148 réponses à ce sujet

[Farangbaa]

The fact that the reapers can easily travel to the galaxy by ftl renders the citadel trap moot as they can just arrive anyway.
The only reason the reapers dont take the citadel in me3 and shut down the relay system is the fact it would be a very short game.
Obviously if you fail in me1 then it is game over, my point is that the entire plot and plan are pointless because they can just rock up anyway.
The fight against sovereign loses its impact when you know they are metaphorically a short walk away.

You could run to work every day.
Do you?

[SporkFu]

The fact that the reapers can easily travel to the galaxy by ftl renders the citadel trap moot as they can just arrive anyway.
The only reason the reapers dont take the citadel in me3 and shut down the relay system is the fact it would be a very short game.
Obviously if you fail in me1 then it is game over, my point is that the entire plot and plan are pointless because they can just rock up anyway.
The fight against sovereign loses its impact when you know they are metaphorically a short walk away.

What if that keeper signal thing Vigil gave us kept the reapers from shutting off the relay network too? Just supposing. Then we could have Omega as a base. 

[von uber]

You could run to work every day.
Do you?

No, I use a motorcycle.
But that has nowt to do with the reapers.

[Farangbaa]

No, I use a motorcycle.
But that has nowt to do with the reapers.

 

Well, why don't you just run there instead of destroying the environment on your motorcycle? 

 

Same reason the Reapers would rather pour through the Citadel relay instead of manually flying all the way there. 

[von uber]

That doesn't work as an analogy though.
Sovereign's attack is depicted as a desperate struggle to get the reapers through - which we know it isn't as they can just stroll right on in.
Don't forget synthetics apparently have no real concept of time; why would they be in a rush?
I use my bike as it is impractical to run the distance. It is not impractical for the reapers to ftl to the system. Sovereign could just have said "citadel relay is buggered, just fly on in and we'll check the problem once we easily recapture it."

[Farangbaa]

That doesn't work as an analogy though.
Sovereign's attack is depicted as a desperate struggle to get the reapers through - which we know it isn't as they can just stroll right on in.
Don't forget synthetics apparently have no real concept of time; why would they be in a rush?
I use my bike as it is impractical to run the distance. It is not impractical for the reapers to ftl to the system. Sovereign could just have said "citadel relay is buggered, just fly on in and we'll check the problem once we easily recapture it."

Had the Reapers arived a few months later than they did in ME3 there'd be one less species to 'preserve'. (the Geth) Time might be meaningless to them, but it's a vital element of what they do. They were already very late, as they were supposed to pour through the Citadel relay 1000 years earlier. Sovereing already spent a millenium to find a different way. Even the Reapers will have a moment of 'enough is enough'. 

 

If it's really a millenium or a few centuries doesn't really matter here, I think that we can all agree now, knowing the Catalyst's goals, that they were supposed to harvest the galaxy before the Morning War.

[Lennard Testarossa]

Same reason the Reapers would rather pour through the Citadel relay instead of manually flying all the way there. 

 

So Sovereign risks exposure of the Reapers and its destruction in order to accommodate the laziness of his Reaper friends, who can't be bothered to wait another five years, despite the fact that many of them are already a billion years old? The only reason the council didn't unite then and there was an incredible case of stubbornness and stupidity on their part.

 

Sovereign's attack on the Citadel is the only reason anyone was prepared for the arrival of the Reapers. Without that, there would have been no way of them losing. They could've simply waited five years, attacked the Citadel with their entire fleet, taken it without any problems whatsoever and continued with a regular cycle.

 

For a race of supposedly 'superintelligent' AIs, the Reapers sure are retarded.

[Farangbaa]

See above. 

[von uber]

Sorry but spending a thousand years finding an alternate way when you are 2 years ftl away is just stupid.

[Farangbaa]

Yeah duh, just like controlling Saren when it will ruin your barriers is stupid.

In their defense though, they would've wanted to poor through the citadel relay to make everything easier (like, you know, all the other times), as that turned out not to be an option they FTL'ed. And I bet they would've expected a fully prepared galaxy, but instead they found a very unprepared galaxy.

