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[Death Breeze]

As long as DA:J journeys comes out before i get my hands on DA:O and i am able to possibly finish it before then, I'll be grateful.

[Flamin Jesus]

Hitting a date and delivering a completely bug-free product at the same time is almost utopian in IT, unless you only set a release date when you're already done. If there's a problem, it's not always because X messed up and forgot to order something, or because Y slept on the job, or because Z had a bad day. Even in the cases where it is, it can take hours, days, weeks to find and fix the source of a problem even if you see the problem.

Also, while on sites like newgrounds and the like Flash movies and games ARE released all the time, sometimes within days, that doesn't mean that producing something worthwhile is that easy, a large percentage of the stuff (Mostly the things that are made within days) are craptacular, while most of the really good things DO take months, or at least recycle a lot of older assets, as you'd notice if you read their authors' posts. If you ever played the other promotional Flash games available on EA's site (Particularly the Mirrors Edge Flash), you'd also have seen that most of them go further in quality and complexity than the vast majority of Flash games out there.



Software isn't something you just wish into existence like in Star Trek, even with the best tools, and there is no ActionScript method called automagicallyMakeAwesomeGame() that I'm aware of.



That being said I wouldn't be surprised at all to find out that the game has been ready for a while and is only being delayed to build up anticipation, look at the info that was oh-so-conveniently 'leaked' in a way that was both easy to take as fact and easy for EA to distance themselves from, if the game had been announced and been ready within a short time, we'd all have played and then forgotten about it quickly, as it is now we've built up a surreal amount of anticipation and will be sure to remember the product longer, maybe long enough to still care once the 2nd and 3rd parts are released, which in turn keeps the memory of DA:O fresh, which will help boost sales of the inevitable sequel.



Really, marketing-wise this game is a pretty good idea, people who already care about DA:O are being kept in line, people who DON'T care about DA:O may well stumble upon the Flash game and decide to take a closer look, particularly once the game tells them they've already unlocked stuff within the game.



Naturally, we don't appreciate being played like that, but it's not like they care about our love, they care about our money, and as long as those moves don't tick us off enough to stop buying their games, they couldn't care less...

[Flamin Jesus]

For example, look at their twitter, a few days ago the number of followers was somewhere around 20, now it's almost 200, why do you think that is?

The more we talk about this delay, the longer it will become.

[dafire]

I don't think that oct 20th was ever said by someone official. It was someone here who suspected it would come out at oct 20th because it was a former release date of DA:O before it was recheduled to november.



The official website says Chapter 1: October 2009 ... and october is not over yet.



If someone still insists that an official guy postet oct 20. please link it or it never happend.

[Staylost]

dafire wrote...

I don't think that oct 20th was ever said by someone official. It was someone here who suspected it would come out at oct 20th because it was a former release date of DA:O before it was recheduled to november.

The official website says Chapter 1: October 2009 ... and october is not over yet.

If someone still insists that an official guy postet oct 20. please link it or it never happend.

Wrong.

Garin (is a guy who made the game official enough?) posted that the open beta release was on the 13th.

He also posted that the total release was on the 20th.

He later ninja editted those so no one could read them anymore.

Then Garin apologized IN THIS VERY THREAD for doing that, so that it would be clear that he isn't trying to trick anyone.

Link my rear, try reading the thread.

Modifié par Staylost, 21 octobre 2009 - 09:14 .

[Jab0r]

If you look hard (and fast) enough, the (now out-of-date) part about it going live on the 20th can still be found here

Modifié par Jab0r, 21 octobre 2009 - 09:10 .

[Arttis]

I heard offically revealed but the we launch wasnt really very official....meh

[Valcutio]

I know we all really want to play the game (I prolly want to play worse than most of you!) but if the game isn't ready, it isn't ready. I'd rather have a bug-free game than a game that meets an unofficial deadline.



I hope they continue to hammer out the problems and release it when it's ready. As long as it's ready before DA:O launches.



- Valcutio

[dafire]

ok .. thanks to point me to the post But since there also wasn't an open beta either I guess that it was not really official what the guy posted. Or did I miss it ?

Modifié par dafire, 21 octobre 2009 - 01:56 .

[Staylost]

dafire wrote...

ok .. thanks to point me to the post But since there also wasn't an open beta either I guess that it was not really official what the guy posted. Or did I miss it ?

Whether it is official or not has nothing to do with whether there was an open beta. That would be circular reasoning.

You are saying:

1. There was no official announcement.

2. Yes, the game maker made an announcement (and we all know that employees DO speak for companies legally, hence the curb on free speech while acting for your employer).

3. But since it didn't happen it must not be official. (Was the DA:0 release date of Oct. 20 official?)


If a company employee makes a statement, it is official, unless specificaly otherwise stated.
That being said, it appears it was an official blunder.
So, in fact, I am correct, but your feeling on this is quite nearly the truth>some people are overreating. The employee apologized for making his statement, so miscommunication, massive bug finding, or EA lording it over us is to blame.
Take your pick.

