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Mages or Templars?


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#1801
Master Warder Z_

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More that just mages. Rogue mages to be specific, but most of them seem to forget that.

 

And even then, the answer to all that training and lyrium swilling is this... BloodMage-Icon-DA2.png

 

It won't stop a blade from cleaving your head from your shoulders or an arrow piercing your heart.

 

Blood Mages aren't anymore invincible or less cowardly then their normal kin.



#1802
Master Warder Z_

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Only had vows and a vigil left between him and knighthood.

 

To be realistic, it looks like the Templar recruitment and training process... leaves much to be desired.

 

You listed four out of an order of Thousands.

 

._.



#1803
The Baconer

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They would have, if given the order, on that i would bet money.

 

They were already given the order to arrest the Champion by their Knight Commander before that.

 

20 bucks?



#1804
Lulupab

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More that just mages. Rogue mages to be specific, but most of them seem to forget that.
 
And even then, the answer to all that training and lyrium swilling is this... BloodMage-Icon-DA2.png


Or this:

Vengeance.png

Spirit magic is as strong and hard to resist and the bonus is you will be immune to tranquility.

#1805
Icy Magebane

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Only had vows and a vigil left between him and knighthood.

 

To be realistic, it looks like the Templar recruitment and training process... leaves much to be desired.

Alistair was pretty much forced into the Chantry by Arl Eamon.  Normally, Templars are volunteers who are then selected for knighthood based on their skills, discipline, and dedication.  If he hadn't been backed by Eamon, Alistair probably would have been kicked out of the Chantry long ago... he's not even qualified to keep the Holy Brazier lit.



#1806
Guest_TheDarkKnightReturns_*

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It won't stop a blade from cleaving your head from your shoulders or an arrow piercing your heart.

 

Blood Mages aren't anymore invincible or less cowardly then their normal kin.

 

Mages are dangerous so Templars use lyrium because a sword and shield isn't enough. So mages turn to blood magic. Where's the escalation? Red lyrium. LOL



#1807
Master Warder Z_

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They were already given the order to arrest the Champion by their Knight Commander before that.

 

20 bucks?

 

Which their immediate superior rejected out of hand.

 

Sure, Take it in bitcoins?



#1808
The Baconer

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You listed four out of an order of Thousands.

 

._.

 

More than four. Of course, I doubt we'll ever receive an exact figure of the number of looters and murderers in DA:I... or Red Templars.



#1809
Master Warder Z_

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Mages are dangerous so Templars use lyrium because a sword and shield isn't enough. So mages turn to blood magic. Where's the escalation? Red lyrium. LOL

 

No, its called ram a yard of steel into their heart and watch them topple over in their fancy dress.



#1810
Icy Magebane

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Or this:

Vengeance.png

Spirit magic is as strong and hard to resist and the bonus is you will be immune to tranquility.

Not really... Anders/Vengeance may have been a powerful abomination, but their abilities draw from mana rather than blood, and thus they are vulnerable to the Templar talents like all magic users.



#1811
Guest_TheDarkKnightReturns_*

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No, its called ram a yard of steel into their heart and watch them topple over in their fancy dress.

 

If they even manage to unsheathe their sword before their blood begins to boil...



#1812
lil yonce

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Sorry, I got sloppy and started using the two terms interchangeably...  my point still got across, I hope.  Normal, mana-based spellcasting cannot be considered to be more risky than blood-based spellcasting since it is used by all Circle mages yet does not result in demons swarming into the mortal realm on a regular basis, if ever.  The idea that blood magic is somehow safer because it supposedly doesn't draw power directly from the Fade is conjecture at best.  We even have an example of blood magic being used specifically to draw power from a demon in DA2 when Merrill uses blood to open the barrier to Sundermount.  Although she disagrees on the exact nature of the creature, she admits to calling one and used blood magic to do so, thus blood magic does not bypass the Fade entirely and is clearly shown to be capable of drawing the attention of spirits and demons.

Its not conjecture - blood magic is not tied to the fade. It is the only magic tied to the physical world. The DA2 specialization states that. 

 

"[...] but this specialization isn't limited to madmen and monsters. Many see it as the only form of magic that is truly free, because its tied to the physical, not favors to spirits or demons." - http://dragonage.wik...(Dragon_Age_II)

 

Casting from mana is more risky than casting with blood. It isn't frequency of possession that determines it being more risky - its mechanics. There is always a chance that a mage drawing on the fade to cast can come to the attention of demons. There is zero chance of that happening when a mage casts with blood.

 

Merrill called on and summoned a demon, yes, and blood magic is also commonly used to summon demons, but not all blood magic, as the entry above notes, requires that. It specifically says that blood magic is considered a free school of magic because it is not tied to the fade or to the favor of spirits and demons. Merrill's use of blood magic, a more specialized use, would not fall under this general statement, but that does not mean that the statement is never true.



