119 réponses à ce sujet

[SmilingMirror]

I knew all that already and I still like ME2 much much better than ME1.
The powers each feel different in ME2, and the bonuses matter much more when you start getting in the higher levels. 10% extra health goes along way when the game is much more gritty than the last.

Trust me, if you like RPGs, but want a faster paced game, ME2 is Wwaaaayyyy better than what ME1 was when it first came out.

Modifié par SmilingMirror, 24 janvier 2010 - 06:13 .

[abadomen]

I do NOT like the idea of gaining all the EXP at the end of the "mission" and being greeted with a "MISSION COMPLETE" screen....



That feels more action-y...less immersive...

[TileToad]

Lil Pink Pwny wrote...
People might see ME2 as dumbing down the series, but imo those people are way too invested in the idea of hardcore rpgs and are completely missing the point of Bioware's direction with the Mass Effect series. It is about a compelling story/universe driven by dialog trees and action. Bioware has made plenty of traditional adventure rpgs over the years. ME was a departure from that crowded genre. This is something different. Deal with it. It's not about appeasing console players, it's not about appealing to casual fans. It's about streamlining the tedious aspects of old school rpgs so that the story and characters comes first, and everything else enhances those parts of the game instead of hindering it or breaking up the flow.

Only problem I have with this is that such route seems awfully familiar. I think the name is Bethesda..

[abadomen]

TileToad wrote...

Lil Pink Pwny wrote...
People might see ME2 as dumbing down the series, but imo those people are way too invested in the idea of hardcore rpgs and are completely missing the point of Bioware's direction with the Mass Effect series. It is about a compelling story/universe driven by dialog trees and action. Bioware has made plenty of traditional adventure rpgs over the years. ME was a departure from that crowded genre. This is something different. Deal with it. It's not about appeasing console players, it's not about appealing to casual fans. It's about streamlining the tedious aspects of old school rpgs so that the story and characters comes first, and everything else enhances those parts of the game instead of hindering it or breaking up the flow.

Only problem I have with this is that such route seems awfully familiar. I think the name is Bethesda..

These changes seem different what Bethesda though...

Bethesda sacrifices Story/Plot...whereas Bioware(for ME2) seems to be sacrificing RPG elements(inventory/progress).

[hexaligned]

In other words, they gutted what little rpg elements it had in the first place, and dumbed it down even further than the first one.. Sad to say Bioware has moved over to my "Pirate first List" Every title they put out is more saturday morning cartoonish than the last it seems. After the first ME and DAO, my hopes for the SW mmo are pretty much gone. At this rate it won't even be fit for preschoolers.

[EatinMcRib]

Big inventories are better off in loot-em-up style games like Diablo and Borderlands. Those games had randomized items with randomized parameters, which makes finding that worthwhile piece of gear more... worthwhile. ME1 had randomized loot, but were organized into tiers with set-in-stone parameters that would only become available at certain levels.

A tier IV item cannot be better than a tier IV item, but a Sparkly Shotgun Axe of the Rapist can be better than a Sparkly Shotgun Axe of the Eunich, despite one shotaxe being the same "quality level" as the other.

In ME1 you most likely already have the best gear that was allowed to appear in the world within your level bracket, at whatever point in the game you happen to loot something, and most of the time the loot you find is either comparable or worse. This serves to only gunk up your inventory with no chance of reward, not to mention that every other guy you killed would drop metric asstons of loot like some kind of ugly pinata.

I don't give a damn what a game does with it's gameplay, as long as it does it GOOD. Likewise, it's not about how original your story is, but how you tell it.

Modifié par EatinMcRib, 24 janvier 2010 - 06:51 .

[Zack Ross]

*Facepalms* I'm glad they don't care about pleasing everyone, people are so quick to judge things these days. Bioware's always been saturday morning cartoonish. KOTOR 1 was. Obsidian did KOTOR 2 and it was much better than 1 story wise and character wise, just falls apart in the last hour and a half pretty much, and thats LucasArts fault. I still like Bioware's games tho Want a real hardcore RPG thats pretty dark though? Demon's Souls. That is all.

[Jazharah]

What I can make up from the points mentioned at the linked post at gamefaqs is that BW simplified and removed what distracted from the story, the immersion and the action.
One of the things that are mentioned is 'lack of many points in skills' - the thing that balances that out is the fact the level cap is much lower as well. Wow! you'll actually be able to come close to the levelcap when finishing the game, and the maxing of skills will actually be possible in the first playthrough so you can experience more variety with different classes without feeling the necessity to play the same class through the game 2-3 times to be able to squeeze out everything you possibly can!

All in all, most of the points the poster at gamefaqs labels 'bad' I would label as 'hell yeah!'. As it seems, they cut out our simplified what was completely unnecessary to be able to tell a good story and give a great gaming experience with an even stronger RP element (imo) by actually focusing on the story instead of mechanics, inventory management and min/maxing.

Kudo's.

