310 réponses à ce sujet

[animedreamer]

Who do you people think is the best class of warrior, knighthood or mercenary band in the world? Every empire and kingdom boasts their warrior elite.

 

Orzammar has The Legion of The Dead, Orlais has the Chevaliers and The Chantry has the Order of The Templars.

 

But amongst all these warriors who do you think is the mightiest and which one would you want to serve the Inquisition as youe Vangaurd?

The Legion of the Dead aren't Orzammar's best warriors unless i missed something. They are just the most dedicated to taking the fight to the Darkspawn, it's actually a form of punishment for those who have offended the Ancestors/Nobles or broken some kind of law. You go to join them to make up for your transgressions so that you may die a honorable death and redeem yourself in the eyes of your clansmen and fellow Dwarves. In this Dwarves are the most devout followers of a honor system. Yes they can backstab and assassinate one another through trickery and politics, but only so long as no one catches on, because to do so openly would be dishonorable, which is even worse than simply having someone else destroyed. Warrior caste in and of itself seems to be the best of Orzammar's fighters. While Nobles can fight as well, it's generally assumed Warrior Caste produces the best fighters.

 

I would say the finest Warrior group are still the Chevalier (That is to say all forms of melee tactics) these guys are supposed not only be formidable as army but as individuals as well, the closest we see in game to such a warrior is Aveline whose own father was a former Chevalier and likely trained her in such a manner and thus Aveline herself is definitely a superior brand of warrior or at the very least is of worth, even if she didn't experience the full program that a Chevalier most complete. Loghain wouldn't have made such a big deal over these men and women who at one point helped conquer Ferelden. Just reading about their training is enough to pause and take awe. They are likely the N7 graduates of the DA Universe,

[SerCambria358]

During the history of mankind elite knights have always failed against guerrilla tactics and warfare. Chevaliers are no different. I'm not doubting their skill, they are simply not prepared for that.

And lets not just base this on knights. Antivan pirates are the only human fleet who defeated a Qunari fleet armed with explosives because they abused mist, waves and wind to their favor.

Guerrilla tactics arent a reflection of fighting ability but of strategic ability, i was under the impression that we were going by the warriors skill in fighting because if we're including skill in tactics, that just includes way too many factors (landscape,numbers,military leaders) the list goes on and on

[Mabari-Master]

Another group of warriors to take into account would be the Kirkwall Gaurd. Granted, in the begining of DA2 these guys couldn't fight their way out of a paper bag, but originally they were they cities' equivelant to an army and the Gaurd-Captain was equal to a general. What originally made them amongst the elite was the fact that they were first trained by a chevalier who ceceded from Orlais as well as the training they had originally by the Imperium. Then when Aveline came along she whipped them back into shape.

[MisterJB]

It's a contest between the Chevaliers and the Grey Wardens.

Chevaliers are trained to fight over 10 opponents at the same time, climb walls with their armor on, train to fight other warriors, demons, mages and darkspawn; they routinely sparr with moving, bladed pells; they actually have to train to test their bodies for injuries because they barely feel pain anymore and in "The Masked Empire", two chevaliers kill a small army of undead, a Revenant and an Arcane Horror in quick sucession. One chevalier killed three dalish warriors with a blanket and then went one to kill seven more, the War Leader and the First after arming himself.

 

The Wardens compete only because they can recruit chevaliers and, by lore, they have killed 5 archdemons.

[Tarvesh]

Not dying at a battle does not mean you did not lose. Also just because their planned flank didnt follow through doesnt mean they weren't met with the same odds as Grey Wardens who have won under the same conditions.

I also respect your opinion but i just dont agree with that statement, the most significant factor in an ash warriors fighting ability is their Mabari, a Mabari even a highly trained one isnt a game changer as we saw when their dogs were slaughtered almost instantly

Their ego is a major strategic flaw, but that ego doesnt reflect their fighting ability as an individual. Thats what we've been discussing

Throwing a few dozen chevalier at that horde if Darkspawn would have produced te same result as throwing those few dozen dogs at them.

But the dog doesn't fight alone. Not does the Ash Warrior. They fight together in unison.

If we're taking about brining what each warrior typically brings to a fight, the chevalier is outmatched. Chevalier brings heavy armor and weapons, an Ash Warrior brings light armor, his weapon, and his hound.

One on one or even in a group fight, I think the chevalier is outmatched. The Ash Warrior brings numbers and an unpredictable fighting style for the chevalier to overcome.

