371 réponses à ce sujet

[AlanC9]

I didn't like BG:EE at all. I'd much rather play the vanilla game.

What was wrong with it? (I never really considered it since the original works fine for me.)

[spacediscosaurus]

You can only have 8 abilities per character and you can't change them during combat. I think that limits alot of strategies but it's subjective as people will defend it to death simply because they believe it's Bioware. But we all have to wait to see when the final game release to really judge it.

 

Or, you know, people defend it because they think it'll be a cool mechanic. Or there are people (like me) who are completely indifferent to it because they didn't use more than eight abilities anyway. It's unfair to say that the people who don't hate it are just BioWare fanboys/girls.

 

As for OP's question, there will be some of the stuff you're looking for in this game, but as others have mentioned, it sounds more like you'll be into stuff like Divinity: Original Sin or Pillars of Eternity. Maybe wait for the game to come out and watch some videos of it before you make up your mind?

[Sylvius the Mad]

What was wrong with it? (I never really considered it since the original works fine for me.)

To be fair, I didn't spend much time with it (as with you, I have the original). But they muddied up the UI a lot.

I can't remember what else they did, because I keep confusing it with Tutu (which I also didn't like).

[archav3n]

Or, you know, people defend it because they think it'll be a cool mechanic. Or there are people (like me) who are completely indifferent to it because they didn't use more than eight abilities anyway. It's unfair to say that the people who don't hate it are just BioWare fanboys/girls.

 

As for OP's question, there will be some of the stuff you're looking for in this game, but as others have mentioned, it sounds more like you'll be into stuff like Divinity: Original Sin or Pillars of Eternity. Maybe wait for the game to come out and watch some videos of it before you make up your mind?

 

My opinion would be many defended it simply because the mechanics are tailored for their platform of choice: consoles. Arguing less options as more doesn't sound right to me. Now what if controller permits 4 and not 8 buttons? So should i said that has more strategies and planning now we can only have 4? Now what if the controller permits 2 button... Very tactical indeed.

[spacediscosaurus]

My opinion would be many defended it simply because the mechanics are tailored for their platform of choice: consoles. Arguing less options as more doesn't sound right to me. Now what if controller permits 4 and not 8 buttons? So should i said that has more strategies and planning now we can only have 4? Now what if the controller permits 2 button... Very tactical indeed.

 

I don't want to devolve this thread into another argument about the eight abilities, but there are definitely PC players who like the limit (I don't know if I would count, since I actually don't care either way, but I'm a PC player who is unaffected by this limit). I've seen several people who mention that they liked the mechanic in Guild Wars 2, which is a PC game. There are also many console players who don't like the limit, since there was no limit in the past games on console (they could use the radial menu to access abilities not mapped to buttons).

 

I'm done arguing this matter. I've done enough of that in the threads dedicated to this topic.

[UniformGreyColor]

I know I don't personally mind having to choose which abilities I use. This is especially true if the Devs account for this some way -either by means of scouting ahead, or give us abilities that are more well rounded. I still want, perhaps as a necessity, to be able to swap weapons in combat though. I highly doubt that the Devs made the game in a way that makes even half of our abilities useless (for each character I should add) in the case we have not scouted ahead though. Truth be told we haven't seen any swapping of abilities in the gameplay videos so I don't even know if that is something we actually have to do. Furthermore we don't even know if there is another group of 8 more abilities we can map to to give us all our abilities that we have in our arsenal. In the gameplay videos we see a swap of abilities from one set to another. Lets not forget that.

[theflyingzamboni]

Choices and consequnces; can my party make decisions that have real effects on the people and world in the game? For instance if I'm a cruel bastard will this be reflected?

Like others, it sounds like this will be much more in effect in DA:I than BG2. You couldn't really affect all that much in the world of BG2, really. Certain characters, but not so much the world.

But since I haven't seen this mentioned in this thread, I will mention 2 things we know about DA:I:

1) You can't do all the sidequests in one playthrough, so your choices will definitely have an effect there.
2) One of the things I've heard that I've liked the most is that some quests will have follow up "reaction" scenes. Where, for instance, someone with a concern in a quest you just did will come to Skyhold and give you a chance to see the effect your actions had on people, and make follow-up decisions regarding them. So that's a piece of reactivity we've never had in a BioWare game before.

[AlanC9]

I can't remember what else they did, because I keep confusing it with Tutu (which I also didn't like).

Wasn't Tutu just BG1 in BG2's interface?

[Sylvius the Mad]

Wasn't Tutu just BG1 in BG2's interface?

And mechanics. So weapon proficiencies worked differently, some of the abilities were changed, and the walking speed was higher (which placed a much greater emphasis on melee combat).

