Why?
The only thing I can think of, is that being infected by the Taint is not a problem in any other situation. All of Warden's friends slaughtered their way through Deep Roads and none of them suffered from the Taint, despite the fact that only Alistair is a Warden there.
Because the plot protected everyone who wasn't supposed to get Tainted. The Taint really is supposed to be dangerous.
To add to it here's Merrill said:
"Magic can't be made safe and it can't be destroyed, fear is more powerful then magic ever could."
I agree with that statement.
Well, the only people that we saw inside were Elthina and templars.
It's the Grand Cathedral of a big city and a public place. Do you really so willfully blind to think there were only those few inside?
To add to it here's Merrill said:
"Magic can't be made safe and it can't be destroyed, fear is more powerful then magic ever could."
She's right. That doesn't mean it shouldn't be regulated.
She's right. That doesn't mean it shouldn't be regulated.
At the end of the day, magic does need regulation, and not just by mages. You need people with the abilities of a Templar to help regulate it as well.
At the end of the day, magic does need regulation, and not just by mages. You need people with the abilities of a Templar to help regulate it as well.
That's kind of why I liked the original "you don't need Lyrium for templar abilities." but alas the power of retcon ruined that.
IF it was possible that anyone without lyrium could've learned templar talents (even if they were the weaksause version) it'd been a great equalizer.
At the end of the day, magic does need regulation, and not just by mages. You need people with the abilities of a Templar to help regulate it as well.
Even on paper now the templars have no power over the circle. The circles are supposed to be autonomous according to WoT and the only reason they aren't is because the heavy templar presence in circles has made it impossible for them to be so. The only regulating body they should work with is the Chantry. The templars are guards and that's it thus should have no say in circle operation.
Even on paper now the templars have no power over the circle. The circles are supposed to be autonomous according to WoT and the only reason they aren't is because the heavy templar presence in circles has made it impossible for them to be so. The only regulating body they should work is the Chantry. The templars are guards and that's it thus should have no say in circle operation.
In places like Kinloch Hold, I see no issue with Templars holding power within the Circle. It's when you get places like Kirkwall that I see issues. To that end, my major caveat is that First Enchanters need to have more power, so as to balance the scales between he/she and the Knight Commander. Or at the least, have more power shared between the two individuals.
In places like Kinloch Hold, I see no issue with Templars holding power within the Circle. It's when you get places like Kirkwall that I see issues. To that end, my major caveat is that First Enchanters need to have more power, so as to balance the scales between he/she and the Knight Commander. Or at the least, have more power shared between the two individuals.
On paper, the FEs have all the control they need. It's only in practice that Meredith was able to get away with as much as she did.
On paper, the FEs have all the control they need. It's only in practice that Meredith was able to get away with as much as she did.
I know, but how in the world do we regulate more conservative members like Meredith? Short of sending the Seekers in every time those individuals step out of line.
I know, but how in the world do we regulate more conservative members like Meredith? Short of sending the Seekers in every time those individuals step out of line.
That's probably exactly what you have to do =/
Shortcuts are what lead to the current predicament.
That and remove them from positions that give them too much power. If they're mooks the damage they can do is pretty limited. *shrug*
That's probably exactly what you have to do =/
Shortcuts are what lead to the current predicament.
That and remove them from positions that give them too much power. If they're mooks the damage they can do is pretty limited. *shrug*
Well, for me, my biggest desire out of the next system is to make sure we need to have better, stronger Seeker oversight. When Lambert was running the show, things went to hell in a handbasket.
Well, for me, my biggest desire out of the next system is to make sure we need to have better, stronger Seeker oversight. When Lambert was running the show, things went to hell in a handbasket.
Agreed. Hopefully the Inquisition can help with that. Not full time of course. But as the emergency backup til they get things settled. It really did though. Ah well hopefully the mage templar drama can be over with quickly.
Even if it'll get status quo'd into oblivion for the next game.
In places like Kinloch Hold, I see no issue with Templars holding power within the Circle. It's when you get places like Kirkwall that I see issues. To that end, my major caveat is that First Enchanters need to have more power, so as to balance the scales between he/she and the Knight Commander. Or at the least, have more power shared between the two individuals.
I see problems. Greagoir deciding that he can lock the tower doors and lock every mage inside with demons is a problem. That he can call for an RoA is a problem. That he can demand mages be made tranquil or executed is a problem. That he can physically abuse mages and not be removed from his position is a problem. That he could overrule Irving is a problem. The templars should have no power to do these things in a circle that is supposed to be autonomous. Power should not be shared. The templars need to know their role and stay in their lane as guards.
Agreed. Hopefully the Inquisition can help with that. Not full time of course. But as the emergency backup til they get things settled. It really did though. Ah well hopefully the mage templar drama can be over with quickly.
Even if it'll get status quo'd into oblivion for the next game.
Well, the Grey Wardens work for the Blights, perhaps the Inquisition can fulfill a similar sort of function in relation to Fade matters.
I see problems. Gregoir deciding that he can lock the tower doors and lock every mage inside with demons is a problem. That he can call for an RoA is a problem. That he can demand mages be made tranquil or executed is a problem. That he can physically abuse mages and not be removed from his position is a problem. That he could overrule Irving is a problem. The templars should have no power to do these things in a circle that is supposed to be autonomous. Power should not be shared. The templars need to know their role and stay in their lane as guards.
