57 réponses à ce sujet

[Willowhugger]

In my mind, at least, Isseya is exceptional due to what she had to undergo personally. Granted, this assumption comes from only knowing the intimate details of what occurred during the Fourth and Fifth Blights, so we don't know what had to be done to beat Archdemons 1-3 besides the death of a Warden. In the grand scheme of things, she truly represents the Warden ideal, which is that of sacrifice. She, and to some extent, her brother, represent that which all Wardens should aspire to be like.

 

I won't disagree with that. My Grey Warden loved his quirky band at Vigil's keep but they are a collection of **** Wardens aren't they? The modern era branch sucks.

 

Velanna leaves
Anders leaves
Justice isn't a Warden, sort of.
Oghren uses the Wardens to escape his family
Alistair can desert
Fiona leaves once she's no longer going to die

 

Nathaniel and Sigrun are the only real ones who appreciate their responsibility.

 

Even my Warden sucks because he chose to let the Archdemon's soul escape because he loved Morrigan more than the oath he was forced into.

[Willowhugger]

Can you tell me how that was explained?

 

To be honest we had a lot opportunities to see how blood magic works before and from what i read about blood magic differs from what we saw and heard about it.

 

If i messed up something feel free to correct me as my informations are mostly from froum and wiki. 

I'd be interested in hearing how you think Blood Magic differs before I get into it as that would help a lot.

[Hellion Rex]

I won't disagree with that. My Grey Warden loved his quirky band at Vigil's keep but they are a collection of **** Wardens aren't they? The modern era branch sucks.

 

Velanna leaves
Anders leaves
Justice isn't a Warden, sort of.
Oghren uses the Wardens to escape his family
Alistair can desert
Fiona leaves once she's no longer going to die

 

Nathaniel and Sigrun are the only real ones who appreciate their responsibility.

 

Even my Warden sucks because he chose to let the Archdemon's soul escape because he loved Morrigan more than the oath he was forced into.

I agree that the modern Wardens have kind of lost their way, which I suppose is understandable in the sense that none of them have experienced a Blight, outside of our own companions. In particular, what irks me is how the First Warden has chosen to involve himself heavily in politics instead of truly leading the Order.

[Willowhugger]

I agree that the modern Wardens have kind of lost their way, which I suppose is understandable in the sense that none of them have experienced a Blight, outside of our own companions. In particular, what irks me is how the First Warden has chosen to involve himself heavily in politics instead of truly leading the Order.

Riordan may have a point there.

On the other hand, it may also be the Wardens need political capital so something like Loghain never happens again.

[TheKomandorShepard]

I'd be interested in hearing how you think Blood Magic differs before I get into it as that would help a lot.

I heard there was demon talk for blood mages despite such thing not being mentioned im not fan of the mages what you probably know but this is from nowhere with such numbers of blood mages we interacted and even were in our party for years like merril pretty much i have hard seeing time such factor showing.Also i heard that blood magic accelerates taint for wardens what was in fact completely opposite blood magic could incredibly slow it down.

 

But as i said i had that infro from froum so im not sure if it is true.

 

 

 

I won't disagree with that. My Grey Warden loved his quirky band at Vigil's keep but they are a collection of **** Wardens aren't they? The modern era branch sucks.

 

Velanna leaves
Anders leaves
Justice isn't a Warden, sort of.
Oghren uses the Wardens to escape his family
Alistair can desert
Fiona leaves once she's no longer going to die

 

Nathaniel and Sigrun are the only real ones who appreciate their responsibility.

 

Even my Warden sucks because he chose to let the Archdemon's soul escape because he loved Morrigan more than the oath he was forced into.

To be honest none of them were wardens even the warden could leave and even if supported wardens pretty much he had little to common with wardens.Not to mention that it was after blight and not every person will accept warden dogma and i doubt that is only in case in dragon age (not game).

[Willowhugger]

 

I heard there was demon talk for blood mages despite such thing not being mentioned im not fan of the mages what you probably know but this is from nowhere with such numbers of blood mages we interacted and even were in our party for years like merril pretty much i have hard seeing time such factor showing.Also i heard that blood magic accelerates taint for wardens what was in fact completely opposite blood magic could incredibly slow it down.

 

But as i said i had that infro from froum so im not sure if it is true.

 

Blood Mages apparently can hear demons when they cast their spells, whispering to them and tempting them. Most are capable of just tuning them out and Isseya performs what appears to be hundreds of Blood Magic rituals over the years without incident. However, one of her associates is exhausted and gets possessed by a demon when performing the same ritual. It's also implied all mages hear spirits when they cast spells but most mages hear a mixture of spirits and demons while Blood Mages hear just demons.

 

It doesn't appear to be a Big Deal but Blood Magic coming from demons is highlighted in this book.