But they also have styles of fighting meant for different types of battle. Chevalier are amazing in standard medieval combat where as Ash Warriors are your medieval Girkas with hounds.

[Mabari-Master]

I don't think it's fair to set up any warrior class against the Grey Wardens. The Wardens are chosen from the most elite from all walks of life, all of them with different training and different backgrounds. They train to fight with and against magic, superior numbers, in close quarters and with butterknives if needs be. So in that respect Warden's have more diverse and more elite training than any other warrior group in the world.

[MisterJB]

Throwing a few dozen chevalier at that horde if Darkspawn would have produced te same result as throwing those few dozen dogs at them.

But the dog doesn't fight alone. Not does the Ash Warrior. They fight together in unison.

If we're taking about brining what each warrior typically brings to a fight, the chevalier is outmatched. Chevalier brings heavy armor and weapons, an Ash Warrior brings light armor, his weapon, and his hound.

One on one or even in a group fight, I think the chevalier is outmatched. The Ash Warrior brings numbers and an unpredictable fighting style for the chevalier to overcome.

But they also have styles of fighting meant for different types of battle. Chevalier are amazing in standard medieval combat where as Ash Warriors are your medieval Girkas with hounds.

 

Chevaliers train to fight demons and darkspawn; I think they can adapt to unusual fighting style quickly; fighting hounds also won't be novelty for them since their longest standing enemy in Ferelden.

 

How does light armor given an advantage against heavy armor? How is a hound, regardless of how smart, going to bite through this?

 

[Sir DeLoria]

During the history of mankind elite knights have always failed against guerrilla tactics and warfare. Chevaliers are no different. I'm not doubting their skill, they are simply not prepared for that.

Not counting the Robin Hood legend, guerilla tactics were barely used in major conflicts in Medieval Europe. They were partially used in some of the peasants revolts but almost all of those were eventually put down. They were occasionally used in the Wars of the Roses and the Hundred Years war, but usually by other knights.

Knights aren't always brutes who just rush headfirst into combat, many of them were very versatile in combat and I don't think Chevaliers would be very different.

[SerCambria358]

Throwing a few dozen chevalier at that horde if Darkspawn would have produced te same result as throwing those few dozen dogs at them.

But the dog doesn't fight alone. Not does the Ash Warrior. They fight together in unison.

If we're taking about brining what each warrior typically brings to a fight, the chevalier is outmatched. Chevalier brings heavy armor and weapons, an Ash Warrior brings light armor, his weapon, and his hound.

One on one or even in a group fight, I think the chevalier is outmatched. The Ash Warrior brings numbers and an unpredictable fighting style for the chevalier to overcome.

But they also have styles of fighting meant for different types of battle. Chevalier are amazing in standard medieval combat where as Ash Warriors are your medieval Girkas with hounds.

I just dont see how you come to that conclusion, having a hound does not conclude that your opponent is outmatched, if that were the case, every warrior would try to own one, they'd be as common as horses on the battlefield. When you have a heavily armed knight who has trained for every scenario since childhood including fighting more than one opponent, i dont see how they're outmatched by a lesser fighter with a trained mabari. A mabari can only do so much (if anything) against heavy armor while ash warriors arent heavy hitters in their own right. Heavy plate armor with a life time of training vs a well trained, lightly armored man and mabari. One on one may be difficult for a chevalier but i dont see them losing most of the time, in a group, theres just no way. A group of knights fighting non armed mabari is not an issue adding lightly armed warriors with comparatively weak training isnt going to change much. (i dont mean to say ash warrior training is weak but compare it to a chevalier and it is very insignificant)

[Drasanil]

How does light armor given an advantage against heavy armor? How is a hound, regardless of how smart, going to bite through this?

 

 

Ugh, a hound wouldn't need to bite through that. Anyone caught wearing that in public should die of embarrassment.

[Mabari-Master]

Ooh! Another warrior class that shouldn't be forgotten or underestimated is the Arcane Warrior/Knight Enchanter. In the elven culture, the Imperium and even in th Circle these militant mages utilize both their martial and magical skill to wipe out enemies from afar and up close. How badly would it suck for a Templar who disabled an Arcane Warrior's magic only to find out that he's a better swordsman than the Templar?

[MisterJB]

Ugh, a hound wouldn't need to bite through that. Anyone caught wearing that in public should die of embarrassment.

