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Dragon Age : Last Flight


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#276
Willowhugger

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...

 

Oh.

OH.

 

It's more than that. Doesn't the Taint provide magical power in a similar way to Lyrium?

 

Maybe that's why Alistair thought Templar's didn't need Lyrium, as he had an alternative power source...

 

A Templar might not even need Lyrium to maintain their powers after being made a Warden.

 

Sadly, DG has been quite clear we should just ignore that bit in Origins.

Which stinks but hey, I can move on.

 

DA will NEVER approach WOW's retcons.



#277
MisterJB

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I'm surprised Isseya's method of locomotion (aka magic propelled floating boats) didn't catch on.

You'd think 400 years later they'd have replaced horses.


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#278
Willowhugger

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I'm surprised Isseya's method of locomotion (aka magic propelled floating boats) didn't catch on.

You'd think 400 years later they'd have replaced horses.

 

Well it helps people hate mages.



#279
MisterJB

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I like how the book places the mages on the same level as the Templars; such as both demanding the Wardens fight for them; and hints at settin the order back on the right path. It might alleviate concerns some might harbor regarding options in DAI (coughCerberuscough) altough I'll wait to see what the game will consider "the right path" to be.



#280
The Elder King

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I like how the book places the mages on the same level as the Templars; such as both demanding the Wardens fight for them; and hints at settin the order back on the right path. It might alleviate concerns some might harbor regarding options in DAI (coughCerberuscough) altough I'll wait to see what the game will consider "the right path" to be.

I honestly don't think there'll be a right path hinted by the game. Cerberus' role is taken by the Reds and the venatori.
Though I do hope that both mages and templars will act better the what shown in the info on the hinterlands.

#281
X Equestris

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I'm surprised Isseya's method of locomotion (aka magic propelled floating boats) didn't catch on.
You'd think 400 years later they'd have replaced horses.


From what I understood, you would need griffons to pull them.
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#282
veeia

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Well, the Dalish did it without griffons, right? There has to be a way. It is kind of disturbing how little Thedas has advanced technologically. I mean, you'd think of something super convenient came out of magic, people would ignore the magic hate for that. People are hypocritical that way. I guess its convienient for the people in power to suppress it completely.

#283
Willowhugger

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Well, the Dalish did it without griffons, right? There has to be a way. It is kind of disturbing how little Thedas has advanced technologically. I mean, you'd think of something super convenient came out of magic, people would ignore the magic hate for that. People are hypocritical that way. I guess its convienient for the people in power to suppress it completely.

 

It's a trope in fantasy fiction that some places are like 100,000 years of the Middle Ages.



#284
PsychoBlonde

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So, just how awesome was the Warden in Origins to off the Archdemon in a year?  Or did we get some kind of cut-rate bargain basement Archdemon?

I liked the use of the spell combos in the book, though.  Crushing Prison + Force Field ftw!

Also, I'm not really surprised at the lack of technological progress.  Europe degenerated enormously after the fall of the Roman Empire and took something like 8 centuries to *recover* much less start significant development again.  Granted, some innovations like stirrups and the horse collar and gunpowder did happen--but many of them came from other places.  Stirrups came from Mongol invaders.  Gunpowder came from China.

Thedas does not have an "empire" to promote what Isabel Paterson called the "Long Circuit of Energy" (highly recommend her book The God of the Machine)--long distance trade that fosters innovation and development.  In fact, it has a lot more material hazards to trading.  Maybe not so much plague, but certainly plenty of other disasters.  The Tevinter Imperium, with its emphasis on slavery, is in fact a massive anti-innovation, anti-development force.  I don't really think Orlais is a good source for a pro-innovation force, either.  The nobles have too many prerogatives that are geared toward a lower level of development and that would crumble if the peasantry started getting all innovative and trade-y.  Fereldan would be a better bet but their population is too small and their economy has just suffered a major disaster.

That's kind of why I suggest a Ferelden-Orlais alliance would be a good thing.  It would be a big step toward cracking the power of the nobles in Orlais and freeing up their status society toward something a little looser and geared toward trade and innovation.  And Fereldan would have aid in economic recovery that wouldn't depend solely on its own resources.