 

As for the Blood Magic accelerating the Taint, I don't think it's actually a straight one-on-one quality. It's implied the Taint accelerates when there's a Blight as well as the fact that despair results in it accelerating. Isseya suffers great amounts of despair when she's deforming the Griffons so this results in her Calling happening much sooner.

 

Take note, though, that Avernus is a Master of Using Taint-based Blood Magic. He doesn't use Demon-Based Blood Magic after the stuff with Sophia Dryden. He says that the Taint is the only "Safe" way to use Blood Magic because Darkspawn have no connection to the Fade.

[TheKomandorShepard]

Blood Mages apparently can hear demons when they cast their spells, whispering to them and tempting them. Most are capable of just tuning them out and Isseya performs what appears to be hundreds of Blood Magic rituals over the years without incident. However, one of her associates is exhausted and gets possessed by a demon when performing the same ritual. It's also implied all mages hear spirits when they cast spells but most mages hear a mixture of spirits and demons while Blood Mages hear just demons.

 

It doesn't appear to be a Big Deal but Blood Magic coming from demons is highlighted in this book.

 

As for the Blood Magic accelerating the Taint, I don't think it's actually a straight one-on-one quality. It's implied the Taint accelerates when there's a Blight as well as the fact that despair results in it accelerating. Isseya suffers great amounts of despair when she's deforming the Griffons so this results in her Calling happening much sooner.

 

Take note, though, that Avernus is a Master of Using Taint-based Blood Magic. He doesn't use Demon-Based Blood Magic after the stuff with Sophia Dryden. He says that the Taint is the only "Safe" way to use Blood Magic because Darkspawn have no connection to the Fade.

Pretty much it went out of nowhere save blood magic from demons as that was long time before but if that is in case pretty even more supports my plan for mages as now they are even bigger walking bombs than they were before.

 

About avernus he got it during his studies so he was using "normal" blood magic but eventually found about taint powers because using blood magic.

[wcholcombe]

Its not out of nowhere, the earliest info about blood magic before DAO even came out said that blood magic attracted demons. Also, the demons didnt show up right away, they came later. That is just a small part of the fleshing out of blood magic in the story though. The way it works and functions and the negative affects it can have are interesting.

[TheKomandorShepard]

Its not out of nowhere, the earliest info about blood magic before DAO even came out said that blood magic attracted demons. Also, the demons didnt show up right away, they came later. That is just a small part of the fleshing out of blood magic in the story though. The way it works and functions and the negative affects it can have are interesting.

From what i renember it was about increasing chance of being of being possessed not demon talking to user not mention to normal mage pretty much this is big and very revelant info on mages so pretty much i would expect that mentioned very early.     .

[Palidane]

From what i renember it was about increasing chance of being of being possessed not demon talking to user not mention to normal mage pretty much this is big and very revelant info on mages so pretty much i would expect that mentioned very early.     .

It's amazing how many issues were muddied and how much was lore sacrificed so we could have specializations in DAO and DA2. Blood Magic isn't a big deal, Templars don't actually need lyrium, Dwarves can somehow access the fade, making an alliance with a Spirit of Hope is barely worth mentioning, being a blood-lusting berserker who can barely control their rage is only a positive thing...

 

I could go on. I know the protagonists are always going to be special little snowflakes to some extent, but I think they really overdid in the first two games.

[TheKomandorShepard]

It's amazing how many issues were muddied and how much was lore sacrificed so we could have specializations in DAO and DA2. Blood Magic isn't a big deal, Templars don't actually need lyrium, Dwarves can somehow access the fade, making an alliance with a Spirit of Hope is barely worth mentioning, being a blood-lusting berserker who can barely control their rage is only a positive thing...

 

I could go on. I know the protagonists are always going to be special little snowflakes to some extent, but I think they really overdid in the first two games.

About protagonist it is true sadly (or not?) but about dwarves in fact they can access the fade as oghren and varric show us as it seems they aren't completely cut off from the fade and they can't go there in normal circumstances.

[wcholcombe]

From what i renember it was about increasing chance of being of being possessed not demon talking to user not mention to normal mage pretty much this is big and very revelant info on mages so pretty much i would expect that mentioned very early. .

But that is how demons have always tempted mages by talking to them.

Rhys hears the demons whispering to him in Asunder, granted that was with the veil being thin, but demons being able to tempt blood mages by whispering to them.

That would also explain why demons would teach blood magic.

[TheKomandorShepard]

But that is how demons have always tempted mages by talking to them.

Rhys hears the demons whispering to him in Asunder, granted that was with the veil being thin, but demons being able to tempt blood mages by whispering to them.

That would also explain why demons would teach blood magic.

From what i renember demons tempted mages in dreams when they are in the fade and they need to find them.

 

From what i renember that was when mages significantly weakened the veil to the point when demons could be heard.

 

Blood magic if from demons or at least some sources claim that but also we know they aren't only way to learn blood magic.

