483 réponses à ce sujet

[CuriousArtemis]

Pst. Iron Bull is not bi, he's pansexual. There is difference..

 

Yes, Panda, I know. We all know that But the trope is related to any character who is attracted to multiple genders. Iron Bull applies.

[BobZilla84]

Yes, Panda, I know. We all know that But the trope is related to any character who is attracted to multiple genders. Iron Bull applies.

So Artemis who will be your first LI in your first Playthrough?

[AresKeith]

The issue is the use of finite resources to give straight women more options than everyone else (besides bisexuals). Finite resources that could have been used for something else, like augmenting the existing romances.

In particular, it's disappointing that they took the time to make more straight romances during the delay instead of fixing Iron Bull's romance so that gay male dwarves actually have a choice, which was a last minute thing by a developer who took extra work.

 

What makes you think they didn't work on the existing romances also? And the reason Cullen and Solas are straight because they were written that way before they became options 

[Panda]

Yes, Panda, I know. We all know that But the trope is related to any character who is attracted to multiple genders. Iron Bull applies.

 

I'm not sure that everyone knows though ^^ It's nice just that there is more representation towards different sexualities (I know only 2 characters now that are pansexual) so I don't want Bull's sexuality be forgotten, though romance-wise it doesn't matter in DAI's case.

[CuriousArtemis]

So Artemis who will be your first LI in your first Playthrough?

 

I'm undecided... of my choices, Bull and Dorian, I only kind of like Bull, but not a whole lot. My first playthrough may have no romance

 

How about you?

[BobZilla84]

I'm undecided... of my choices, Bull and Dorian, I only kind of like Bull, but not a whole lot. My first playthrough may have no romance

 

How about you?

Well for me its most likely Cassandra or Sera or I might go the single route it depends you know.

[karushna5]

I mean I have some issues with the romances, but I mean the groups they are making stuff for are not really a monolith.
Women- Just from the get go there is the question of feminine/sexy to masculine/practical bunch. How do you include one without offending or excluding the other?
And there are subgroups...
Bi women- Who have different needs than straight or lesbian women. I am not Bi so not really qualified to espouse on it, but portrayal of accurate bisexuality may be a start. Not "I was made this way by my rough life" stuff.
Lesbian women- Who can be further split in femme and Butch and those inbetween.
Transwomen- who sadly have been getting crumbs so far
WoC- not a WoC but being shown in the world loved and cherished might be a start.

Men have similar groups that are invested in the games

And these all interlock with various feelings on all sides because none of these groups are monoliths, no hive minds. Some things deeply offensive to one person would be the best representation ever for another in the same group. And it IS impossible to appeal to every subgroup, but avoiding the absolutes, encouraging protagonism in all the groups, tackle them as people first. Mix and Match. I dont think they should try to appeal to everyone at all times, that is impossible, but make sure the groups as a whole are treated humanely and you have in depth, powerful characters.

[Jedi Master of Orion]

Isabela really wasn't "clearly bisexual", especially when playing as a mage where she never talks about women at all unless romanced or did the threesome with a female warden & Leliana, can pretty easily come across as a man crazy straight woman who enjoys sex

 

Uh doesn't she tell every Hawke that she has a room at the hanged man if they are looking for company later? Anders also mention in party banter with hers that she liked one particular female prostitute at the Pearl in Denerim.

[Ina]

2. Sexuality tropes continue. Jovial bed-hopper = bisexual; noble knights = straight; flamboyant mustache guy = gay

 

 

I agree with this to some degree. They can work on it better. Though I don't entirely agree about the Dorian one, I mean he is the first gay companion in the DA universe after all so it's not like it's a recurring trope among DA companions. Besides I don't even find him all that flamboyant, though it's possible our definitions of the word can be a bit different. At least all romanceable elves are bi trope has been squashed this time (though I get why they did it in DA2). But overall, yeah, I could certainly do less with the promiscuous bi trope that's been seen in every game so far as well as the nobility=straight implication.

[CuriousArtemis]

I agree with this to some degree. They can work on it better. Though I don't entirely agree about the Dorian one, I mean he is the first gay companion in the DA universe after all so it's not like it's a recurring trope among DA companions. Besides I don't even find him all that flamboyant, though it's possible our definitions of the word can be a bit different. At least all romanceable elves are bi trope has been squashed this time (though I get why they did it in DA2). But overall, yeah, I could certainly do less with the promiscuous bi trope that's been seen in every game so far as well as the nobility=straight implication.

 

Yeah with Dorian it is the mustache plus him being dashing and now a clothes horse, apparently. So he's also fashionable. It would be less eyeroll-inducing if he were presented to us as, say, a quiet, thoughtful man with a surprising temper and a rigid set of ideals who cares more about his beliefs than how he looks... and so on and so on. Just something not so... stereotypical. It could also be that I'm "looking" for it. But I'm not the only one who's seen it, so I don't know what to think. And then again none of us have even played the game yet. 