It also changed how dual-classing worked.

[coldflame]

Lost all interest in DA games after Origins and haven't been following Inquisition at all but I see there's a tacical view and even though it's obviously very consolised it made me think that there might be some things in this I could enjoy.

 

I don't care about gay or straight romances, cinematics or lore or crap. Good tactical combat, full party control and customisation and proper RPG mechanics are what I care about. Does Inquisition have these or has BioWare abandoned oldschool grognards like me?

Good tactical combat? To a certain degree maybe but we really need to actually play the game to be able to tell. Keep in mind that many "RPG" games in the past have claimed to have something similar to BG, but they all failed in the end. My personal opinion is no, DA:I won't be as good as the BG series in every aspect, but in the end you will have to make up your own mind.

[CosmicGnosis]

I often hear about the greatness of Baldur's Gate, which I've yet to experience, but I never hear anything about Neverwinter Nights. Is that game not considered a classic or something? I started with Knights of the Old Republic, and have enjoyed every BioWare game after it, but I don't know much about their early games.

[LinksOcarina]

My opinion would be many defended it simply because the mechanics are tailored for their platform of choice: consoles. Arguing less options as more doesn't sound right to me. Now what if controller permits 4 and not 8 buttons? So should i said that has more strategies and planning now we can only have 4? Now what if the controller permits 2 button... Very tactical indeed.

 

God forbid you plan ahead instead of spamming everything like in Baldur's Gate anyway. That wouldn't be tactical at all. 

 

The mechanics, tailored for consoles or not, are a choice by the developers and usually done for more than just platform of choice. I don't know if you noticed, but most modern controllers follow a 4-button paradigm as their main buttons, we would get access because of a shoulder button giving us a hotkey for the menu on the bottom of the screen, which is a plus. It also used to be six abilities hotkeyed instead of eight, so if anything its an upgrade as more options for console players.

 

Honestly, the argument regarding the number of abilities you can deploy is moot, because its a different style of tactical combat. A style, mind you, for a game that BioWare has made different from previous games in its own series because of the changes to how combat and tactics work, with the introduction of the tactical camera and more dynamic action control. 

 

Welcome to the chessboard, place your pieces carefully. 

[LinksOcarina]

I often hear about the greatness of Baldur's Gate, which I've yet to experience, but I never hear anything about Neverwinter Nights. Is that game not considered a classic or something? I started with Knights of the Old Republic, and have enjoyed every BioWare game after it, but I don't know much about their early games.

 

Personally, Baldur's Gate is overrated in my eyes. I played it for the first time back in 2000 and it was ok, but it has not aged well at all as a game. 

 

Neverwinter Nights is a better game, but still has problems,namely how chunky everything is because it was in that weird in-between period of 2D/3D graphics, and a rougher UI.  

[Brogan]

I think in general, you need to understand that alot of the same designers are doing these games.  DAI will have a different stat system, combat system, and character progression, but they have been created with the same ultimate goals BG possessed.  Story driven gameplay, choices that have meaning, solid, tactical combat.  The change you'll notice first however will clearly be how pretty everything looks, but that's part and parcel with the advancement of hardware capabilities and what the PC's and consoles can do with all those pixels nowadays. 

 

My advice would be to trust Bioware and give DAI a chance to thrill you like BG did.

 

I've never actually finished original Icewind Dale. I remeber it being too hard for me as a kid, and I never had time to properly return to it somehow. 

 

Def recommend getting this on Steam and playing with the newly enhanced bg2 ui (mods will work the same).  This game had probly my favorite soundtrack of any game growing up and a story that was extremely enjoyable (I think I remember RA Salvatore being somewhat involved?).

 

Plus, it forced you to do what I did anyway in BG and BG2 - create all 6 of your characters yourself.  Talk about getting lost in the roleplaying...

 

ps:  I hope Beamdog does IWD2 next.  THAT game was outstanding in all the same categories as the first one.

 

 

 

Personally, Baldur's Gate is overrated in my eyes. I played it for the first time back in 2000 and it was ok, but it has not aged well at all as a game. 

 

Neverwinter Nights is a better game, but still has problems,namely how chunky everything is because it was in that weird in-between period of 2D/3D graphics, and a rougher UI.  

 

That, to me, is why NWN always felt like a lesser experience than BG and BG2.  They were trying to make the same game, but with the shift to the "new" graphics of that time.  It was still good, but (and this is where I disagree with you) not nearly as epic and story-driven as BG and BG2 were.

[Rawgrim]

Neberwinter was mostly just a multiplayer toolkit. It didn't follow the d&d rules very well either.

