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[Icy Magebane]

Well would you oppose guy with god-like power and his army of angels that conquering the world? Well i could see many peoples going join that guy even simple out of fear or vast power.Well often spreading religion involve conquering and enforcing religion on others so well same can be here after as i said will you argue with creature that can crush you easily.  

I get what you're saying, but the Elder One and its minions are far too destructive and are disrupting the power of ancient kingdoms.  Although small cults may arise to worship the Elder One, these kingdoms will raise armies to oppose it, therefore the majority will reject this new religion.  Now, if the Elder One manages to destroy all of these armies, then that would probably cause the remnants of humanity to surrender... but I don't think that's going to be the case since our PC is in direct opposition to the Elder One.  I mean, yes there is a "demon's win" outcome, apparently, but that's a fail state, not a legitimate ending to the story.

 

Adding this so that I avoid double posting...

 

that and again. Nothing about the term priest makes it gender related.

I saw that you mentioned it earlier, and I agree, but didn't bother to say anything.  It's true that the term is gender neutral in some cultures, but in mine the world "priestess" exists for a reason.  DA seems to be pretty focused on blurring the lines between genders, so I don't see a reason why they'd use "priestess" if it could be avoided.

[TheKomandorShepard]

See, but Andraste had a cause that allowed her religion to challenge the Old Gods.  She rallied around the evils of Magic and the Imperium was unpopular with its slaves to begin with.

 

No such situation exists with the chantry. The faithful aren't attacking it in mass or leaving it.  They are happy with it.

Well it all depends who you will ask we already have cases where peoples went to qunari even if they weren't converting because simple they were unhappy with current situation and i rather doubt that even tevinter was nothing but misery otherwise simple it would fall crushed by majority of it.Not to mention when powerful creature start throw questions like where is your maker now if inq did the same and well he is only guy that can save the day it would work.

 

I get what you're saying, but the Elder One and its minions are far too destructive and are disrupting the power of ancient kingdoms.  Although small cults may arise to worship the Elder One, these kingdoms will raise armies to oppose it, therefore the majority will reject this new religion.  Now, if the Elder One manages to destroy all of these armies, then that would probably cause the remnants of humanity to surrender... but I don't think that's going to be the case since our PC is in direct opposition to the Elder One.  I mean, yes there is a "demon's win" outcome, apparently, but that's a fail state, not a legitimate ending to the story.

 

To be honest we don't know how destructive he is and even his plan is rather unclear and we have only shreds of it he may be mindset knee or i will destroy you if he will prove that he have power to do that he would start gain new followers and even before inq could create something new in opposition to his cult.But i will repeat myself we know already it won't be in case.  

[HK-90210]

The thread title implies that the Chantry will fall without our help. I respectfully disagree. Time and time again human history has shown that people turn to the church, and religion in general, when the sh*t hits the fan. I firmly believe that the Chantry will survive.

 

That being said, there's no way it will be the same after the coming conflict. How and it will be different, I don't know. But I anticipate.....

 

[Mabari-Master]

Even before the game starts it is heavily implied that the Chantry has already fallen. It's templars have broken away from them, the no longer have control over mages and at the very begining of DA:I many of its leaders were killed in the explosion during the peace summit.

 

However, like you said, I don't think the Chantry will actually go away or be dissolved, but I do think that the Chantry's fate in the sense of how strong or influential it may be at the end of it all depends entirely on the player. Perhaps it will be remade stonger than it was, maybe there will be serious reformations in how it is run or maybe it will be a ruined shadow of what it once was. I guess that will depend entirely on the Inquisitor.

[Master Warder Z_]

 I guess that will depend entirely on the Inquisitor.

 

Your overstating PC ability i think.

 

The Chantry is a useful institution for the devs, its a banner for the human race to rally under for threats, and that by it self makes it an almost impossible thing to be rid of.

 

Because its by far the easy method of getting the individual human nations to work together.

[Mabari-Master]

Your overstating PC ability i think.

 

You never know. Commander Shepard had the ability to make some pretty earth-shattering choice, so to speak. Depending on his/her choices whole species could have gone extinct or even the galaxy being wiped out. Who's to say that the Inquisitors choices might not have the same impact?

 

Perhaps the Chantry won't go away because, as you've said, it is a useful institution, but I think that depending on the players choices the Chantry could either be strong again or it could be left very weak.