Hey, I wore that through the whole game.

The stats were grand.

[Steelcan]

Ooh! Another warrior class that shouldn't be forgotten or underestimated is the Arcane Warrior/Knight Enchanter. In the elven culture, the Imperium and even in th Circle these militant mages utilize both their martial and magical skill to wipe out enemies from afar and up close. How badly would it suck for a Templar who disabled an Arcane Warrior's magic only to find out that he's a better swordsman than the Templar?

worked real well for Arlathan and the Dales in the end

[Andraste Take the Wheel]

The Protagonists. A very prestigious group.

Yeah, my Warden could beat up a Chevalier. They ain't that tough.

[Tarvesh]

The key to this discussion is really personal preference. Where I would chose the Ash Warriors for their ferocity, mobility and the hounds, others choose chevalier or Qunari for their legendary training or lifelong dedication to their purpose.

Each force fights differently and is a paragon of their chosen strategies and fighting styles.

To really say who the best is would be impossible. Like SerCambria said, in a fight between any if these groups, it always depends on a number facts; numbers, terrain, prep time, weather, etc.

To put individuals of each group against eachother would require rules in the fashion of Deadliest Warrior and then cramming the data through a few thousand fights to find who comes out in top more often.

[AresKeith]

Chevaliers train to fight demons and darkspawn; I think they can adapt to unusual fighting style quickly; fighting hounds also won't be novelty for them since their longest standing enemy in Ferelden.

 

How does light armor given an advantage against heavy armor? How is a hound, regardless of how smart, going to bite through this?

 

 

I hope that's designed better to look more like this

 

[Steelcan]

I wouldn't count the Ash Warriors out against Chevaliers

 

heavy weapons but lightly armored is a potent combination, and the dog can at the very least occupy the attention of an opponent

[Mabari-Master]

The Arcane Warrior/Knight Enchanter archetype has also been heavily used by the Tevinter Imperium and thus far they have yet to actually been conquered. If anyone has made the most use of such a class it is the Tevinter Magisters.

[lordsaren101]

Either Chevaliers or Tevinter battlemages.

[MisterJB]

The Emerald Knights.

 

prrrrr sorry sorry

[Lulupab]

Chevaliers train to fight demons and darkspawn; I think they can adapt to unusual fighting style quickly; fighting hounds also won't be novelty for them since their longest standing enemy in Ferelden.

How does light armor given an advantage against heavy armor? How is a hound, regardless of how smart, going to bite through this?

They are like roman Legions, were very effective but starting to lose value as time passes by and people develop better strategies. With heavy armor like that their tactics and strategy is very limited. Orlais horrific defeats recently is proof of that. As far as we know Orlais even lost to Dales and was able to fight back with help of exalted marches. Also Chevaliers lost to a bunch of archer city elves and Ash warriors and ultimately a full legion of Chevaliers was defeated at river dane. Don't get me wrong they are good but I don't see them as best.

[Steelcan]

They are like roman Legions, were very effective but starting to lose value as time passes by and people develop better strategies. With heavy armor like that their tactics and strategy is very limited. Orlais horrific defeats recently is proof of that. As far as we know Orlais even lost to Dales and was able to fight back with help of exalted marches. Also Chevaliers lost to a bunch of archer city elves and Ash warriors and ultimately a full legion of Chevaliers was defeated at river dane.

They are modeled on feudal knights not roman legions

[Tarvesh]

Chevaliers train to fight demons and darkspawn; I think they can adapt to unusual fighting style quickly; fighting hounds also won't be novelty for them since their longest standing enemy in Ferelden.

How does light armor given an advantage against heavy armor? How is a hound, regardless of how smart, going to bite through this?

It doesn't need to. Mabari are extremely strong and heavy. Like modern day guard dogs, it's not the bite thy brings you down, it's the charge and lunge. Once you're in the ground, you've lost whatever advantage you had.

So the choice becomes defend against the dog or defend against it's warrior master.

[TheEternalStudent]

It doesn't need to. Mabari and extremely strong and heavy. Like modern day guards dogs, it's not the bite thy brings you down, it's the charge and lunge. Once you're in the ground, you've list whatever advantage you had.

So the choice becomes defend against the dog or defend against it's warrior master.

With enough mass (muscle and armor) the mabari isn't knocking you down.

[AresKeith]

The Emerald Knights.

 

prrrrr sorry sorry

 

I kinda want some to magically reappear in the Dales lol