[edited for typo's]

Modifié par Jazharah, 24 janvier 2010 - 06:43 .

[KainrycKarr]

relhart wrote...

In other words, they gutted what little rpg elements it had in the first place, and dumbed it down even further than the first one.. Sad to say Bioware has moved over to my "Pirate first List" Every title they put out is more saturday morning cartoonish than the last it seems. After the first ME and DAO, my hopes for the SW mmo are pretty much gone. At this rate it won't even be fit for preschoolers.

Your post reeks of idiocy.

[SurfaceBeneath]

relhart wrote...

In other words, they gutted what little rpg elements it had in the first place, and dumbed it down even further than the first one.. Sad to say Bioware has moved over to my "Pirate first List" Every title they put out is more saturday morning cartoonish than the last it seems. After the first ME and DAO, my hopes for the SW mmo are pretty much gone. At this rate it won't even be fit for preschoolers.

BAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

DA:O was dumbed down? That was the most "tactical" old school RPG since Baldur's Gate.

Looks like someone just wants to feel justified pirating games

[TuringPoint]

I think people exaggerate the "problems" of ME2's changes. ME1 really wasn't all that much of an RPG, and I find it hard to see it as a step back to improve and streamline the exact same system. Why can't some people see that's what's happened?



I also find it really hard to believe that the VO is actually worse, considering recent trailers and what numerous reviewers have said on the subject. IGN has always been fairly tough on Bioware games' sound and graphics, and they rated those high - I've observed significant improvement in overall sound and graphics quality, including VO quality, while watching justin.tv streams. That there are a few less high quality lines is to be expected in a video game at this point.



I do wish they had gone for more RPG elements, though, and that the choices had a little more impact.

[elemental150]

nm at all

Modifié par elemental150, 24 janvier 2010 - 06:47 .

[KainrycKarr]

SurfaceBeneath wrote...

relhart wrote...

In other words, they gutted what little rpg elements it had in the first place, and dumbed it down even further than the first one.. Sad to say Bioware has moved over to my "Pirate first List" Every title they put out is more saturday morning cartoonish than the last it seems. After the first ME and DAO, my hopes for the SW mmo are pretty much gone. At this rate it won't even be fit for preschoolers.

BAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

DA:O was dumbed down? That was the most "tactical" old school RPG since Baldur's Gate.

Looks like someone just wants to feel justified pirating games

Yeah. Someone forgot to think before hitting "submit" I think. Fortunately, Bioware pays attention to people actually willing to pay for a product.

[TuringPoint]

I really can't fathom what made the guy call the VO worse in the sequel. Maybe I'll see otherwise when I play it, but seriously, there are already some performances which blow ME1 VO totally outta' the freakin' water.



Really frustrating that the guy only saw fit to call out problems.

[DomerPyle]

abadomen wrote...

TileToad wrote...

Lil Pink Pwny wrote...
People might see ME2 as dumbing down the series, but imo those people are way too invested in the idea of hardcore rpgs and are completely missing the point of Bioware's direction with the Mass Effect series. It is about a compelling story/universe driven by dialog trees and action. Bioware has made plenty of traditional adventure rpgs over the years. ME was a departure from that crowded genre. This is something different. Deal with it. It's not about appeasing console players, it's not about appealing to casual fans. It's about streamlining the tedious aspects of old school rpgs so that the story and characters comes first, and everything else enhances those parts of the game instead of hindering it or breaking up the flow.

Only problem I have with this is that such route seems awfully familiar. I think the name is Bethesda..

These changes seem different what Bethesda though...

Bethesda sacrifices Story/Plot...whereas Bioware(for ME2) seems to be sacrificing RPG elements(inventory/progress).

ya, bioware sacrifices exploration and immersion for story. with oblivion, i felt as if i was in the world, but with ME, i felt as if i was watching a movie. both are good games in their own ways, though.

[elemental150]

I like less skills points in each skill branch. I am playing ME1 again right now to so I can slide that character into the second with out a break in story....The first game has 12 skill points per branch and it takes about 3 to 4 points in a skill until you actually feel and notice a difference in game. This time around each skill has 4 points and you can change it up on the fourth point. I am hoping that that is because there is a more noticable difference in power every time you invest in a point.



Also to anyone that feels the old inventory system was fine....it is because you like myself play to many RPGs. It takes forever to go through stuff in the inventory system and that is if you don't want to ad mods to any of your items, then it takes an eternity. While I am playing now I honestly check to make sure i have the best of whatever ammo I want to use on my guys before I mass sell everything in my inventory because it is a pain to deal with. I feel like it is settling to be like the inventory is fine because it is a lot like all the other RPGs out there....basically what that statement is saying is that all RPGs have large, annoying, cluttered inventory systems and not that a large inventory ystem is actually ok



Also I hate the whole dumb down thing. You can change things with out it being dumbed down

[jidnis]

DomerPyle wrote...

abadomen wrote...

TileToad wrote...

