3344 réponses à ce sujet

[Jaulen]

A convention is certainly a much better approximation that a single household, no? Especially when the demographics are similar at just about every convention ever held over the years.

 

Are we seriously having a debate over whether or not the single largest demographic of games is fairly young men?

 

 

Yes, because a self-selecting demographic is SO statistically useful. Ahhh.....my stats prof in college would have a field day with that.

 

But enough OT from me.

[dan109]

Yes, because a self-selecting demographic is SO statistically useful. Ahhh.....my stats prof in college would have a field day with that.

 

But enough OT from me.

 

So you really think there's no correlation between the demographics of people that go to Bioware panels and the demographics of people that play Bioware games? Honestly?

[Sporothrix]

Most of them. At least on of the protagonists is often described as more heterosexual than homosexual, but he makes an exception for a special guy. it's quite annoying. I often have to read heterosex scenes while reading gay books. It's the same as with Zevran. He can fall in love with a male protagonist, but yet, he tells you that he prefers females x_x

 

"often described as more heterosexual than homosexual" doesn't mean gay. I wouldn't have any problem with all those movies and shows I listed before if those women weren't said to be lesbians, but bisexuals.

 

BTW, I don't recall many female same-sex romance stories in which at least one of the girls isn't bisexual either.

[Br3admax]

 

That's not the arguement you made in your prior posts.

Yes it was, If you latched on to the charged words, that's your fault. 

[daveliam]

Josephine is probably in her 30's. She's an 'old friend' of Leliana, who is probably mid-late 30's, so I suspect her to of a similar age, particularly if she knew Leliana from her time before the Blight.

Dorian is trickier. To me, he looks late 20's through mid 30's but his story makes me think that he's in the latter range. I'm less confident about that one though.

[LiaraShepard]

"often described as more heterosexual than homosexual" doesn't mean gay. I wouldn't have any problem with all those movies and shows I listed before if those women weren't said to be lesbians, but bisexuals.

 

BTW, I don't recall many female same-sex romance stories in which at least one of the girls isn't bisexual either.

 

well, I don't know many gay or lesbian movies. But when watching a magazine I saw at least one movie where lots of gay boys seemed to fall in love with a special girl. At least, it was written as a description for a movie. But don't ask me about the name. I turned the page as quick as I could. ^^ Plus they often die or get killed....I don't know many gay films with happy theme. Whatever. Can't we just agree that both groups have a very bad representation in movies? 

[Lady Nuggins]

Take a look at a Bioware panel specifically then. It's still mostly fairly young men.

 

I just went to a bunch of Bioware panels over the weekend.  I'd say the crowd was a pretty broad range of older and younger people, and fairly even between men and women.  

[XxPrincess(x)ThreatxX]

Most of them. At least one of the protagonists is often described as more heterosexual than homosexual, but he makes an exception for a special guy. it's quite annoying. I often have to read heterosex scenes while reading gay books. It's the same as with Zevran. He can fall in love with a male protagonist, but yet, he tells you that he prefers females x_x

Is a shame that all the bi characters so far have seemingly much preferred the opposite sex, only Leliana preferred other women but that was almost completely ignored

[LiaraShepard]

Is a shame that all the bi characters so far have seemingly much preferred the opposite sex, only Leliana preferred other women but that was almost completely ignored

 

Yes, I really hope Iron Bull and Dorian will get into a relationship, if you don't romance one of them. That would be a nice change.

[Hazegurl]

Most of them. At least one of the protagonists is often described as more heterosexual than homosexual, but he makes an exception for a special guy. it's quite annoying. I often have to read heterosex scenes while reading gay books. It's the same as with Zevran. He can fall in love with a male protagonist, but yet, he tells you that he prefers females x_x

Oh yeah, this is a very common thing in yaoi. I can't speak about other gay novels et al but in Yaoi it seems very common to have one or even both of the men express a preferred interest in women but make a special exception for the guy.  It does get rather annoying after a while.

[Char]

So you really think there's no correlation between the demographics of people that go to Bioware panels and the demographics of people that play Bioware games? Honestly?

You'd be better off asking BW for their statistics, and even then it's skewed since many women play as men etc, but all that using conventions as your basis says is that "the vast majority of Bioware fans that go to conventions are male".
It's a broad generalisation to say that this sample represents all Bioware fans.

For an example, it fails to take into account the number of BW fans living overseas, and for all you know 70% of those could be female.

[XxPrincess(x)ThreatxX]

Yes, I really hope Iron Bull and Dorian will get into a relationship, if you don't romance one of them. That would be a nice change.

Id like a M/M or F/F relationship to happen between unromanced companions for once, rather then it always defaulting to straight

[Elfyoth]

I'm Quite Dissapointed for the straight male player romances in the game, Josephine Cassandra and... thats it... for the straight males. 

[Sporothrix]

well, I don't know many gay or lesbian movies. But when watching a magazine I saw at least one movie where lots of gay boys seemed to fall in love with a special girl. At least, it was written as a description for a movie. But don't ask me about the name. I turned the page as quick as I could. ^^  Can't we just agree that both groups have a very bad representation in movies? 

 

Depends of what aspects of it you have in mind, because if you want to say that gay men are as likely to be portrayed that "deep down they need V" as "lesbians just need D", then without concrete evidence I won't believe it, especially since I've seen a discussion about this very topic once and it was 1 or 2 concrete examples vs about 30. Didn't save it then, but I believe my list containts many of those examples, though it was some time ago, and just since the end of last year 7 new examples appeared.