Anyway, just hoping it comes out today!

[malatesto20]

If it does come out today is it gonna be downloadable or whats the scoop if anyone knows?

[dafire]

Staylost wrote...
You are saying:

1. There was no official announcement.

No. I said that I thought that there was no official announcement and asked to get a link otherwise.

2. Yes, the game maker made an announcement (and we all know that employees DO speak for companies legally, hence the curb on free speech while acting for your employer).

If a company employee makes a statement, it is official, unless specificaly otherwise stated.

So if steve jobs office cleaner is posting something at macrumors.com it makes that an official announcement by apple ? where do you live ?

Modifié par dafire, 21 octobre 2009 - 03:26 .

[Staylost]

dafire wrote...

Staylost wrote...
You are saying:

1. There was no official announcement.

No. I said that I thought that there was no official announcement and asked to get a link otherwise.

2. Yes, the game maker made an announcement (and we all know that employees DO speak for companies legally, hence the curb on free speech while acting for your employer).

If a company employee makes a statement, it is official, unless specificaly otherwise stated.

So if steve jobs office cleaner is posting something at macrumors.com it makes that an official announcement by apple ? where do you live ?

You are calling garin an office cleaner? Look. If a guy makes something, yeah, I'm gonna consider his announcements about that thing official. Who doesn't do this?

[dafire]

Staylost wrote...

You are calling garin an office cleaner? Look. If a guy makes something, yeah, I'm gonna consider his announcements about that thing official. Who doesn't do this?

No .. I don't think I called garin anything ? There must be something wrong with your eyes.
I don't call a forum post, that is not sticky, not in this forum, without a bioware tag or on an official blog, webpage or official twitter account an announcement in the first place It has already proven as wrong information with the beta part, so what is your problem ?

[Staylost]

dafire wrote...

Staylost wrote...

You are calling garin an office cleaner? Look. If a guy makes something, yeah, I'm gonna consider his announcements about that thing official. Who doesn't do this?

No .. I don't think I called garin anything ? There must be something wrong with your eyes.
I don't call a forum post, that is not sticky, not in this forum, without a bioware tag or on an official blog, webpage or official twitter account an announcement in the first place It has already proven as wrong information with the beta part, so what is your problem ?

I don't see anyone with a problem? Do you have a problem?

You clearly either meant Garin is an office cleaner or that his position is of similar relevance. Both are so absurd I wasn't sure which to believe. I apologize.

But, as has been explained again and again, Garin's writing about  the 13th and 20th was on his official blog. This was linked all over the web. Then it was ninja editted so it no longer exists. The proof that it did exist is on this forum in the form of Garin's gracious apology.

Anyway, you either believe Garin or you don't. If you think he is an "office cleaner" with no authority or place in DA:J, then he obviously doesn't deserve the attention.

I simply believe otherwise and continue to know that one of three things happened.

1. There was an internal miscommunication.
2. EA is toying with us for profit.
3. A major bug(s) was/were found.

[Vylan Antagonist]

"Official" announcements don't happen on developer blogs by definition. Garin is unquestionably an informed source, but he apparently spoke out of turn, not in any remotely official capacity. That's not the path official statements follow. But this is a remarkably silly thing to quibble over. It's also a big part of the reason developers eventually become very reluctant to provide much in the way of concrete information. Invariably, someone will take it as some sort of verbally binding promise and feel they are 'owed' whatever it was, be it the abililty to plant a seed and grow a tree (thanks, Peter!) or a free flash game on a particular date.



It's probably in EA's interests to get the game out as soon as feasibly possible, so it can keep generating traffic and heightening interest in Dragon Age. I'm sure everyone involved wishes it was ready, but apparently it isn't. It'll be released when it is. Multis sanguis fluit.

[dafire]

Staylost wrote...

But, as has been explained again and again, Garin's writing about  the 13th and 20th was on his official blog. This was linked all over the web. Then it was ninja editted so it no longer exists. The proof that it did exist is on this forum in the form of Garin's gracious apology.

So he already removed it and posted an apology that it was not an official announcement and  you still say it is a valid announcement because, hm.. why again? 

Modifié par dafire, 21 octobre 2009 - 05:13 .

[Staylost]

Once again, I've never said there was an official announcement. I said that it could be construed as a fact (that the release dates were real) seeing Garin's position.



So the whole point still is that the reason we are all here waiting for the game is because of the announcement Garin made on his blog, and that it is disappointing to many people that the game was not released by that stated time.



That disappointment is not anger, but is a compliment to the great work we believe they are doing.



To come in here and dismiss the whole thing as if it never happened is simply false.

[Vylan Antagonist]

Staylost wrote...

Once again, I've never said there was an official announcement. I said that it could be construed as a fact (that the release dates were real) seeing Garin's position.