#1813
Master Warder Z_

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If they even manage to unsheathe their sword before their blood begins to boil...

 

You know what the downside to AOE spells is?

 

You surely do, but i'll say it anyway, outside of that area of effect, nothing happens.

 

And Templars have Bows ._.

 

an arrow in the face is as good as a sword thrust into the chest.

 

Seriously, they run into battle in skirts.



#1814
Riverdaleswhiteflash

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No, its called ram a yard of steel into their heart and watch them topple over in their fancy dress.

Which is why they tried to find a castle to put between them and that yard of steel.



#1815
The Baconer

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Which their immediate superior rejected out of hand.

 

Sure, Take it in bitcoins?

 

Who does not have the authority to do so if Hawke is aiding the mages. Doubly so if Hawke is an apostate.



#1816
Master Warder Z_

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as the entry above notes

 

Which is it self contradicted in game.

 

And outside of it, Even the writings of a blood mage theorizes that blood magic comes from demonic origins.

 

This is further backed up by Avernus and several other sources, so this assumption that using blood doesn't tap into the fade to me seems just conjecture trying to legitimize a school of magic created by fade creatures.



#1817
Guest_TheDarkKnightReturns_*

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You know what the downside to AOE spells is?

 

You surely do, but i'll say it anyway, outside of that area of effect, nothing happens.

 

And Templars have Bows ._.

 

an arrow in the face is as good as a sword thrust into the chest.

 

Seriously, they run into battle in skirts.

 

Blood Magic Fueled Fireball and Firestorm vs Arrows...

 

And the Scottish went into battle wearing skirts too. Your point? Not that all that templar armor will help much when they're cooking inside of it.



#1818
Master Warder Z_

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Who does not have the authority to do so if Hawke is aiding the mages. Doubly so if Hawke is an apostate.

 

Cullen had the authority to relieve of command once he deemed her unfit, so how exactly does he not have the authority to order an attack?

 

He was acting Knight Commander after her death, Gaider said that.



#1819
Lulupab

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Not really... Anders/Vengeance may have been a powerful abomination, but their abilities draw from mana rather than blood, and thus they are vulnerable to the Templar talents like all magic users.


The Anders short story doesn't really show it.

But if we are looking at what we know, Anders literally has infinite connection to the fade and is safe from demonic possession because he is already possessed. He can cast spells relentlessly and without any real limit, his connection to the fade cannot be severed not even temporarily therefore he is immune to tranquility. The spirit magic is very hard to resist stated in codex and applied in both games. it ignores 50% of all resistances combined before dealing its damage.

Templars might be able to resist Anders' spells but Anders can keep casting them without any real limit, if anyone is going to be tired it will be the Templars. Indeed Rolan survived Anders' spell but he drank Lyrium just recently and those Templars who didn't melted.

#1820
Riverdaleswhiteflash

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He was acting Knight Commander after he death, Gaider said that.

Why precisely would he need to put that into words? Isn't it generally accepted that if one guy is explicitly second in command, he's the guy you listen to if the head dies and he doesn't?



#1821
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Blood Magic Fueled Fireball and Firestorm vs Arrows...

 

Right, first it was blood wound, now its fireballs and storms, make up your mind.

 

Because if i recall correctly, you cannot cast another spell in the middle of casting one before its actually launched.

 

Beyond that, every attack just makes the mage weaker and easier to kill.

 

Hope he doesn't leave survives after the initial volley.



#1822
Master Warder Z_

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Why precisely would he need to put that into words?

 

...This is BSN.



#1823
Icy Magebane

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Casting from mana can certainly be more risky than casting with blood. It isn't frequency of possession that determines it being more risky, its mechanics. There is always a chance that a mage drawing on the fade to cast can come to the attention of demons. There is zero chance of that happening when a mage casts with blood.

Yet this never happens in the Circle, where all mages cast spells using mana... If there was a high degree of risk involved, mages wouldn't be allowed to cast spells at all.  Care to address that point?  Where are you even getting the idea that normal spellcasting can cause a mage to become possessed?  If it's based on your theory that a mage is temporarily inside the Fade whenever they cast a spell, I'll tell you right now that I disagree with your argument.



#1824
Riverdaleswhiteflash

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...This is BSN.

Oh, right.



#1825
Icy Magebane

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The Anders short story doesn't really show it.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but weren't you saying a few days ago that the short story could not be used to confirm Anders being a cannibalistic abomination because it wasn't canon?  Which one is it?  You can't pick and choose which parts to accept and which to reject...

 

As for the rest of your post, Templars are trained to kill abominations.  Anders isn't so unique that he can't be defeated by standard procedure.