[bEVEsthda]

Neberwinter was mostly just a multiplayer toolkit. It didn't follow the d&d rules very well either.

 

Yep. That is what saved them that time (toolkit). Because the OC was a horrible disaster.

[bEVEsthda]

It will probably annoy you less than it will annoy me, and I'm still planning to play it.

 

Lol. Yes that is one way to put it. Same here. I think it's unreasonable to expect Bioware to continue to do BG after all these years, so I'm prepared to make an effort to embrace changes. But I have to say that Bioware seem to make it difficult for me. Why not six party members? Why voiced protagonist? Why dialogue wheel? Why these movies? What kind of game is it Bioware is trying to make?

[bEVEsthda]

 

That, to me, is why NWN always felt like a lesser experience than BG and BG2.  They were trying to make the same game, but with the shift to the "new" graphics of that time.  It was still good, but (and this is where I disagree with you) not nearly as epic and story-driven as BG and BG2 were.

 

I disagree with that. They didn't try to do the same game. At all. Not OC. Only one party member at a time, for instance. If anything I'd say they wanted to do something like Diablo crossbred with Dungeon Siege. Awful.

[Nohvarr]

Ever since Baldur's Gate 2: TOB Bioware has been trying out different gameplay systems with varying degrees of success. NWN's OC and gameplay were average, but the game on the whole brings back fond memories to me because of the community that sprung up around it. Some really creative people put out some awesome campaigns. KOTOR reduced you to three companions, but it worked overall. Jade Empire is a mixed bag but like Mirrors Edge it was something different so I enjoyed it overall. That said if they ever make a sequel to Jade Empire they should probably push it more towards Batman Arkham series, Sleeping Dogs, and/or Shadows of Mordor in terms of gameplay. So with that in mind  would not expect this game to follow the BG book of Gameplay too closely

[Deebo305]

I really wish people would stop with the Baulders Gate comparisons, just let Dragon Age be Dragon Age and nothing else

[Eternal Phoenix]

I really wish people would stop with the Baulders Gate comparisons, just let Dragon Age be Dragon Age and nothing else

 

Not going happen since Bioware introduced Dragon Age as the spiritual successor to Baldur's Gate (and in many ways, it was).

 

Inquisition certainly has some elements from Baldur's Gate still, party customization is there, the world is open now and there's tactical combat.

[Bellethiel]

I am not sure if Inquisition will meet your expectations. But they added few interesting things to combat, and it will be different from DA:O which you didn't like, that's for sure. So who knows? All depends on how much of Baldurs Gate you wanna see in DA:I I guess. 

But when it comes to Baldurs Gate like games I am still waiting for Pillars of Eternity. Even if it's not Bioware doing I hope it will be closer to BG than anything else was in years. But we shall see. 

[teenparty]

Can't we please just admit to ourselves that Baldur's Gate wasn't <I>that</I> great. It's a fun game, but it's got it's flaws.

 

What I miss most about Baldur's Gate myself is all the different spells and all the silliness. Turning the silver dragon into a squirrel before killing it was my greatest ever video game moment.

[Jester]

The problem with NWN (the original one, not the sequel and not expansions) was thet it's story and level design are absolutely terrible. Probably the worst that I have seen in an RPG. The whole game is based on beginning in a central square area, and having to go to 4 other square areas, getting an item from each of them. 

Add to that it being a D&D 3.0 system, where you control a single character, and can add one follower to your "party" - where your follower is just an uninteresting bot with no personality or story, and practically no dialogue...

The first expansion to it was decent, and improved the area and quest design, as well as characters. The second expansion was close to being great storywise. 

 

NWN2 improved significantly on that, and it's expansion was the best experience in that particular setting (meaning Forgotten Realms), that I had since Planescape:Torment. 

 

Inquisition certainly has some elements from Baldur's Gate still, party customization is there, the world is open now and there's tactical combat.

 

The interesting thing is that Baldur's Gate series practically introduced the concept of romances with your party members into the RPG genre. 

There was some semblence of romances in Torment, but it was mostly flirting. Baldur's Gate 2 introduced it in a form that we know today, from games like KOTOR, DA, Mass Effect or NWN2 - The only difference being, that in BG2 you didn't actually initiate conversations, you had to wait until the game did that.

[PhroXenGold]

Personally, Baldur's Gate is overrated in my eyes. I played it for the first time back in 2000 and it was ok, but it has not aged well at all as a game. 

 

I sort of agree with this. BG hasn't aged as well as I would've liked (based on playing it a year or so ago). BG2, on the other hand, is still utterly phenomonal, and the only real rival to PS:T for the award of greatest game ever.