Lil Pink Pwny wrote...
People might see ME2 as dumbing down the series, but imo those people are way too invested in the idea of hardcore rpgs and are completely missing the point of Bioware's direction with the Mass Effect series. It is about a compelling story/universe driven by dialog trees and action. Bioware has made plenty of traditional adventure rpgs over the years. ME was a departure from that crowded genre. This is something different. Deal with it. It's not about appeasing console players, it's not about appealing to casual fans. It's about streamlining the tedious aspects of old school rpgs so that the story and characters comes first, and everything else enhances those parts of the game instead of hindering it or breaking up the flow.

Only problem I have with this is that such route seems awfully familiar. I think the name is Bethesda..

These changes seem different what Bethesda though...

Bethesda sacrifices Story/Plot...whereas Bioware(for ME2) seems to be sacrificing RPG elements(inventory/progress).

ya, bioware sacrifices exploration and immersion for story. with oblivion, i felt as if i was in the world, but with ME, i felt as if i was watching a movie. both are good games in their own ways, though.

 
This actually is a good point. 

I would agree with the exploration side of things, but I do feel that ME2 is highly immersive precisely because of the story.

The problem when you add too much exploration is things begin to seem cookie-cutter after a while.  You see this in ME1 where the planetary side missions were kind of boring and a little samey.  But the same could be said of the dungeons in oblivion.  They had similar formats with leveled monsters - once you've been through one, you've been through them all.  Even the countryside seems a little repetitive.  I think with Oblivion the fact that you COULD go out into the wilderness and just "see what's there" has more psychological value than the act of exploring itself

What Bethesda really should be given credit for is NPC behavior.  There was a day/night cycle, NPC's ate and they slept, and they wandered according to their schedule.  This gives an organic nature to the game which is actually its most immersive quality

[Marlina]

Haha oh wow, that guy is so silly. Every single one of his points we've already known for quite some time and on top of that, I personally think every single one of those changes are GOOD.

See, he's like "I don't like that there's not in excess of 3000 crap items that I can trash, like in ME1. I loved finding a bunch of useless junk! "

[SurfaceBeneath]

Marlina wrote...

Haha oh wow, that guy is so silly. Every single one of his points we've already known for quite some time and on top of that, I personally think every single one of those changes are GOOD.
See, he's like "I don't like that there's not in excess of 3000 crap items that I can trash, like in ME1. I loved finding a bunch of useless junk! :("

The only way they could have feasibly improved the inventory from ME1 is if there was an "Omni-gel all" button you could push every time you hit the credit limit and had bought your specter gear (aka: halfway through the game).

It's a damn good thing they removed the personal inventory and put it on the ship.

[Zulu_DFA]

ME1 was all about sci-fi.

ME2 is all about a blue busty girl, a green fishboy, a giant turtle ruffian, a "what is her face" wet dreams' princess, a tattoed juvenile deliquent, and of course about Commander Shepard in his famous pink N7 armor. The game is playable, but it's just another game now, nothing special about it. ME universe is sick, and needs a lot of good treatment in ME3 to survive.

[Jazharah]

You, sir, drink too much Mtn Dew.

[Darth_Trethon]

I don't think we'll be disappointed.

[darth_lopez]

With all New releases there is the potential of it sucking, for example some FPS players who shoot for Military Realism may recall the release of America's Army 3 over the summer and how it failed in week one miserably and most it's problems never adressed, However the fellow talking seems to be forgeting a very key point one we shouldn't over look or view just as fanboism.



This is a Bioware product. These are the guys who have created RPG after addicting difficult decision making RPG, they Created KoTOR wich is legendary in Star Wars Games, Baldur's Gate, Dragon Age, Dragon Age Origin, DAO: Awekening, and of course ME along with the best hand held sonic RPG i've ever played. Lets not forget these are the people who are making TOR and will continue to make Top Knotch RPGs that test the limits of our expectations.



Mass Effect was Considered Revolutionary interms of Sci-Fi and if Boarderlands can catch on with it's lame ending and FPS like RPG weirdness i think it's safe to say Bioware has yet to screw the pooch.



To think ME 2 will be anything short of Decent is sad it may not be exceptional, however i feel from what i've seen of leaked playthroughs on the interwebs it will be simply amazing even the armor system seems pretty niffty in a new inovative way, but i'm sure it will be at least above average. Besides not too many companies have the track record that Bioware has and the company does come into play in this matter.

[darth_lopez]

Zulu_DFA wrote...

ME1 was all about sci-fi.

ME2 is all about a blue busty girl, a green fishboy, a giant turtle ruffian, a "what is her face" wet dreams' princess, a tattoed juvenile deliquent, and of course about Commander Shepard in his famous pink N7 armor. The game is playable, but it's just another game now, nothing special about it. ME universe is sick, and needs a lot of good treatment in ME3 to survive.

i'm just gonna point out that most sci-fi universes involve similarities to whatyou call bad.