[wcholcombe]

True but the older books say that that the old gods or demons were the first ones to teach the magisters blood magic.

There has to be more ways to tempt mages, otherwise they would only be possessed in the fade which isn't the case.

[TheKomandorShepard]

True but the older books say that that the old gods or demons were the first ones to teach the magisters blood magic.

There has to be more ways to tempt mages, otherwise they would only be possessed in the fade which isn't the case.

Well we don't know who taught blood magic some sources even claim that it were elves so we can' trly discuss about that. 

 

Well peoples go to the fade when they sleep and this is moment when demons strike pretty much mages like for example mage in codex or Feynriel that complained they had nightmares .Another moments are when mages summon one way or another demon like for example uldred.

[wcholcombe]

Or when they spontaneously turn into abominations in the games.

[TheKomandorShepard]

Or when they spontaneously turn into abominations in the games.

Well to be honest we saw only few mages turning into abomnations and those were cases when mage turned into abomnation by their own will and that was in kirkwall rest was already abomnations.

[themageguy]

It would seem that in relation to mages, magic use and spirits/ demons whispers is :

When a mage uses their own personal mana reserves, they do not hear the whispers, however when they draw on the fade to use spells, the mage hears their whispers and must shut them out ( which works) however with blood magic the mage is practically a beacon to all spirits in the fade.

Which makes sense why so many desperate mages will give themselves to a demon - they are constantly there when you draw upon the fades power, and using blood magic only makes it worse.

Apparently an abomination can slay scores of darkspawn before they perish in battle.

This info on magic use, makes it pretty clear that Templars in some shape or form are needed. Not to kill mages outright, but to protect them from not only the persecution of normal folk, but from themselves.

I really enjoyed this book.

[Willowhugger]

This info on magic use, makes it pretty clear that Templars in some shape or form are needed. Not to kill mages outright, but to protect them from not only the persecution of normal folk, but from themselves

 

Oddly, this book made me more convinced than ever the Templars are not only unnecessary but a threat to the safety of the world. Everything, both the good and the bad, came from the mages involved. The only Templars we see in the Fourth Blight are ones which tried to get the Antivan Crows to do their job for them and set the entire plot in motion.

 

Blood Magic may honestly be purely evil--at least in the context that anyone STUPID ENOUGH to learn it from a demon and use it anyway deserves what they get.

 

(Says that as Blood Mage Warden)

 

But it seemed clear to me that magic is a problem best dealt with by mages.

[themageguy]

I used to think the same thing. However, a Templar can access magic through blue lyrium without the risk of possession. A Templars abilities specifically target a magic user, and doesn't have the chance for collateral damage.

Imagine a mage or two trying to put down an abomination? Spells of such magnitude would not only risk damage to people and property, but they would inevitably weaken the veil, possibly allowing more entities to enter the world and do harm. Then if a mage was to freak out or give in, then there would be even more chaos.

Templars aren't all foul. We have some examples of very fair Templars who perform their duties appropriately.

Its Templars like Cullen and Evangeline who i believe are needed.

But back on topic this.book was an excellent read.

[Willowhugger]

That's the thing, though, that Templar abilities are also pretty worthless for fighting Abominations and Demons.

Which makes the whole thing kind of awkward.

They're very talented at fighting the problem before it's actually the biggest problem it can be.

[themageguy]

That's the thing, though, that Templar abilities are also pretty worthless for fighting Abominations and Demons.
Which makes the whole thing kind of awkward.
They're very talented at fighting the problem before it's actually the biggest problem it can be.

Templars

The History of the Order

Background

Most people don't remember the Templar Order as it once was. In the days when the Chantry was still young, templars were known as the Inquisition and combed the land in search of all dangers to humanity—whether they came in the form of blood mages, abominations, cultists or heretics. It was a dark and terrifying time in the history of Thedas, and one that only ended when the Chantry convinced the Inquisition to unite under the banner of their common faith. This agreement, the Nevarran Accord, was struck in 1:20 Divine. The Inquisition was then divided in two groups: the Seekers of Truth and the Templar Order, with the purpose of the Order becoming that of guardian and warden rather than hunter.

[Willowhugger]

I know the history.

I just think the Templars have lost their way.

Which is a shame as I'll have to destroy them and replace them in Inquisition.

:-)

[themageguy]

I know the history.

I just think the Templars have lost their way.

Which is a shame as I'll have to destroy them and replace them in Inquisition.
:-)

I think Templar abilities are sufficient enough to get the job done.

i agree with you, many Templars have lost their way regarding the circle duties of protection.

My mage inquisitor will hunt down red Templars and maleficar alike.

My templar inquisitor will hunt down maleficar, demons and try to save Templars from the corruption of red lyrium.

I really hope to see a behemoth vs an abomination.

that would be epic.