 

But all that is not related to whether or not I find him attractive. That's a personal thing ^^ Like his character look and description reminds me a lot of Wesley from The Princess Bride... whom, when we were kids, my sister just adored, and I found comical at best, and definitely the opposite of sexy I'm just really not into flamboyant and pretty guys like that. The beautiful actor Tom Hiddleston is another one. He's a favorite these days, and while I do think he's pretty, I have about 0% interest in him

 

And then there's the mustache. I can't, I just can't 

[Ina]

Yeah with Dorian it is the mustache plus him being dashing and now a clothes horse, apparently. So he's also fashionable. It would be less eyeroll-inducing if he were presented to us as, say, a quiet, thoughtful man with a surprising temper and a rigid set of ideals who cares more about his beliefs than how he looks... and so on and so on. Just something not so... stereotypical. It could also be that I'm "looking" for it. But I'm not the only one who's seen it, so I don't know what to think. And then again none of us have even played the game yet. 

 

But all that is not related to whether or not I find him attractive. That's a personal thing ^^ Like his character look and description reminds me a lot of Wesley from The Princess Bride... whom, when we were kids, my sister just adored, and I found comical at best, and definitely the opposite of sexy I'm just really not into flamboyant and pretty guys like that. The beautiful actor Tom Hiddleston is another one. He's a favorite these days, and while I do think he's pretty, I have about 0% interest in him

 

And then there's the mustache. I can't, I just can't 

 

I get where you're coming from. I guess I'm kinda torn between what to think about whether he's stereotypically gay. I don't necessarily see it maybe because I'm not looking, so I guess I'll just leave it till we actually see him in game. I might also be biased as I like the character from what we know so far and plus his closest racial equivalent is indicated to be Indian (something I picked up on at once given I'm Indian myself) so I'm very excited to see a character of my ethnicity presented not only as a companion but as an LI as well. I don't personally find him physically attractive (I'm not into mustache as a general rule but he's growing on me), but I do like his personality so I'll have no qualms romancing him when I do my first male PC run.

[BobZilla84]

Iron Bull seems like he may give Varric some competion in the Best Bud position to me my main party will always  contain a mix of Varric,Iron Bull or Sera. Let the hilarity begin.

[Vita Brevis]

Yeah with Dorian it is the mustache plus him being dashing and now a clothes horse, apparently. So he's also fashionable. It would be less eyeroll-inducing if he were presented to us as, say, a quiet, thoughtful man with a surprising temper and a rigid set of ideals who cares more about his beliefs than how he looks... and so on and so on. Just something not so... stereotypical. It could also be that I'm "looking" for it. But I'm not the only one who's seen it, so I don't know what to think. And then again none of us have even played the game yet. 

 

I honestly can't see how he's caring for his looks for now really above average. I mean, he wears pretty much standart tevinter armour, his haircut not all that screaming for attention. He's not Solas, of course, who wears, well, rags but that doesn't mean anything so far because he's also a noble. It makes sense that he enjoys those things, who wouldn't?

That being said, it's not only what's outside that matters. The devs said that despite all his sarcasm and bravado, he cares about his beliefs and some events can affect him and his idealism, actually. So it's not all that bad, I guess?

 

Btw, I'm really more concerned about Zevran, Isabella and Iron Bull. Those kinds of stereotypes are much worse than being "stylish" and "confident".

[CuriousArtemis]

I get where you're coming from. I guess I'm kinda torn between what to think about whether he's stereotypically gay. I don't necessarily see it maybe because I'm not looking, so I guess I'll just leave it till we actually see him in game. I might also be biased as I like the character from what we know so far and plus his closest racial equivalent is indicated to be Indian (something I picked up on at once given I'm Indian myself) so I'm very excited to see a character of my ethnicity presented not only as a companion but as an LI as well. I don't personally find him physically attractive (I'm not into mustache as a general rule but he's growing on me), but I do like his personality so I'll have no qualms romancing him when I do my first male PC run.

 

Yes it's very cool that his VA is Indian and he looks somewhat Indian himself

 

Well, I'm not remotely attracted to him, I'm side-eyeing him because to me he seems stereotypical, and at present I have no interest in romancing him, BUT... he is a BioWare character, and we just know he's going to be a damn good character because of that ^^ 

[CuriousArtemis]

I honestly can't see how he's caring for his looks for now really above average. I mean, he wears pretty much standart tevinter armour, his haircut not all that screaming for attention. He's not Solas, of course, who wears, well, rags but that doesn't mean anything so far because he's also a noble. 

