even the antomical study of it is frowned(idk if completely banned) its a slippery road does it give equal chance against templars but you get a higher chancer of possession
Anything too close to study of the body is probably treated with caution. I think it's fair to say that anatomical knowledge could help one's blood magic abilities considerably.
Lyrium is really rare, and the Chantry controls the lyrium trade with the dwarves. And he dwarves are the only ones alive who can safely mine it, and they only sell a small portion to the surface that they don't use themselves.
Merrill says she would've used lyrium to cleanse the shard had she had buckets of it, but she didn't and couldn't get access to it.
This shows that while lyrium is most certainly capable of the job, actually getting it for magic rituals or amplifying spells is another thing entirely.
Which is basically what I've been saying here... lyrium does everything that blood can do, except a few very specific types of spells like mind control, the physical manipulation of blood, a very specific type of life drain, and demon summoning. For the most part, blood magic is redundant when a mage has access to lyrium, so I don't see it having much value on its own. It's true that there are a few things that only blood magic can do, but these abilities lack widespread applicability that would somehow give them an advantage over normal spells, which was the original point...
thank you. I agree its like getting holopoints for a gun if you a civi its overkill from my understandingAnything too close to study of the body is probably treated with caution. I think it's fair to say that anatomical knowledge could help one's blood magic abilities considerably.
Which is basically what I've been saying here... lyrium does everything that blood can do, except a few very specific types of spells like mind control, the physical manipulation of blood, a very specific type of life drain, and demon summoning. For the most part, blood magic is redundant when a mage has access to lyrium, so I don't see it having much value on its own. It's true that there are a few things that only blood magic can do, but none of them are inherently useful, which was the original point...
Lyrium may be able to do everything blood can do if the person using it is moral, but actually getting it is very difficult. Blood is readily available.
You have to have a fortune to buy enough lyrium to use it exclusively, it's the most valuable ore in the world.
Arguing for using it exclusively simply cannot work because there's not enough of it for every mage, not to mention the templars are addicted to it as well.
You actually think Hawke could have defeated the army of Templars that was left?
What makes you think those numbers were equal? Most, if not all, prisons in the world have more inmates than guards.
And need I remind that the White Spire was the only Circle who actually suceeded in killing the Templars stationed there?
Yeah Hawke would have easily killed them, Hawke defeated an ancient magister, a harvester, a behemoth to be (Meredith). Some puny maniacs who think maker is on their side would be a breeze. How else do you explain their fear? They were afraid of Hawke, plain and simple and regardless of the side you chose.
The fact that you think any of these things equate to an army shows that it's probably a waste of time even talking to you.
Lyrium may be able to do everything blood can do if the person using it is moral, but actually getting it is very difficult. Blood is readily available.
Actually, in Gaider's interview with Lady Insanity, he makes a point of saying that blood magic does have a few spells that are unique to blood magic, so it's pretty clear that lyrium can't do mind control. Lyrium (in great abundance) can equal blood magic in raw power, but blood magic does have some extra things that it can do.
Which is basically what I've been saying here... lyrium does everything that blood can do, except a few very specific types of spells like mind control, the physical manipulation of blood, a very specific type of life drain, and demon summoning. For the most part, blood magic is redundant when a mage has access to lyrium, so I don't see it having much value on its own. It's true that there are a few things that only blood magic can do, but these abilities lack widespread applicability that would somehow give them an advantage over normal spells, which was the original point...
Lyrium is expensive. Opening your own hand is cheap in a setting where you can gesture the wound away instead of needing to pay a doctor to close it. (I will note that opening someone else is cheaper, but that has nothing to do with whether or not blood magic is powerful.)
Anything too close to study of the body is probably treated with caution. I think it's fair to say that anatomical knowledge could help one's blood magic abilities considerably.
Blood magic is so sans morals. It never ends well, no matter what the original intent was. Best to not even test those waters.
Lyrium may be able to do everything blood can do if the person using it is moral, but actually getting it is very difficult. Blood is readily available.
You have to have a fortune to buy enough lyrium to use it exclusively, it's the most valuable ore in the world.
Arguing for using it exclusively simply cannot work because there's not enough of it for every mage, not to mention the templars are addicted to it as well.
Tbh, I get the feeling that I'm not even arguing the same scenario as the people in this conversation... Lyrium is readily available to Circle mages so long as they fill out the right forms, but that's not what we're discussing is it? We're talking about apostates using blood magic out in the wilderness or in cities so that they don't have to deal with the dwarves or Chantry. From that perspective, yes I agree that it's far more practical... but in the case of Circle mages, I don't see the need to be casting that many spells in the first place. *shrugs* If the conversation is going to focus on apostates doing what it takes to survive, I guess I can't really disagree... they are already in violation of the law, so what is one more?
Which is basically what I've been saying here... lyrium does everything that blood can do, except a few very specific types of spells like mind control, the physical manipulation of blood, a very specific type of life drain, and demon summoning. For the most part, blood magic is redundant when a mage has access to lyrium, so I don't see it having much value on its own. It's true that there are a few things that only blood magic can do, but these abilities lack widespread applicability that would somehow give them an advantage over normal spells, which was the original point...
the more violent the bllod spent the greater power you yeildLyrium is expensive. Opening your own hand is cheap in a setting where you can gesture the wound away instead of needing to pay a doctor to close it. (I will note that opening someone else is cheaper, but that has nothing to do with whether or not blood magic is powerful.)