 

Which you can use to headcanon a reason for them not taking the Citadel immediatly. 'Look at these fools!! They knew we were coming for more than 2 years... and look at them! Lets just wing this, Harby'

 

And then they lost. 

 

We all know that when the Reapers do everything right, the galaxy would be harvested.

[von uber]

It's not a question of doing things right. Having them within easy ftl range renders everything sovereign does for a thousand years pointless, and arguably the citadel trap as well.
Such are the mooted numbers and strength, regardless of what they do it should be a walkover. If the reapers had even an ounce of this supposed intelligence me3 would be over before it started.
Hell given the short ftl times, me1 should have ended 998 years before it began as soon as sovereign noticed the trap didn't work.

[Farangbaa]

Even if the Crucible failed it would've been a bad cycle for the Reapers. They actually lost some Reapers, unlike the other cycles.

The Citadel trap is obviously the best way to go for them, even if it means waiting a 1000 years.

[in it for the lolz]

Even if the Crucible failed it would've been a bad cycle for the Reapers. They actually lost some Reapers, unlike the other cycles.

The Citadel trap is obviously the best way to go for them, even if it means waiting 50,000 years.

Fixed that for you!

[Farangbaa]

Read the conversation before fixing things that aren't wrong.

[in it for the lolz]

Read the conversation before fixing things that aren't wrong.

I have. Reaper harvest every 50,000 years. Don't know were you got: "They were already very late, as they were supposed to pour through the Citadel relay 1000 years earlier" form.

[Farangbaa]

Legion, I think. 

 

Not sure though.

 

Maybe even Vigil. I can't be arsed to go through those convo's again

[in it for the lolz]

Legion, I think. 

 

Not sure though.

 

Maybe even Vigil. I can't be arsed to go through those convo's again

It could be that your thinking about the Rachni. Back in ME 2 when that asari (damn, I hate spelling that word) (If you saved the Queen Bug) talks about the Rachni being forced into war via brainwashing.

[SilJeff]

I thought the Leviathan dlc mentioned that about the rachni

[Farangbaa]

It could be that your thinking about the Rachni. Back in ME 2 when that asari (damn, I hate spelling that word) (If you saved the Queen Bug) talks about the Rachni being forced into war via brainwashing.

No. I know for sure that Legion says Nazara has been gathering allies for millenia.

Vigil says it likely took Sovereign centuries to figure out what happened to the Keepers.

 

What we know for sure from this is that he didn't just found out the Keepers were broken just before ME1.

[Coyotebay]

Most likely not or, if so, not for the reasons we will think of first. That's why many sci-fi authors use initial programming as a reason, like when AI alters or misinterprets the initial command when it reaches a conflicting situation. Asimov's three laws are a good example and he has stories when certain situations made robots to adjust those laws accordingly. If written realistically machines are, well, boring and it's another problem when writing about machine-organic relationship. 

I think Mass Effect does a good job in that regard with synthetics like geth who fight in self-defense. The Reapers for me are a classic example of misinterpretation of initial task. "Kill to save" has become somewhat a cliché in science fiction.

I hate stories where the antagonist is driven by an initial misunderstanding and is incapable or rationalizing things out.  Don't get me started on the first Star Trek movie and "Vger".

[AlanC9]

Don't get me started on the first Star Trek movie and "Vger".

That was just a ripoff of the TOS episode "The Changeling" anyway.

[KaiserShep]

I hate stories where the antagonist is driven by an initial misunderstanding and is incapable or rationalizing things out.  Don't get me started on the first Star Trek movie and "Vger".

 

That kind of happens in the 2009 Trek too. The antagonist was really mad at Spock because the Romulans were too stupid to avoid a supernova that was going to threaten the galaxy and...wait...oh man that's dumb as hell.

[ImaginaryMatter]

That kind of happens in the 2009 Trek too. The antagonist was really mad at Spock because the Romulans were too stupid to avoid a supernova that was going to threaten the galaxy and...wait...oh man that's dumb as hell.

 

Let's not get started on that movie.

 

...

 

...

 

...damn it, now I'm thinking about it.

[Coyotebay]

That was just a ripoff of the TOS episode "The Changeling" anyway.

"I am Nomad."  At least in that episode we got to watch Kirk win brownie points with Spock for his "dazzling display of logic".