That being said, it's not only what's outside that matters. The devs said that despite all his sarcasm and bravado, he cares about his beliefs and some events can affect him and his idealism, actually. So it's not all that bad, I guess?

 

Btw, I'm really more concerned about Zevran, Isabella and Iron Bull. Those kinds of stereotypes are much worse than being "stylish" and "confident".

 

The "looks" thing was based on a tweet Cam Lee posted yesterday; apparently there was a bug which kept causing Dorian to change outfits in the same scene, and Cam joked saying it suited Dorian's personality.

 

Agree about Zev, Izzy, and Bull, sigh. 

 

Don't get me wrong; Bull's manliness is nice lol and I'm lucky he's my other option, but the trope still stands and annoys me.

[XxPrincess(x)ThreatxX]

Uh doesn't she tell every Hawke that she has a room at the hanged man if they are looking for company later? Anders also mention in party banter with hers that she liked one particular female prostitute at the Pearl in Denerim.

I thought she was talking about Anders himself in that banter? the sexual electricity trick or something

[PrinceLionheart]

Uh doesn't she tell every Hawke that she has a room at the hanged man if they are looking for company later? Anders also mention in party banter with hers that she liked one particular female prostitute at the Pearl in Denerim.

She also has banter with Bethany were she says she prefers women in the sack.

 

For what it's worth though, she'll also admit that she over-exaggerates her sex life, so who knows?

[Ina]

I always got the impression Isabella was pretty evenly split down the middle as far as gender preferences went. I don't know, maybe I wasn't too observant, but that's how I read the character.

[Hanako Ikezawa]

Honestly I much prefer this approach to DA2's though. All LI's being romancable by any gender made the romance feel so... meta - just another mechanic like upgrading your armour or choosing your talents. Characters with actual preferences feels a lot more convining and yes that means some routes are closed off. Aveline and Varric were more interesting to me as characters because they were unobtainable. It frustrates me as a serial romantic, but it satisfies me as a lover of story. 

Yes, because people who have ambiguous preferences aren't nearly as convincing as people. 

[XxPrincess(x)ThreatxX]

I always got the impression Isabella was pretty evenly split down the middle as far as gender preferences went. I don't know, maybe I wasn't too observant, but that's how I read the character.

She really prefers men, if unromanced she mentions having been sexual with women around twice & thats only if Bethany is alive.

[Chernaya]

Catching up on the thread:

 

I love Cassandra's 'new' look... (it's not a huge change, really). She looks much more unique with her own facial structure instead of the generic one from DA2, and scars and sweat have always been much hotter than makeup and smooth skin in my book. 

 

Isabela has been one of the most vocal characters about her bisexuality (flirting a lot with both genders) in my opinion. I have never played a male romancing her, but there's at least a couple party banters that I doubt change about her attraction to women in DA2. I do wish Anders didn't seem to hide his relationship with Karl from my female Hawke, that really bothered me that he would seem uncomfortable enough to do so when my Hawke would have had no problem with it at all. 

 

I would like a game one day where there isn't a promiscuous character who is attracted to both men and women. I don't hate or judge those types of characters at all (and in fact one of them is one of my favorite characters ever *points to icon*) But it really does subconsciously promote the stereotype of bisexuals or pansexuals being promiscuous just because they are attracted to both genders. Anyone can be promiscuous - Sebastian, a straight male, admitted he was before he decided to become a man of the Chantry. Oghren was to an extent. But they weren't highlighted as much as some of our bisexual/pansexual characters have been so far.   

[CuriousArtemis]

She really prefers men, if unromanced she mentions having been sexual with women around twice & thats only if Bethany is alive.

 

See, that's why I prefer their sexualities be ambiguous I like to think she prefers women

[Chernaya]

See, that's why I prefer their sexualities be ambiguous I like to think she prefers women

 

I tend to think she prefers women because she is much more jealous and protective of a female Hawke with her reactions in DA2.  But, it's all really subjective. Isabela likes both genders, that we know for sure. 

[Ina]

She really prefers men, if unromanced she mentions having been sexual with women around twice & thats only if Bethany is alive.

 

Does she really mention men all that much in comparison though? I prefer a male Hawke with her but still felt she didn't have clear preference. Maybe I just don't remember or I misread that aspect.

[WildOrchid]

She really prefers men, if unromanced she mentions having been sexual with women around twice & thats only if Bethany is alive.

 

 

And in other cases she mentions how women are good in many things, plus the way she acts with male and female Hawke. Having many "encounters" with men =/= preference. I'd think she goes with them for the fricking only (and that for her they're "easy", probably). She could very well prefer women for more "serious" things.

 

In fact, there's no proof which gender she prefers. It's all in your headcanon.