That's how all necromancy works.... demons would require blood magic, while other spirits would fall into the spirit school.
This is how the necromancy you've seen works. Not how all necromancy works. Considering Gaider right out said this isn't blood magic and that blood mage wouldn't work as a spec, this isn't blood magic.
This is how the necromancy you've seen works. Not how all necromancy works. Considering Gaider right out said this isn't blood magic and that blood mage wouldn't work as a spec, this isn't blood magic.
Yes, but as NoForgiveness has explained, if mages don't use demons, only spirits, they can use the perfectly legal Spirit Scool to practice Necromancy. In fact, Nevarran Necromancy uses spirits.
Yes, but as NoForgiveness has explained, if mages don't use demons, only spirits, they can use the perfectly legal Spirit Scool to practice Necromancy. In fact, Nevarran Necromancy uses spirits.
I'm saying it's probably not going to work the same as it did before, with Skeletons and such. It's more about answering the OP with a definite no.
I've always had a fascination with the darker aspects of magic and my previous Mage Warden and Hawke were both blood mages. With the introduction of the Necromancer specialization and previous examples of necromancy in the games make me wonder if blood magic is an aspect of the specialization. Afterall raising the dead can hardly be seen as a benign act. What are your thoughts and opinions?
Me and both my Warden and Hawke are in the same situation as you.
I hope either Necromancy or Rift Magic are Blood Magic because there doesn´t seem to be a Blood Mage specialization this year, at least by name, so I hope either one of those are related with Blood Magic.
I think the lore concerning blood magic has become rather muddled over the last two games and so it has been removed as a spec because of all the problems it created. On the whole DAO and the books suggest blood magic to be something that the bad guys do. If the Warden wanted to learn the blood magic spec they had to sacrifice the soul of Connor, so the Warden becomes something of an anti-hero as a result. However, you could effectively do necromancy in DAO without it having any adverse implications for your hero.
In DA2 it was far less clear cut. Despite both Anders and Fenris condemning the practice and coming down hard on Merrill for using it, there really seemed no adverse reaction for Hawke becoming a blood mage. They could draw on their companions life force and no one objected. By contrast, when blood magic was linked to necromancy, both were condemned. Alaine (and Anders) reject the raising of the dead as reprehensible and of course Quentin is researching advanced necromancy.
The Chantry's chief objection to blood magic is its strong connection with demons and the fact that it is frequently used as a means of controlling other people's minds. By contrast phylacteries use blood in a magical way to track people, so they would argue it is magic using blood as a focus rather than blood/demon fuelled magic. I presume the same holds true of such things as the Grey Warden joining ritual, which uses blood and magic and required the use of non Grey Warden mages at Ostagar.
Hopefully Inquisition will clear up some of this confusion. However, since spirit healer has also been removed, it may be that blood magic was removed for story/lore reasons connected with the Fade tear rather than any evil connotations. Basically demons aren't interested in aiding you anymore since they can get out of the Fade and have their fun without having to rely on a mage connecting with them.
I dare say necromancy will be something that could be regarded as evil depending on how it is used but will require the normal expending of mana to work. Formerly you could have used blood instead of manner to do so but no longer. So it will be ordinary magic, not blood magic.
My understanding is that Blood Magic has more to do with the source of power and how the source leads to you being able to directly manipulate and control live people.
Necromancy is still traditional magic in how it operates and its source; it gets sinister in the results of the power being able to manipulate and control the dead and their spirits.
I'm saying it's probably not going to work the same as it did before, with Skeletons and such. It's more about answering the OP with a definite no.
I understand your point. However, we don't know anything about Necromancy in DA:I's gameplay, so who says that one thing is more probable than the other? The Spirit School in DA:O had the spell "animate dead", and it didn't require blood magic. So as far as we really know, Necromancy could work like NoForgiveness said.
I don't think its blood magic. Entropy spell tree is pretty dark but not frowned upon by the Chantry to the extent blood magic is. BM draws power from blood and not mana, so technically no.
Wait, Entropy was never consider to be close to Blood Magic. It is the School of Destruction, its purpose is different to the Blood Magic School. Fear and sleep related speels seem to be close to mind control, but I suspect that the meaning used to achieve them is different. The "Blood Magic" like School is Spirit. Necromancy should be part of that school, and it is legal. Obviously nobody likes to see walking corpses (outside of Nevarra), so it 's a practice which is kept hidden.
