2121 réponses à ce sujet

[Jedi Master of Orion]

Instead of being cardboard semi-antagonists who never do anything of note, as in DA2.

 

Oh right. I thought you meant compared to the Dalish Protagonist of Dragon Age: Origins.

[Drasanil]

Instead of being cardboard semi-antagonists who never do anything of note, as in DA2.

 

Indeed, I too hope we never have to suffer through another Merill *shudders* 

[Master Warder Z_]

Indeed, I too hope we never have to suffer through another Merill *shudders* 

 

She never did get around to doing anything unholy *sigh* all that build up only for special snow flake status to kick in.

[Drasanil]

The real reason people hate Merathari; she's a damned kill stealer 

[Master Warder Z_]

The real reason people hate Merathari; she's a damned kill stealer 

 

Annoying.

[General TSAR]

I completely agree with this statement.

 

a revolution or mass exodus would probably just cause more anger and hatred and would probably destroy the economy of every nation that uses Elven workers.

It might even destroy the city elves.

 

Reconciliation is key, a good step would be to better integrate elves into society such as allowing them to serve in the army.

[Kieran G.]

It might even destroy the city elves.

 

Reconciliation is key, a good step would be to better integrate elves into society such as allowing them to serve in the army.

Yep. and sadly if the Elves of Halmirshal didn't rebel Celene might have been able to make that achievement in her life time. Hell she was already planning on it once she discovered the Eluvians,

[Drasanil]

Yep. and sadly if the Elves of Halmirshal didn't rebel Celene might have been able to make that achievement in her life time. Hell she was already planning on it once she discovered the Eluvians,

 

Or random noble #2 might have made a snarky comment about Celene's elf ambitions and she would have burnt down the Val Royeaux alienage instead to prove them wrong.

[General TSAR]

Yep. and sadly if the Elves of Halmirshal didn't rebel Celene might have been able to make that achievement in her life time. Hell she was already planning on it once she discovered the Eluvians,

Interesting didn't know that.

[Jedi Master of Orion]

Celene didn't burn down Halamshiral just because of a snarky play. She burned it down because it was in open rebellion. It would be one thing to be thought of being considered too soft on elves, but she was accused of being too soft on elves that were rebelling against the Orlesian Empire. That was the part that was politically  unacceptable for the Empress.

[Kieran G.]

Or random noble #2 might have made a snarky comment about Celene's elf ambitions and she would have burnt down the Val Royeaux alienage instead to prove them wrong.

She was going to lose her throne and the city was rebelling. humans or elves, they would all see the same fate if they rebelled, her first choice was to try to save their lives but because they rebelled they had to see punishment. But she was the first Empress to ever let Elves learn in the University, If i remember correctly she even wanted to reestablish the art depicting Elves.

 

But i'm not looking to argue if Celene is a good Empress or not.

 

All my comment was stating, was that a Dragon age version of a Race War would do nothing but make more problems.

[Drasanil]

Celene burnt down the alienage because 1) her supposed liberalism is really all about herself and how she wants think of herself [and keeping her sex-toy happy], the moment it becomes tenuous she makes a face heel turn, 2) she's lacking in conviction, honor, or really any sense of back bone, and 3) despite her reputation she's just a fairly bad politician. That her throne was threatened by what amounts to rioting elves burning down their own shitty property, whom nobody really cares about, speaks volumes. There were other ways to diffuse the situation had she had the conviction to try them.

[Kieran G.]

Celene burnt down the alienage because 1) her supposed liberalism is really all about herself and how she wants think of herself [and keeping her sex-toy happy], the moment it becomes tenuous she makes a face heel turn, 2) she's lacking in conviction, honor, or really any sense of back bone, and 3) despite her reputation she's just a fairly bad politician. That her throne was threatened by what amounts to rioting elves burning down their own shitty property, whom nobody really cares about, speaks volumes. There were other ways to diffuse the situation had she had the conviction to try them.

There was no way to diffuse that. Every rebellion will be met that way by any empire. and she tried to diffuse it, even if it was for a "Sex Toy". She did more for Elves than any other monarch i know in thedasian history. (except for alistair which may or may not be canon.)

 

Yes is sucks the Elves were killed. i feel bad for them. but they made their choices. they chose to rebel. they chose to use violence. and so they were met with violence, if they didn't have a comprehension of what might happen then they are to blame for small mindedness.

 

And considering Celene has been able to rule her nation for 12ish years husbandless and began to bring it to a cultural and social Golden Age.

 

Any Elf, Any Human, Any Dwarf, who took up arms against the empire. be it under Celene's rule or Drakon's, would have been punished. so why is she to blame when the elves started to kill humans who were just traders, or Regular city guards. 

 

Do not act like those rebelling elves were so noble, they just wanted to kill because they were angry. even Briala knew that and looked down on them because of it.

[Drasanil]

They weren't really rebelling, not in a practical sense any ways, they had no army, no real organisation, they were rioting. And no where did I insinuate they were noble, in fact if anything I insinuated they were idiots for basically destroying their own property. If Celene wanted to put it down there were still ways of doing it with out indiscriminately burning down the place. 

