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Mages or Templars?


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#3151
The Hierophant

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@The Hierophant:  How much you want to bet that the spirit protects Rhys and Evangeline... Wynne's final gift to the DA series.
 
It would be a perfect ending to everything Wynne has ever wanted.  Protect her son... and bring sensible, reasonable order to the mage/templar conflict.
 
Hmm... Bioware, I hope this is one of your options.

Hopefully.

Evangeline going One Winged Angel would destroy Wynne's sacrifice.

#3152
Riverdaleswhiteflash

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On another note.

If Rhys is at the peace talks and is killed in the disaster, then what of Evangeline's fate? If she survives will the spirit that possesses her be corrupted from grief or something?

I got the impression that part of Justice's corruption into Vengeance was that Anders' anger was an easy vice for Justice (who has a black and white view of the world in which all wrongs have to be redressed regardless of who gets in the way) to fall into. So while it's possible for Evangeline's new spirit to be corrupted, I think it will be more resilient to it unless it experiences a stimulus that helps it take Faith (if I remember correctly that was what the spirit was supposed to be) too far.



#3153
Riverdaleswhiteflash

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The spirit blasts fired from a staff can leave traces like blue fire in DA2, and some of the hand nimbuses that appear when casting spirit/arcane spells can look like blue fire.

Then it's possible Adrian was being more responsible than I've been giving her credit for. That said, how do the other characters react to the spell? Do they seem to have any opinions as to what she was doing?



#3154
The Elder King

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You're not going to be persuade me if your starting point is that I'm biased. Pointing out that having templars watching over the mages no matter what choice we make addresses that the choice doesn't end up mattering if both choices lead to the same outcome.



So Cullen wouldn't be watching over the mages as a type of Knight-Vigilant, but simply acting as a general in the field of battle, and not watching over them or governing them if the Inquisitor sided with the mages who are fighting to maintain their autonomy from the Chantry?

I guess he'd still train with them and make them work with the other forces. But no, I don't think he'll have a KC/vigilant role.

#3155
Icy Magebane

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To be fair Uldred was a Pride Abomination. Not a walk in the park for anyone that isn't a player character.

That's a great justification so long as it also applies to the Templars who died in the tower.  I don't recall that being mentioned earlier... the statement was: "How many mages escaped the demonic assault in Broken Circle? Several.  How many templars did? None."  Aside from being false, it doesn't take into account the very large number of mages who were made into abominations.  But maybe I'm wrong.  Maybe details aren't really that important so long as the argument sounds good...



#3156
Riverdaleswhiteflash

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I guess he'd still train with them and make them work with the other forces. But no, I don't think he'd after a KC/vigilant role.

Well, someone has to do it. And it's under his purview. Which I think means that he's either doing the job or has the person who is doing it answering to him.


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#3157
Xilizhra

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Then it's possible Adrian was being more responsible than I've been giving her credit for. That said, how do the other characters react to the spell? Do they seem to have any opinions as to what she was doing?

Not beyond "don't throw magic at the peasants." Certainly there was no concern about burning the building down.



#3158
raging_monkey

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Then it's possible Adrian was being more responsible than I've been giving her credit for. That said, how do the other characters react to the spell? Do they seem to have any opinions as to what she was doing?

they joked how she burn the place down but spirit/arcane doesnt burn to my understanding

#3159
LobselVith8

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That's what I meant. I didn't mean he should act as a KC with the mages.

 

Fair enough. As long as Cullen respects the decision of the Inquisitor to side with the mages seeking to keep their independence from the Chantry (in that scenario), then I can live with that.



#3160
Medhia_Nox

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@Riverdaleswhiteflash:  Evangeline reacts before the situation spirals further out of control.



#3161
Riverdaleswhiteflash

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Not beyond "don't throw magic at the peasants." Certainly there was no concern about burning the building down.

 

they joked how she burn the place down but spirit/arcane doesnt burn to my understanding

Are we sure that this was just a joke, and not them trying to disguise honest concern as humor?

 

@Riverdaleswhiteflash:  Evangeline reacts before the situation spirals further out of control.