This is why B-Ware needs to release info on the Specs because these type of topics will continue popping up in my opinion.
Blood Magic is not the only dark/forbidden magic in the Dragon Age universe, Flemeth's way of Magic as well as Shape Shifting are debunked and forbidden by the Chantry. I would suspect that since Merrill was able to learn a form of blood magic on her own, it suggest that the Dalish utilize forms of magic also forbidden by the Chantry. I don't want to sound as if I'm trying to put words in the mouth of the creators but magic in and of itself is dangerous because of its ability to be abused by people, so any kind of magic can be Dark/Evil but that is subjective based on the actions magic is used in, not by the particular kind of magic (if you want to even categorize it) being used. As has been said some forms of blood magic are sanctioned (phylacteries, the sealing of Coryphaeus, The Joining Ritual is likely the product of blood magic as well,)
What im saying is don't feel that the lack of no Blood Mage specialization means, no alternative, if the story calls for it, they can bring as many dark themed specializations to light as they want, and it wouldn't even be that much of a stretch to write up a few based on the nature of several types of magic already used. If magic was all good and none threatening then the Chantry wouldn't feel the need to cage all mages, rather they'd just seek out those who used Blood Magic if you believed that only Blood Magic is dark and evil.
As far as the on going discussion goes, maybe some of you have read something that suggest that necromancy in the form of animating corpses other than skeletons requires blood magic, if so how about providing some sources or references, if not there doesn't seem to be much ground to base this on. DA2 had the one mage who combined Necromancy and Blood Magic (which he learned from Orsino of all things) in his research to try and construct a living thinking breathing undead construct stitched together to resemble the dead wife he had lost, this isn't simple Necromancy at this point, and nothing suggest a demon or spirit at all was used to animate the leandra corpse amalgam, as it was infact Leandra in control of the mind of the thing. So no i don't think Necromancy requires blood magic, or is evil, but it can be used for evil, it certainly can be used to make a character look more unhinged if not unsavory in the eyes of the masses if they are using it to do some nefarious means.
There seems to be some conflicting information about spirit summoning. The blood magic codex states that one of blood magic's unique powers is the ability to completely open the veil and let demons (or spirits if you prefer the term) "physically pass through it into our world" but the Spirit Healer class talks about "channeling the energies" of spirits as well as actually summoning them through the Veil. It even mentions demons tricking Spirit Healers into bringing them across the Veil or allowing themselves to be possessed. So if we're talking about the animation of corpses by binding spirits then it seems the lore has no answers other than the fact that it happens.
Blood Magic is not the only dark/forbidden magic in the Dragon Age universe, Flemeth's way of Magic as well as Shape Shifting are debunked and forbidden by the Chantry. I would suspect that since Merrill was able to learn a form of blood magic on her own, it suggest that the Dalish utilize forms of magic also forbidden by the Chantry. I don't want to sound as if I'm trying to put words in the mouth of the creators but magic in and of itself is dangerous because of its ability to be abused by people, so any kind of magic can be Dark/Evil but that is subjective based on the actions magic is used in, not by the particular kind of magic (if you want to even categorize it) being used. As has been said some forms of blood magic are sanctioned (phylacteries, the sealing of Coryphaeus, The Joining Ritual is likely the product of blood magic as well,)
What? I've never heard that Shapeshifting was forbidden by the Chantry. What Bioware's wiki said about it was that it's a magic that was performed outside the Circle centuries before it was learnt by them, probably from hedge mages. In fact, it's stated that those "barbarians" and "witches" that perform their magic outside the Circle don't always use forbidden magic, and "the creation of charms, the use of curses and the ability to change their own forms" are mentioned as examples of this "legal" magic.
Nope. A circle mage can't use hedge magic, and such magic is maleficarum. The nature of hedge magic has changed since DA:O.
I have the impression that Necromancy will be more in tune with summoning and binding spirits than doing so with corpses. It could turn out to be a compilation of entrophy and spirit magic. And neither of those require blood magic.
That's more like what I expect from Rift Mage... Fade spirits aren't the souls of the dead, so Necromancer wouldn't be the right name for a class that draws power from them. I can see Necromancers using Life Drain or Walking Bomb, perhaps even Spirit Bolt, but they will most certainly animate skeletons or corpses as well.