[Master Warder Z_]

Your overstating PC ability i think.

 

 

You never know. Commander Shepard had the ability to make some pretty earth-shattering choices

 

All of which ultimately didn't matter in the least.

 

So unless if DAI is basically going to railroad players, i don't see the comparison.

[Urazz]

Even before the game starts it is heavily implied that the Chantry has already fallen. It's templars have broken away from them, the no longer have control over mages and at the very begining of DA:I many of its leaders were killed in the explosion during the peace summit.

 

However, like you said, I don't think the Chantry will actually go away or be dissolved, but I do think that the Chantry's fate in the sense of how strong or influential it may be at the end of it all depends entirely on the player. Perhaps it will be remade stonger than it was, maybe their will be serious reformations in how it is run or maybe it will be a ruined shadow of what it once was. I guess that will depend entirely on the Inquisitor.

Nah, the Chantry hasn't fallen but it is extremely weakened and I think it regaining some of it's strength will be dependent on the Inquisitor.

[Mabari-Master]

Nah, the Chantry hasn't fallen but it is extremely weakened and I think it regaining some of it's strength will be dependent on the Inquisitor.

Thank you. That's exactly what I've been trying to get at.

[Drasanil]

My first/canon play through is going to be as a Dalish-Mage, so if its really 'Andraste' that gives the Inquisitor the golden high five regardless of race/origin, its going to make for one hell of an interesting play through. 

 

I'll probably try ending up reforming the Chantry and bringing it back to its roots. Hopefully we can do stuff like reinstate the Canticles of Shartan so that elves have a tangible stake in the Chantry itself.

[zqrahll]

I would love the option to be able to cause/help the Chantry fall, but I don't for a second believe that Bioware will actually allow us to do that for the sake of future games.

 

To that end, I don't even really think we'll get a satisfying conclusion to the Mage vs. Templars war.

[EmissaryofLies]

I have a conflicted view.

 

On one hand, I'd like nothing more than to kick in the door and wave the 44. But on the other hand the institution could make itself useful and sway public opinion to where I'd like it to be. 

 

It comes down to the salient Mass Effect question of control or destroy. 

[Lilaeth]

If the chantry goes, thedas will go down with it.

 

Rome was a centerpiece of its time as well, doing the same practices you proscribed the chantry did. When they fell, the people they once governed fell to ruination, ignorance, and anarchy. Marauding hordes became the dominant power, a cult of personality rose to take over the western world, the east grew powerful then highly isolationist, and the people fragmented into many little "kingdoms", waring amongst themselves and killing, raping, pillaging, and conquering for nearly a thousand years after. This period would come to be known as the dark ages, and it took rediscovering old knowledge in order for people to start pulling themselves out of the muck of what had been wrought before them to clammer back to a semblance of greatness again.

 

Make no mistake that without a powerful non-territory bound organization in place, the world of thedas will most likely tear itself asunder. Wars will be waged, blood will be split, and all you will do is replace the one religious overseer with a entire host of nationalist overseers, with no need for such silly things as laws against slavery or aid to the poor to bog them down, as they would have with the chantry's rallying.

 

Too many on these forums only look at this from the perspective of the mage/templar angles. They do not see the legitimate good the chantry does, or the stability it offers when less charitable and tolerant forces would close in to threaten the common people, who will bear the brunt of the chantrys fall while thier kind lords become warlords and feast upon their people relentlessly for power.

 

Like Rome didn't also spend hundreds of years raping, murdering and pillaging?  Destroying entire nations because they wanted to remain themselves, and not become Roman?  Enthroning Emperors to whom the cult of personality was the breath of life?  They inflicted the very things you hold up as a consequence of their destruction on the population of most of the known world, and you think this makes them better than the alternative?  My own people had rules that were far more fair and equitable, including the legal equality of men and women, but the Romans didn't like that, so they sent the legions in to make sure women were relegated to their proper place, among other things.  They heard rumours of a nation with vast supplies of gold, so they killed every man, woman and child to get a hold of it.  Those nations that fell into 'ignorance' at the fall of Rome would have been fine, had Rome left them alone in the first place - 'free of Roman influence' does not equate to 'ignorance'.  Unless you're Roman, of course!  Rome?  I spit on it!