Yes, and I'm trying to figure out what would have happened if she hadn't.



#3162
The Hierophant

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I got the impression that part of Justice's corruption into Vengeance was that Anders' anger was an easy vice for Justice (who has a black and white view of the world in which all wrongs have to be redressed regardless of who gets in the way) to fall into. So while it's possible for Evangeline's new spirit to be corrupted, I think it will be more resilient to it unless it experiences a stimulus that helps it take Faith (if I remember correctly that was what the spirit was supposed to be) too far.


Interesting. She'll have to turn into a zealot in order to corrupt the spirit.

#3163
Xilizhra

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Are we sure that this was just a joke, and not them trying to disguise honest concern as humor?

Said joke doesn't appear in that scene and doesn't seem to be an immediate concern.



#3164
TK514

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You're not going to be persuade me if your starting point is that I'm biased. Pointing out that having templars watching over the mages no matter what choice we make addresses that the choice doesn't end up mattering if both choices lead to the same outcome.

 

 

So Cullen wouldn't be watching over the mages as a type of Knight-Vigilant, but simply acting as a general in the field of battle, and not watching over them or governing them if the Inquisitor sided with the mages who are fighting to maintain their autonomy from the Chantry?

 

Yes.  Cullen is your military adviser.  He directs and commands the troops of the Inquisition, and offers you advice on their use.  More importantly to your concern, he doesn't consider himself a Templar anymore.  So he 'watches over them and governs them' only so much as any commanding officer does. 



#3165
The Elder King

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Well, someone has to do it. And it's under his purview. Which I think means that he's either doing the job or has the person who is doing it answering to him.


Something like that might be possible. Maybe every faction we recruit has a leader, and they work together with Cullen. A chain of command will be likely present.

Fair enough. As long as Cullen respects the decision of the Inquisitor to side with the mages seeking to keep their independence from the Chantry (in that scenario), then I can live with that.

I think he'll respect either decision.

#3166
Riverdaleswhiteflash

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Interesting. She'll have to turn into a zealot in order to corrupt the spirit.

Or I might be wrong, and corrupting the spirit makes it do a complete 180. Didn't Gaider say something about Despair demons being worse than Pride demons?


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#3167
raging_monkey

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Are we sure that this was just a joke, and not them trying to disguise honest concern as humor? Yes, and I'm trying to figure out what would have happened if she hadn't.

possibly

#3168
Riverdaleswhiteflash

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Said joke doesn't appear in that scene and doesn't seem to be an immediate concern.

Fair enough.



#3169
The Hierophant

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Or I might be wrong, and corrupting the spirit makes it do a complete 180. Didn't Gaider say something about Despair demons being worse than Pride demons?

IIRC yeah. So she'll need to experience despair in order to corrupt the spirit?

So far i hope there's no angst involved with her character if she appears.

#3170
Hellion Rex

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Or I might be wrong, and corrupting the spirit makes it do a complete 180. Didn't Gaider say something about Despair demons being worse than Pride demons?

Not necessarily. That said, corrupting Faith turns it into Pride, not despair.


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#3171
Riverdaleswhiteflash

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Not necessarily. That said, corrupting Faith turns it into Pride, not despair.

That does make more sense in the context of what I understood to be the way Justice was corrupted. It's not a complete 180 and I can see how someone with too much Faith in themselves or the Spirit they're joined to might give into to Pride.



#3172
The Hierophant

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Not necessarily. That said, corrupting Faith turns it into Pride, not despair.

Thanks for the correction.

So she needs to become conceited in order to devolve like Anders, but that seems OoC for her though.

#3173
Steelcan

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wait, since when are spirits corrupted into demons.....



#3174
raging_monkey

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That does make more sense in the context of what I understood to be the way Justice was corrupted. It's not a complete 180 and I can see how someone with too much Faith in themselves or the Spirit they're joined to might give into to Pride.

make me wish the pc would be spirit bound

#3175
Riverdaleswhiteflash

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wait, since when are spirits corrupted into demons.....

Since early into Dragon Age 2.