent human looks at the world from multiple vantage points or has transcended the need to rely on vantage points.

 

Cheerio. 

[Br3admax]

I see the usual suspects have come out to spew their anti-dalish hate

Yeah, how dare they call the one race to sit out during a Blight and then sack a country for no reason pompous. I mean the Chantry was in Orlais, so Orlais basically is the Chantry. And those pesky humans thinking they can walk in our territory and steal our women. Yeah, it's completely fine and legitimate to attack a country because it sent missionaries. 

[Jedi Master of Orion]

Yeah, how dare they call the one race to sit out during a Blight and then sack a country for no reason pompous. I mean the Chantry was in Orlais, so Orlais basically is the Chantry. And those pesky humans thinking they can walk in our territory and steal our women. Yeah, it's completely fine and legitimate to attack a country because it sent missionaries. 

 

Elves are not the one race to sit out a Blight nor the only race to sack nations. Also they probably didn't sack Val Royeuax.

[Br3admax]

Elves are not the one race to sit out a Blight nor the only race to sack nations. Also they probably didn't sack Val Royeuax.

No, they literally sat and watched a city be destroyed by darkspawn. Like the army watched it happen. I didn't say they were, I said they were worthy of criticism. All elves aren't Dalish, but go on, and yeah, they sacked Val Royeaux.