[Iakus]

I'm Quite Dissapointed for the straight male player romances in the game, Josephine Cassandra and... thats it... for the straight males. 

So?

 

There were two options for Jade Empire: Dawn Star and Silk Fox

Two options for Mass Effect 1 Liara T'Soni or Ashley Wiliams

Two options in DAO: Morrigan or Leliana

Two options in DA2 Merrill or Isabela

 

Two is normal. 

[Mihura]

Josephine is probably in her 30's. She's an 'old friend' of Leliana, who is probably mid-late 30's, so I suspect her to of a similar age, particularly if she knew Leliana from her time before the Blight.

Dorian is trickier. To me, he looks late 20's through mid 30's but his story makes me think that he's in the latter range. I'm less confident about that one though.

 

Hum I always though Leliana looked young but it was a lot more old, I would place her in her mid 40 actually at least that makes sense with the dialogue in DA:O about her age.

[devSin]

I agree with you. I think I realized why I took this conversation today so hard. I've been saying, "It's getting better" and "In 10 years it will be different" for 14 years. And it HAS been getting better and it IS different now and much of that is because of Bioware. But there's still so much progress to make. I mean it's still at a place where us getting less content 100% of the time is still viewed as not only acceptable but fair. And to hear that the company that is MOST likely to be the first to offer us the 'bonus' romance just ONE TIME doesn't think that it's realistic right now, well that just emphasized to me how far we still have to go and how unlikely it is that I'll see the change in gaming in the upcoming years. I think that's really why I got upset today.

As has been noted, David himself remarked not too long ago (during development of Origins) that it would probably be hard to justify a same-sex exclusive romance (especially from a companion).

And it wasn't too long before that when he was waffling on the idea of including gay characters at all (though I never truly understood his arguments back then, so maybe he was indicating some other position—discussions on this topic weren't as common in those days).

So this is an extraordinary amount of progress in just the last five or six years: we've gone from the expectation of having nothing, to at least being able to say we're not completely ignored, to finally being confident that we will have options—maybe not the most, but at least enough to give us the same choice that everyone else has previously received (I'd hesitate to think that choice is guaranteed now, but I really hope it is).

I too would prefer that "relative equity" could also mean we wouldn't always be the last in terms of who is eligible for any extra content, but I still think the improvement from where we were when this whole thing started has already been staggering. (And I think David's mention that representation need not solely rest on the romance plots is especially worth paying attention to, as it's something we've seen little of in the past and could provide a much more inclusive atmosphere at far less cost—it's already started to happen in the alternate media, with people like Mae'Varis and Celene.)

[dan109]

Yes it was, If you latched on to the charged words, that's your fault. 

 

Reread your earlier posts. They don't communicate what you say you meant to communicate.

 

Either that or you realize that you were wrong and are backtracking.

[LiaraShepard]

Depends of what aspects of it you have in mind, because if you want to say that gay men are as likely to be portrayed that "deep down they need V" as "lesbians just need D", then without concrete evidence I won't believe it, especially since I've seen a discussion about this very topic once and it was 1 or 2 concrete examples vs about 30. Didn't save it then, but I believe my list containts many of those examples, though it was some time ago, and just since the end of last year 7 new examples appeared.

 

Gay people often get killed, punished,tortured or commit suicide in movies. And in many movies they are described or represented as fags who are overly feminine and fairylike and who press the straight guys with their advances. They show this more often than with lesbians. So yes, I agree. there may be more movies with lesbians who aren't really lesbian, but also more movies with gays who get killed, tortured, or who act like a chicken on ectasy. That's not better. So, please don't always write as if lesbians are worse represented than gay guys. Because that's not true. They're both badly represented, both groups in their own bad way.

[SofaJockey]

Lol I'm actually pretty close to 30 myself, so I have no problem with the age range of the general cast, it just seems odd that out of 8 romance options there's not a single heterosexual 20 something woman. That's the type that has the broadest appeal by far, that's why you see them in just about every ad, commercial, etc. I can understand not wanting all 8 characters to be like that, but why wouldn't you include at least one?

 

You could roll a female character dan109 and romance Sera. She appears a little younger and so may fit your age profile?

[Panda]

I actually like them being older. There are so many games with younger characters or teenagers. The people of the inquisition seem to be experienced. And I wouldn't call people in their late 30s or 40s old. 

 

I think it comes down to people's own ages. Characters this round feel bit old to me. I'm early 20s myself so I guess that's just normal for me ^^

[XxPrincess(x)ThreatxX]

I'm Quite Dissapointed for the straight male player romances in the game, Josephine Cassandra and... thats it... for the straight males.

Straight males have nearly all had at least a choice between 2 women while straight females & LGBT players had to settle for just 1 option or no option at all, i don't see why straight females having 2 extra Li's that a race gated is such a big deal

[dan109]

You could roll a female character dan109 and romance Sera. She appears a little younger and so may fit your age profile?

 

I can never get into a game where the main character is a woman. Too much of a disconnect for me. Sera seems just fine if she wasn't exclusively lesbian.

[LiaraShepard]

I think it comes down to people's own ages. Characters this round feel bit old to me. I'm early 20s myself so I guess that's just normal for me ^^

 

well, I think it depends. I'm 26 and I like both older and younger characters. Bot there may be some people who prefer characters in their own age. So I agree with you.

[Alan Rickman]

Straighty's gonna be fine.

 

(Just like Patrick Weekes, I feel like I'm allowed to use that word)