Physically abuse? When, in that one comic?
He can't make anyone Tranquil except with Irving's concurrence, which he had for Jowan.
And in the case of ROA, I can see why he did it, even though I don't agree with his choice. He followed the rules and asked for the GC's permission, instead of going in there gung ho to slaughter everyone.
Which mages has he executed?
I see problems. Gregoir deciding that he can lock the tower doors and lock every mage inside with demons is a problem. That he can call for an RoA is a problem. That he can demand mages be made tranquil or executed is a problem. That he can physically abuse mages and not be removed from his position is a problem. That he could overrule Irving is a problem. The templars should have no power to do these things in a circle that is supposed to be autonomous. Power should not be shared. The templars need to know their role and stay in their lane as guards.
Locking the door and calling for the RoA was within their role as the guards. The Templars aren't solely bodyguards for the mages; they're also there to protect civilians from them. Argue if you want that the RoA is inefficient, but do not argue that it's outside their job description. I also see a problem with your assertion that the mages should be entirely autonomous. Kirkwall (and for a less extreme example, the more vicious Gregoir from the comics) is what happens if the Templars are allowed to police themselves, and Tevinter can result if the mages can.
Which mages has he executed?
It was going to be Jowan, after he was caught in the phylactery chamber.
It was going to be Jowan, after he was caught in the phylactery chamber.
Wait, I assume that was before Jowan launched the blood spell, right?
Well, the Grey Wardens work for the Blights, perhaps the Inquisition can fulfill a similar sort of function in relation to Fade matters.
Hopefully. I'd love if the Inquisition carried on centuries after our PCs demise. 
Locking the door and calling for the RoA was within their role as a guard. The Templars aren't solely bodyguards for the mages; they're also there to protect civilians from them. I also see a problem with your assertion that the mages should be entirely autonomous. Kirkwall (and for a less extreme example, the more vicious Gregoir from the comics) is what happens if the Templars are allowed to police themselves, and Tevinter can result if the mages can.
Yep both extremes are unsurprisingly ****.
Just need to maintain that balancing act which itself is a full time job 
Wait, I assume that was before Jowan launched the blood spell, right?
If I remember the sequence of events properly: the party comes out of the vaults, Gregoir sentences Jowan to death and Lily to Aeonar, Jowan shouts "No, I won't let you touch her" despite being the worse off one (or not depending on how bad Aeonar is), and then Jowan trolls everybody who used him to exorcise Connor by casting an uberspell that he forgets how to use sometime before Redcliffe.
If I remember the sequence of events properly: the party comes out of the vaults, Gregoir sentences Jowan to death and Lily to Aeonar, Jowan shouts "No, I won't let you touch her" despite being the worse off one (or not depending on how bad Aeonar is), and then Jowan trolls everybody who used him to exorcise Connor by casting an uberspell that he forgets how to use sometime before Redcliffe.
Prior to this though, didn't Irving and Greagoir have proof that Jowan had been studying blood magic and they were gonna use the Rite of Tranquility? Cause if they did have such proof before hand, them finding Jowan trying to escape with his phylactery is pretty damning. And I know for sure that Templars have a standing order to kill maleficar on sight.
Prior to this though, didn't Irving and Greagoir have proof that Jowan had been studying blood magic and they were gonna use the Rite of Tranquility? Cause if they did have such proof before hand, them finding Jowan trying to escape with his phylactery is pretty damning. And I know for sure that Templars have a standing order to kill maleficar on sight.
I know they had enough that Irving (who actually works to check and balance Gregoir) was comfortable signing off on the procedure. Whether or not that's actual beyond-a-reasonable-doubt I'm not sure.
Physically abuse? When, in that one comic?
He can't make anyone Tranquil except with Irving's concurrence, which he had for Jowan.
And in the case of ROA, I can see why he did it, even though I don't agree with his choice. He followed the rules and asked for the GC's permission, instead of going in there gung ho to slaughter everyone.
Which mages has he executed?
Admittedly, I can't find a citation for demanding tranquility. But in the comic he hit a mage. He demanded Jowan be executed for blood magic at the end of the magi origin and this should be entirely in circle's realm of jurisdiction. The power to kill all mages in the tower - mages that have done nothing wrong, mages that are not abominations, down to the small children - should not be permitted - that he can even ask for it is a problem. And locking them in the tower with demons - he shouldn't have the authority to do that. I don't think the mages would have chosen to lock themselves in with demons and this is where the importance of autonomy and decision making independent of the templars comes into play.
Admittedly, I can't find a citation for demanding tranquility. But in the comic he hit a mage. He demanded Jowan be executed for blood magic at the end of the magi origin and this should be entirely in circle's realm of jurisdiction.
And that's entirely in his purview. All templars have standing orders to kill maleficar on sight. And when you see one try to run off with his or her phylactery, what are you supposed to think?
Even still, initially Jowan was just gonna get Tranquility (that Irving agreed with), but when Jowan tried to run, of course he'd get a harsher punishment.
Man Jowan.
Worst reason for becoming a bloodmage I've ever seen.
"I wanted to be stronger."
The implied facepalm on my warden's face man...
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