The only type of magic that Templars cannot resist is blood magic and spirit magic (magic that comes directly from a fade entity). This is also why blood mages and abominations are very dangerous because there is no way to counter them, not directly anyway.
So in other words its "best" way to fight Templars.
I thought Asunder noted that the ordinary Templar arts work against blood magic, just not as well?
(And we've known since the first game that the Templars have something for Blood Magic.)
the more violent the bllod spent the greater power you yeild
And that's the major problem with blood magic: that it works much better for an evil person than it does for a good person because its power is directly correlated to how much you can debase yourself without feeling bad. And you can argue, I suppose, that it should be banned for this reason. But that has nothing to do with my point in that post: that it has advantages over the use of lyrium.
The only type of magic that Templars cannot resist is blood magic and spirit magic (magic that comes directly from a fade entity). This is also why blood mages and abominations are very dangerous because there is no way to counter them, not directly anyway.
So in other words its "best" way to fight Templars.
Yeah... blood magic is great for resisting arrest. I can't say that I endorse that, but I can't disagree.
Blood magic is so sans morals. It never ends well, no matter what the original intent was. Best to not even test those waters.
Not disagreeing, but I was just trying to dissect Chantry reasoning for anatomical knowledge being warily watched.
There are instances of a mage killing hundreds of people. Also this "army" had fear of said character. You are not even considering all the facts here.The fact that you think any of these things equate to an army shows that it's probably a waste of time even talking to you.
I thought Asunder noted that the ordinary Templar arts work against blood magic, just not as well?
(And we've known since the first game that the Templars have something for Blood Magic.)
They do work against a blood magic laced fire spell in Asunder, though it was a lot harder for Evangeline to dispel/block. I think mind control or blood rending would be damn near impossible for a templar to stop.
They do work against a blood magic laced fire spell in Asunder, though it was a lot harder for Evangeline to dispel/block. I think mind control or blood rending would be damn near impossible for a templar to stop.
And I think that if they have the Litany of Adralla independent of the mages' copies, (which they'd be stupid not to, and which Lambert seems to) they'd do it easily.
And I think that if they have the Litany of Adralla independent of the mages' copies, (which they'd be stupid not to, and which Lambert seems to) they'd do it easily.
Only if you manage to interrupt the mind control spell in progress before it's completed. And the Litany still doesn't stop blood boiling.
litany of andralla(spelling) is generally a templars only defence in those situationsThey do work against a blood magic laced fire spell in Asunder, though it was a lot harder for Evangeline to dispel/block. I think mind control or blood rending would be damn near impossible for a templar to stop.
I thought Asunder noted that the ordinary Templar arts work against blood magic, just not as well?
(And we've known since the first game that the Templars have something for Blood Magic.)
And that's the major problem with blood magic: that it works much better for an evil person than it does for a good person because its power is directly correlated to how much you can debase yourself without feeling bad. And you can argue, I suppose, that it should be banned for this reason. But that has nothing to do with my point in that post: that it has advantages over the use of lyrium.
Only if you manage to interrupt the mind control spell in progress before it's completed. And the Litany still doesn't stop blood boiling.
Doesn't Lambert use it to dispel rather than counterspelling in Asunder? As for blood boiling, that's still a problem, but that alone is less of a problem than mind control and blood boiling.
Most Templar talents work before or while the spell is being cast. After the cast is complete its over. A templar cannot do anything against a fireball already flying towards him. This is much more true about blood magic, because lyrium can party help with surviving magical injuries too, but the Lyrium is the Templar's blood through injection and drinking therefore if the magic affects the blood itself that's bad news. Once a blood magic spell is cast, such as blood poisoning or mind control then there is nothing to be done about it. It can only be stopped before the cast is complete.
The codex entry on abominations notes that the Templars can actively block some spells that are flying towards them.
Most Templar talents work before or while the spell is being cast. After the cast is complete its over. A templar cannot do anything against a fireball already flying towards him. This is much more true about blood magic, because lyrium can party help with surviving magical injuries too, but the Lyrium is the Templar's blood through injection and drinking therefore if the magic affects the blood itself that's bad news. Once a blood magic spell is cast, such as blood poisoning or mind control then there is nothing to be done about it. It can only be stopped before the cast is complete.
I will say that Evangeline was able to raise an aura/shield to defend against a blast of fire, so it's possible to defend against such spells.
There are instances of a mage killing hundreds of people.
No, there really aren't.
Also this "army" had fear of said character. You are not even considering all the facts here.
No it wasn't. The army wasn't even there yet.
A harvster took out a whole front of Tevinter and dwarf army combined and I'm quite positive it would have decimated Templars and Kirkwall before being killed.
Your definition of army is a little of base, but this really means nothing. We have dragonslayers being taken out by a few people.
See golems of Angmark for more info on harvesters.
Orsino was hardly a harvester. He just looked like one.
So if a person defeated a harvester... well... I have a bridge to sell you if you think the remaining Templars could defeat Hawke AND his companions. Its not like he was alone, all your allies were in that fight.
All 8 of them. Let's go take on an army we were just losing to.
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