Staylost wrote...
Look. If a guy makes something, yeah, I'm gonna consider his announcements about that thing official. Who doesn't do this?

Staylost wrote...
If a company employee makes a statement, it is official, unless specificaly otherwise stated.

Eh, life goes on. I definitely am with you in your eager anticipation for the flash game (and the full game to follow). It sounds like some of the more vitriolic complaints against Bioware have petered out, so I'm content to move on. Nobody is accusing Bioware of having burned their bibles or killed their war dogs any more, so I no longer feel compelled to white-knight.

 I still never got a good answer from Polemic05 about why he matter-of-factly stated that Black Isle developed Baldur's Gate and not Bioware, but it's probably better to let that rest as well.

[Staylost]

Vylan Antagonist wrote...

Staylost wrote...

Once again, I've never said there was an official announcement. I said that it could be construed as a fact (that the release dates were real) seeing Garin's position.

Staylost wrote...
Look. If a guy makes something, yeah, I'm gonna consider his announcements about that thing official. Who doesn't do this?

Staylost wrote...
If a company employee makes a statement, it is official, unless specificaly otherwise stated.

Eh, life goes on. I definitely am with you in your eager anticipation for the flash game (and the full game to follow). It sounds like some of the more vitriolic complaints against Bioware have petered out, so I'm content to move on. Nobody is accusing Bioware of having burned their bibles or killed their war dogs any more, so I no longer feel compelled to white-knight.

 I still never got a good answer from Polemic05 about why he matter-of-factly stated that Black Isle developed Baldur's Gate and not Bioware, but it's probably better to let that rest as well.

You are correct, but their is a difference in semantics.

What we consider official is different. I consider his statement official.

However, "is official" requires me to argue that everyone else shares my view of the meaning of the word. To me, I take it as official. To others, it may not be. I never argued that it is as a fact official, but that I consider it so.

The last statement you quoted is simply a legal truth unless the company in a direct and timely manner disputes it.

Quoting out of context ftl.

Well, either way, I am with you on being excited about Bioware and anything they are a part of putting out.

[Polemists05]

Well I thought I had stated that, my bad. Bioware was the license holder for Baldur's Gate but I still give the spirit of it to black isle. If you want a indepth reason, here is a whole article on how Black Isle is not Bioware

http://archive.games...ry01/blackisle/

So went on to Trokia, many to Obsidian, and yes I'm sure one or two is with Bioware.

I still am waiting for the browser, and still as matter of fact unhappy. Yet since the only reactions I get seem to be knee jerk developer defense, there's only so much of "I love bioware, they can do nothing wrong, and anything they do wrong is actually good".

It's a company, it has pro's, it has con's. It's cons to me is that it cannot hit any dates it sets for itself. It's pros are that it can make good games.

Modifié par Polemists05, 21 octobre 2009 - 05:53 .

[Naltair]

Arguing about nothing.

[Staylost]

Polemists05 wrote...

Well I thought I had stated that, my bad. Bioware was the license holder for Baldur's Gate but I still give the spirit of it to black isle. If you want a indepth reason, here is a whole article on how Black Isle is not Bioware

http://archive.games...ry01/blackisle/

So went on to Trokia, many to Obsidian, and yes I'm sure one or two is with Bioware.

I still am waiting for the browser, and still as matter of fact unhappy. Yet since the only reactions I get seem to be knee jerk developer defense, there's only so much of "I love bioware, they can do nothing wrong, and anything they do wrong is actually good".

It's a company, it has pro's, it has con's. It's cons to me is that it cannot hit any dates it sets for itself. It's pros are that it can make good games.

Though some may quibble with your points, this post is reasonable & fair, which differentiates it from those previously.

Were you just having a bad day yesterday?

I love Bioware! <3<3<3:wizard:

[Vylan Antagonist]

Polemists05 wrote...

Well I thought I had stated that, my bad. Bioware was the license holder for Baldur's Gate but I still give the spirit of it to black isle. If you want a indepth reason, here is a whole article on how Black Isle is not Bioware

I think I may be more aware of the difference than you seem to think. In any event, here are some quotes from the article link you provided:

Feargus said...
 "When BioWare was creating the first Baldur's Gate, they pretty much did it all themselves except with some very small things provided by us like a sound engine and a movie processor."

That seems to contrast pretty strongly with your position from earlier:

Polemists05 wrote...
Firstly, and most importantly Bioware did not create Baldur's Gate, though they claim credit left and right, it was black isle who was the true creator,

So as I said back then, it sounds like you are confusing the publisher and the developer. Bioware developed Baldur's Gate I and II and the Infinity Engine that Black Isle used for Icewind Dale and Torment. Black Isle is now essentially Obsidian, with guys like Feargus and Josh Sawyer now working there (and unfortunately having to deal with being published by Sega).