Would point out that demons were part of the magic required for Quentin's animation of the stitched together corpses. Each part was held together into the whole by a demon. You had to kill this demon in order to free the person that was used. The finally one in the sequence was Leandra, which is why you were able to talk to her at the end before she died. Thus it truly was evil magic since it involved multiple possession of the corpses of the women that were involved in the process (possibly their souls as well).
Would point out that demons were part of the magic required for Quentin's animation of the stitched together corpses. Each part was held together into the whole by a demon. You had to kill this demon in order to free the person that was used. The finally one in the sequence was Leandra, which is why you were able to talk to her at the end before she died. Thus it truly was evil magic since it involved multiple possession of the corpses of the women that were involved in the process (possibly their souls as well).
This, although I doubt their souls were being manipulated as I pretty sure it's established that souls pass on to an unknown realm upon death. I find it more plausible that the demon possessing her corpse acquired/relived her memories and maybe her personality too (a little bit like Cole I guess).
No. The type of necromancy the player will use is not Blood Magic. It is probably still considered maleficarum arts, but it isn't Blood Magic.
Necromancy is likely to lean towards the spirit and Entropy usage. Most of which while not illegal is likely closely watched by the Chantry and the Circle usually.
The one ability your hung up on is the animating of corpses. This as a character ability is more in there as a combat tactical ability than one that is free of malificarum/blood magic leanings. The two tend to be tied together because of their nature of trafficking in demons.
hedge magic is tossed in as a side piece of being practiced by mages not under chantry control. One of those affects being shape shifting. That's where you guys are muddying things a bit.
Now taking this in mind and the fact that maleficarum don't necessarily need to use blood magic to do their workings they most often do so in the minds of most controlling the dead might as well be Blood Magic in Thedas for the very reason that it is outright taking spirits of the fade and bringing them across the veil and instilling them in a corpse. Made worse by the fact that spirits for this are most often demons and in the eyes of some can only be demons because they don't even believe in the benevolent spirits across the fade anyway.
So if it's raising corpses which is another way in the minds of many of controlling people along with manipulation of their blood and their minds against their will it might as well be blood magic. If that is what necromancy focuses on we might as well call it the blood mage specialization even though they may have worked blood magic in in some separate capacity.
We had the ability to Animate Dead in previous games, which wasn't in the Blood Magic school but rather the Spirit one. It's probably on the books as being "technically legal" since it's not Blood Magic and you're not controlling a living person, but to perform it is taboo and no-one will risk doing it because the Templars would descend upon them.
It's been mentioned before that Thedas has a ridiculously poor understanding of anatomy due to the Chantry having put restrictions on things that come even close to being Blood Magic, which puts off most scholars from even wanting to study it.
Would point out that demons were part of the magic required for Quentin's animation of the stitched together corpses. Each part was held together into the whole by a demon. You had to kill this demon in order to free the person that was used. The finally one in the sequence was Leandra, which is why you were able to talk to her at the end before she died. Thus it truly was evil magic since it involved multiple possession of the corpses of the women that were involved in the process (possibly their souls as well).
Necromancy is likely to lean towards the spirit and Entropy usage. Most of which while not illegal is likely closely watched by the Chantry and the Circle usually.
The one ability your hung up on is the animating of corpses. This as a character ability is more in there as a combat tactical ability than one that is free of malificarum/blood magic leanings. The two tend to be tied together because of their nature of trafficking in demons.
hedge magic is tossed in as a side piece of being practiced by mages not under chantry control. One of those affects being shape shifting. That's where you guys are muddying things a bit.
Now taking this in mind and the fact that maleficarum don't necessarily need to use blood magic to do their workings they most often do so in the minds of most controlling the dead might as well be Blood Magic in Thedas for the very reason that it is outright taking spirits of the fade and bringing them across the veil and instilling them in a corpse. Made worse by the fact that spirits for this are most often demons and in the eyes of some can only be demons because they don't even believe in the benevolent spirits across the fade anyway.
So if it's raising corpses which is another way in the minds of many of controlling people along with manipulation of their blood and their minds against their will it might as well be blood magic. If that is what necromancy focuses on we might as well call it the blood mage specialization even though they may have worked blood magic in in some separate capacity.
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