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#285
Willowhugger

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So, just how awesome was the Warden in Origins to off the Archdemon in a year?  Or did we get some kind of cut-rate bargain basement Archdemon?

 

A couple of factors basically.

 

1. Flemeth put the Wardens on the right track to getting a military alliance together.

 

2. The Wardens have been getting progressively better at this **** from the first Blight onward.

 

3. It was a ridiculously weird alliance of people. The Companions of Fereldan (for lack of a better name) are more or less a collection of some of the most skilled people on Earth which filled in holes which normally cause events to fail.

 

A Templar Warden, Archmage, Witch of the Wilds, Antivian Crow, Qunari, a Stone Golem, Dwarvish Berserker, Warden with unusual skill, a Orlesian Bard, and a Wardenized Mabari Warhound

 

4. The Warden was pretty damn awesome.


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#286
PsychoBlonde

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It's a trope in fantasy fiction that some places are like 100,000 years of the Middle Ages.

History actually tends to back this up as being potentially accurate.  Progress is not a given, and a stagnant Middle Ages level of development is what you get when progress is impeded.  Fantasy worlds often have built-in impediments that would very likely prevent any kind of a trade economy from ever getting established in the first place.

Of course if you have magical teleportation/flight etc. in a high fantasy setting it's time to ask why you don't have a high "technology" of magic.  Yeah, okay, magic is very hard.  Is it as hard as writing a computer program in assembler?  No?  What's the holdup, then.



#287
PsychoBlonde

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A couple of factors basically.

 

1. Flemeth put the Wardens on the right track to getting a military alliance together.

 

2. The Wardens have been getting progressively better at this **** from the first Blight onward.

3. It was a ridiculously weird alliance of people. The Companions of Fereldan (for lack of a better name) are more or less a collection of some of the most skilled people on Earth which filled in holes which would not normally exist.

It is also suggested in the book that the Archdemon "feeds" off the destruction somehow--so it may be comparatively easy to off one if you catch it FAST.  By coming up in an underpopulated region with nothing much to destroy, it genuinely might have been a cut-rate bargain-basement Archdemon.  That would make what Loghain did even worse, because he essentially gave it a chance to power up.

That "feeding" might make sense if the Old Gods are basically blood mages (or can use the power of blood)--supposedly they taught blood magic to humans, after all, and were constantly egging the Magisters into using it.  It would even make sense that this is why the Archdemons go on a killing spree every single time--the deaths of Darkspawn and people alike feed its power.


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#288
Willowhugger

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It is also suggested in the book that the Archdemon "feeds" off the destruction somehow--so it may be comparatively easy to off one if you catch it FAST.  By coming up in an underpopulated region with nothing much to destroy, it genuinely might have been a cut-rate bargain-basement Archdemon.  That would make what Loghain did even worse, because he essentially gave it a chance to power up.

 

I'm inclined to disagree with this one, personally. The one in First Flight seems about as tough as the one in Origins.

 

However, Riordan really deserves credit for crippling its wing.

 

A bunch of Dalish Archers, Three Archmages, and Leliana still barely took it down in my game--taking a CRAP ton of Lyrium too.



#289
X Equestris

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So, just how awesome was the Warden in Origins to off the Archdemon in a year?  Or did we get some kind of cut-rate bargain basement Archdemon?
I liked the use of the spell combos in the book, though.  Crushing Prison + Force Field ftw!
Also, I'm not really surprised at the lack of technological progress.  Europe degenerated enormously after the fall of the Roman Empire and took something like 8 centuries to *recover* much less start significant development again.  Granted, some innovations like stirrups and the horse collar and gunpowder did happen--but many of them came from other places.  Stirrups came from Mongol invaders.  Gunpowder came from China.
Thedas does not have an "empire" to promote what Isabel Paterson called the "Long Circuit of Energy" (highly recommend her book The God of the Machine)--long distance trade that fosters innovation and development.  In fact, it has a lot more material hazards to trading.  Maybe not so much plague, but certainly plenty of other disasters.  The Tevinter Imperium, with its emphasis on slavery, is in fact a massive anti-innovation, anti-development force.  I don't really think Orlais is a good source for a pro-innovation force, either.  The nobles have too many prerogatives that are geared toward a lower level of development and that would crumble if the peasantry started getting all innovative and trade-y.  Fereldan would be a better bet but their population is too small and their economy has just suffered a major disaster.
That's kind of why I suggest a Ferelden-Orlais alliance would be a good thing.  It would be a big step toward cracking the power of the nobles in Orlais and freeing up their status society toward something a little looser and geared toward trade and innovation.  And Fereldan would have aid in economic recovery that wouldn't depend solely on its own resources.