 

As for the Chantry?  Kill.  It.  With.  Fire.  The small goods they might do don't make up for the larger injustices they perpetrate.  So either destroy it totally, or reduce it to the point where it cannot influence more than the followers making up individual parishes.

[Grand Admiral Cheesecake]

Salty snip

 

https://www.youtube....h?v=ExWfh6sGyso

 

The only response to such heresy.

[Lilaeth]

 

I have hated the Romans and their works for a very, very long time - you'll never change my mind!  To me, they are just the Borg.  Created nothing worthwhile of their own, just robbed other nations and cultures to cobble their own together.  

 

I will admit that my antipathy towards the Chantry might be a result of it reminding me very strongly of the Catholic Church at its mediaeval, meddling worst.  Before anyone calls me a bigot, I was brought up a Catholic, and most of my family are still practicing Catholics.  But a lot of what's written about the Chantry does seem to be to be based on its history - shame we can't have the equivalent of a Borgia Pope to play with!  

[Willowhugger]

The Chantry is very much the Medieval Church stand-in but, frankly, it seems to be LESS politically ruthless and greedy from what we see.

For example, there's no indication that the Chantry is a substantial landowner from what we see in the games.

 

The Catholic Church had massive property in most parts of Europe, deeply immeshing it in the Feudal System.

[Peer of the Empire]

The Inquisitor will restore the Chantry as the shield and guardian of Mankind against demons and elvenkind

[Reaverwind]

The Inquisitor will restore the Chantry as the shield and guardian of Mankind against demons and elvenkind

 

Elvenkind? 

[Grand Admiral Cheesecake]

Elvenkind? 

 

Indeed. The elves won't be a threat after we've exterminated the Dalish!

[lordsaren101]

I seriously hope we have an option of turning the Chantry to ash. I detest the self righteous bullshit that is Andrastrianism. Worship of the Elder One is far more palatable. Here is to hoping that we can take over the Venatori and serve our new god.

[Hazegurl]

For almost a thousand years the Chantry has been the hub of enlightenment and salvation to thousands, but to others it has been the centerpiece to oppression and bigotry.

 

Over the course of its history the Chantry has brought thousands upon thousands of people to abandoned their heathen gods to go to the side of the Maker. But at the same time it has invaded and destroyed whole cultures who refused to abandon their beliefs, the most famous being the Exalted March on the Dales.

 

For centuries the Chantry has stewarded magic and prevented the rise of another Tevinter Imperium by establishing the Circle of Magi and The Templar Order to carefully watch over and mentor the mages. But this in turn gave rise to the oppression and vilification of all mages under the reign of the White Divine.

 

They claim to want to spread the love of the Maker and his bride to all people, yet the elves live in squalor and the mages are treated as prisoners.

 

Was the Kirkwall incident really Grand-Cleric Elthina's fault?

 

Now that the Chantry's power has been stripped bare and its leadership is in shambles and it is left up to the Inquisitor to reestablish the order it once held. But as the Inquisitor should we even allow the Chantry to ever have the power it once had or should we let it fall into pieces and let the world solve its own problems?

I would personally let the Chantry fall and transform it into something new and non religious. Although I doubt the world would just stop believing so in the end it would just be another "religion".

 

It was partly Elthina's fault. She was old and tired and didn't want to deal with her job and everyone coddled her for it.  But overall, the only person at fault for the bombing was Anders.

[lordsaren101]

Anders did the right thing. It was a shot across the arrogant noses of the Chantry. I fully supported his decision. Sometimes for a greater good, people have to die. It is inevitable. The Chantry and its false god were founded in violence and bloodshed, it is only fitting that they should be brought down in the same manner. 

[Willowhugger]

I really hope we can be Pro-Andraste and Anti-Chantry.

That's asking a lot, though.

[Mabari-Master]

I'm all for reformation of the Chantry, but I don't think it can ever be anything but the center of a religion because that's the whole point of its existence.

[EmperorSahlertz]

I would personally let the Chantry fall and transform it into something new and non religious. Although I doubt the world would just stop believing so in the end it would just be another "religion".

 

It was partly Elthina's fault. She was old and tired and didn't want to deal with her job and everyone coddled her for it.  But overall, the only person at fault for the bombing was Anders.

How the hell will you transform a religious institution, which entire existance is bound up in being religious, into a non-religious institution?? Kind of defeats the entire purpose of the Chantry...