[Master Warder Z_]

They weren't really rebelling, not in a practical sense any ways, they had no army, no real organisation, they were rioting. And no where did I insinuate they were noble, in fact if anything I insinuated they were idiots for basically destroying their own property. If Celene wanted to put it down there were still ways of doing it with out indiscriminately burning down the place. 

 

Honestly it was just her lack of backbone that caused her to turn her back on her agreement with her elven toy and not any true sense of malice.

 

She will do whatever is politically expedient to keep power, like any ruler.

 

Gaspard will at least be honest about it, which is why he is something of an anomaly.

[Drasanil]

That's why I am voting Gaspard in DAI

[Master Warder Z_]

I once met a man who had his entire existence obliterated around him, a thousand years of history, culture and experience just blown away in an instant.

 

You know what he did?

 

He elected to survive, he worked with the very people who killed his family, his friends, the people who burned his temple, put his god and holy relics to torch.

 

He survived.

 

He eventually even found kinship among those who conquered his people, he married into them, had children, raised them with a foreign woman from a place he likely had never heard of outside of passing conversation.

 

Its why i hold no ill will towards the elves who actually submit to the reality of their world.

 

The Age of the elves has long since faded from memory, it is never going to return.

 

The most you can do is ensure individual survival.

[Kieran G.]

Honestly it was just her lack of backbone that caused her to turn her back on her agreement with her elven toy and not any true sense of malice.

 

She will do whatever is politically expedient to keep power, like any ruler.

 

Gaspard will at least be honest about it, which is why he is something of an anomaly.

Thats why i really respect Gaspard, But he won't help Elves in any way, he will just be honest when he sends Chevaliers to rape the Elven women. 

 

And i'm not to big on his war mongering.

 

At least Celene wants to make a peaceful Empire where its Culture and Society is booming.

 

And yes Celene messed up on her decision over Halamirshal. she should have marched in their since day one, but loved Briala. 

 

 

They weren't really rebelling, not in a practical sense any ways, they had no army, no real organisation, they were rioting. And no where did I insinuate they were noble, in fact if anything I insinuated they were idiots for basically destroying their own property. If Celene wanted to put it down there were still ways of doing it with out indiscriminately burning down the place. 

They were making barricades. Causing chaos through out the city. Occupying streets and not lettings guards come in for days on end. and killing humans they saw. They weren't paying taxes, and supply shipments, and weren't obeying Imperial rule. tell me how that's not rebelling?

 

They were starting a race war, and thats what they wanted.

[Grand Admiral Cheesecake]

That's why I am voting Gaspard in DAI

 

Exactly! Gaspard is the path of wisdom.

[Xilizhra]

I once met a man who had his entire existence obliterated around him, a thousand years of history, culture and experience just blown away in an instant.

 

You know what he did?

 

He elected to survive, he worked with the very people who killed his family, his friends, the people who burned his temple, put his god and holy relics to torch.

 

He survived.

 

He eventually even found kinship among those who conquered his people, he married into them, had children, raised them with a foreign woman from a place he likely had never heard of outside of passing conversation.

 

Its why i hold no ill will towards the elves who actually submit to the reality of their world.

 

The of the elves has long since faded from memory, it is never going to return.

 

The most you can do is ensure individual survival.

And what, then, would you do if the Dalish returned to power in DAI?

[Grand Admiral Cheesecake]

And what, then, would you do if the Dalish returned to power in DAI?

 

Wait a week for them to do something stupid and get their entire clan wiped out.

[Master Warder Z_]

And what, then, would you do if the Dalish returned to power in DAI?

 

Such a concept is so alien, so remote its hardly even worth consideration?

 

Honestly though?

 

At most you have them retaking the Dales, a single province within Orlais, at best it merely establishes a presidence that the elves are not content with the mercy Humanity has shown them and will rise up in rebellion if they aren't warded carefully, at worst?

 

Their state is razed again.

 

Humanity is the force that must mete out the terms by which elves will live, not the elves themselves, that is what many find disagreeable but that is also the reality of Thedas.

[Xilizhra]

Wait a week for them to do something stupid and get their entire clan wiped out.

Assume that that would never happen for the purposes of this question.

[Grand Admiral Cheesecake]

Assume that that would never happen for the purposes of this question.

 

Wait a month for humanity to rally and destroy them.

[Xilizhra]

Such a concept is so alien, so remote its hardly even worth consideration?

 

Honestly though?

 

At most you have them retaking the Dales, a single province within Orlais, at best it merely establishes a presidence that the elves are not content with the mercy Humanity has shown them and will rise up in rebellion if they aren't warded carefully, at worst?

 

Their state is razed again.

 

Humanity is the force that must mete out the terms by which elves will live, not the elves themselves, that is what many find disagreeable but that is also the reality of Thedas.

Such could have been said about the krogan or quarians as well, but look what heights they may rise to again.

 

It's entirely possible that Orlais will be in no shape to oppose them, and that assumes that the Dales will even be the place they retake. In any case, the elves owe humanity nothing.