I think the thing with the Fifth Blight is that it didn't have time to build up steam. That, and the Warden got extremely lucky. If Felemth hadn't saved the Warden and Alistair, Ferelden would have fallen. If Riordan had missed his jump onto the Archdemon's back, it is unlikely that the Archdemon could have been forced to land.

I agree with your comments about innovation. Europe had an awful backslide after Rome fell apart, which wasn't helped by things like the Black Death. The common idea that the Middle Ages were absolutely filthy comes from the fact that after the Black Death, people stopped bathing, because they believed that it opened the pores and let in disease. Before that, people still used old Roman bathhouses sometimes.

My only complaint with your statement is that it was the Avar who brought the stirrup from Central Asia to Europe.

I think part of the reason for Thedas's stagnation is magic and the fear of magic. Healing with magic, for example, is much faster than healing with traditional means, and as such, there hasn't been much advancement in medical science in Thedas. This isn't helped by blood magic creating a stigma against research into anatomy.

Another thing is the Blights. It's hard to foster much innovation when you have a disaster on such a scale, plus the fact that advances could be lost.

As for countries that could serve as a starting place for a Renaissance-like event, I guess the Free Marches might be a good option. Antiva, as well, since they have the sort of wealth that would be needed to patronize such a thing.

#290
PsychoBlonde

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I'm inclined to disagree with this one, personally. The one in First Flight seems about as tough as the one in Origins.

 

However, Riordan really deserves credit for crippling its wing.

 

A bunch of Dalish Archers, Three Archmages, and Leliana still barely took it down in my game--taking a CRAP ton of Lyrium too.

Heh I basically solo'd the Archdemon with my warden, the rest of the party just kept the darkspawn busy for me.



#291
sandalisthemaker

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Despite everything that happened in the book, Isseya is amazing, though.



#292
Jaison1986

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Spoiler



#293
Urazz

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History actually tends to back this up as being potentially accurate.  Progress is not a given, and a stagnant Middle Ages level of development is what you get when progress is impeded.  Fantasy worlds often have built-in impediments that would very likely prevent any kind of a trade economy from ever getting established in the first place.

Of course if you have magical teleportation/flight etc. in a high fantasy setting it's time to ask why you don't have a high "technology" of magic.  Yeah, okay, magic is very hard.  Is it as hard as writing a computer program in assembler?  No?  What's the holdup, then.

In the case of Dragon Age, the built-in impediment to progress is the mages pretty much being holed up into towers.  Gunpowder does exist though but it's not easily getting around since the Qunari guard it religiously it feels like.  Dwarven Lyrium-based gunpowder is not all that feasible since it requires quite alot of lyrium and most of that goes to the templars and mages.

 

 

Spoiler

Spoiler



#294
Hellion Rex

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Spoiler

That said, I don't think we should condemn all present day Wardens for the sins of their past members.


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#295
Willowhugger

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Spoiler

 

Honestly, even knowing the consequences, I'm not sure it was the wrong decision.

 

Spoiler


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#296
sandalisthemaker

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Spoiler

 

Spoiler


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#297
Willowhugger

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Spoiler

 

The author has stated she'd never have done it, though, if she'd known.

 

While other Wardens would have just forced her to do it anyway.

 

It says a lot about the GW that.



#298
Guest_StreetMagic_*

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I got this today, but probably won't get to it until next week.

 

Hope it's good. I only bought it because of DA. At first glance, the Wardens don't interest me like the last two books.



#299
Jaison1986

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That said, I don't think we should condemn all present day Wardens for the sins of their past members.

 

It would be an fair point weren't for the fact the wardens still are the same opportunist and selfish bunch from the old days. They changed nothing since them.



#300
AresKeith

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Spoiler

 

Spoiler