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What Do You Think Of Fenris?


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#51
Darkly Tranquil

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I think this is the unfortunate consequence of the companions' word budget revolving around their personal quests this time. You get quite a bit of information on what they're focused on, but everything else is neglected. Then again, not every companion in DAO gave you the chance to mourn about your murdered family (noble origin) either. Personal stuff for the PC tends to be quite rare.

 Yeah, that was pretty much my beef with both Fenris and Anders; they never really had anything to contribute other than to air their pet grievance. Its fine for them to have those issues and for those issues to be an integral part of their characters, they just needed to break it up with some other stuff so that they didn't come across as quite so one-dimensional.


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#52
Ryzaki

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He's one of my favorite DA characters.

 

That said yeah he can be a douche so he's clearly not for everyone.


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#53
Jaison1986

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I don't like him. That being said I never went out of my way to screw him over. The first time I played the game, he left me during the last straw, then later when he showed up with Meredith I was like "okay Fenris, first of all you are being an total **** right now, and second come back to my side right this instant young man" and he accepted to come back. One thing I can say is that I appreciate the fact he is the only romance option in the game that doesn't try to be trouble, unlike Anders, Merrill and Isabela, who are pretty much playing enemy of the estate during the game.



#54
Beerfish

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I liked him a lot and his story arc showed that some pro mage people better be careful what they wish for because you can be a slave in any society, even one run by mages.  I also liked that he was as good of a house keeper in his mansion as I am in my house.



#55
Dutchess

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You have corpses lying around in your house? Eww. :P



#56
WarriorOfLight999

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As much as I might disagree with him at times, I respect him. His experiences have been terrible, and have shaped him. Yet from what I've seen, those experiences have not made him overtly cruel to mages, and this is good.


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#57
Beerfish

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You have corpses lying around in your house? Eww. :P

Shush!  Most of them are below the floor boards in the basement!  I do have a very high Febreze bill each month.


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#58
Althix

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Hypocrite. No backbone at all. Mentally weak.



#59
cheydancer

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Fenris has been and remains one of my favorite companions, both as friend and love interest.  He's a bit intense and it satisfied some personal gremlin in me to romance him with a mage, but I understood his psychological motivations.

 

Many of the Templars and non-Mage characters seemed to have a bit of a hate or fear going on for mages, heck even a handful of mages were given over to self-loathing,and they had far less reason than Fenris, or so it seemed.

I also loved the banter between him and Merrill, Varric and Anders.



#60
Dutchess

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Hypocrite. No backbone at all. Mentally weak.

 

Is this based on Night Terrors?



#61
Althix

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Night of Terrors? no, not really. Although it reveals some fun stuff on party members, but seriously, you can't  blame people and xenos for falling low before demons. I am pretty sure even a space marine have a pic of daemonette under the pillow.

 

well anyway - you see Fenris is a very against slavers and mages, however there are some situations in the game when Hawke can do some stuff like capturing elf girl into the slavery, with little to no reaction from Fenris. Also for a character that despise mages a lot, his only remark about Hawke of being a mage pops up after the joining quest of Fenris. So basically he can see for himself that mages are different, like all people, however he still discriminate the rest of the mages and Anders in particular.

 

When we learn about entire story behind these markings of his, and business with... Danarius(is that a name)? Fenris literally losing it. You can give this character to his master with no conflict at all. I mean come on, you just murderered a girl mage in some dungeon, but now you master will take you back to the slavery and you do nothing? Jesus H. Christ.

 

And the last thing. Assuming that Hawke is siding with mages, and Fenris is a full rival. You can still lure Fenris to fight for you by simply baiting him like a little child. So much for magical fisting eh? If he is a friend, i trust it makes sense if he side with you even against his personal believes, however in the case of rival and a dialogue when he is a rival? yeah.

 

But i trust some issues with writting is in order. But again, i am not a fan of majority of characters of ME and DA.



#62
Jigglypuff

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I think people tend to over-look what he has been through, i can see why he is the way he is.

 

He was my fave in da2.



#63
Althix

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then he should sit in the corner and cry.



#64
Ryzaki

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Well thankfully he's completely optional.

 

if only most companions in DA2 were =/



#65
Icy Magebane

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Well thankfully he's completely optional.

 

if only most companions in DA2 were =/

No kidding... oh well, at least we weren't required to talk to all of them (much)... and at least one of them could be told to gtfo of Kirkwall in Act 2.  ^_^


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#66
Dutchess

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Night of Terrors? no, not really. Although it reveals some fun stuff on party members, but seriously, you can't  blame people and xenos for falling low before demons. I am pretty sure even a space marine have a pic of daemonette under the pillow.

 

well anyway - you see Fenris is a very against slavers and mages, however there are some situations in the game when Hawke can do some stuff like capturing elf girl into the slavery, with little to no reaction from Fenris. Also for a character that despise mages a lot, his only remark about Hawke of being a mage pops up after the joining quest of Fenris. So basically he can see for himself that mages are different, like all people, however he still discriminate the rest of the mages and Anders in particular.

 

Okay then. You're free to hold your own opinion, but I can't say I can find myself in your arguments. Fenris is furious when you claim ownership over the elven slave (Hawke doesn't really capture her; she was already a slave and willingly switches owners). So furious that he already jumps at you before you can tell him you intend to pay her (or not). But as Hawke can make so charmingly clear, Fenris needs Hawke & co to fight Hadriana. If he outright turns his back on Hawke then, he has Hadriana on his neck. Either way, I wouldn't call his anger "little to no reaction". 

 

Fenris also comments on Hawke being a mage later on. I think at the end of Speak to Fenris, the quest at the start of Act 2. He then acknowledges Hawke is strong and has proven to be an exception (unfortunately Fenris is unable to respond to a blood mage Hawke). The problem is that even with mage Hawke or Bethany, whom Fenris can respect, they remain exceptions in Fenris' mind. The rest of the mages in Kirkwall are not exactly good at proving they should be allowed to roam free. Fenris gets an awful lot of opportunities to go "I told you so". I won't call it discriminating what Fenris does either. He argues for the Circle option when it comes to mage-related decisions, because free mages = Tevinter. LOL at "Anders specifically". Yes, the abomination definitely earned himself special treatment.

 

When we learn about entire story behind these markings of his, and business with... Danarius(is that a name)? Fenris literally losing it. You can give this character to his master with no conflict at all. I mean come on, you just murderered a girl mage in some dungeon, but now you master will take you back to the slavery and you do nothing? Jesus H. Christ.

 

Which shows how Fenris just completely crumbles at the betrayal he has been confronted with. His sister, the family he so desperately wanted to have and risked his life and freedom for by inviting her to come to Kirkwall, betrayed him and brought Danarius with her. To become a magister, one of the monsters who inflicted unimaginable pain on him. That's a huge blow. And then Hawke, after six years of fighting by his/her side, suddenly steps back and announces he is on his own. Fenris has no chance to defeat Danarius and his private army of slavers, demons and undead on his own. He explicitly says this to rival Hawke when he pleads not to do this. Alone, he has nothing to fight for. He can't win, and Danarius will capture him and bring him back to Tevinter, whether Fenris tries to fight or not. That means he can't even choose death over slavery, because Danarius can easily make sure Fenris does not get killed if he chooses to fight. So Fenris cannot even bring himself to resist. He knows it's futile. How is this hypocritical of him? 

 

And the last thing. Assuming that Hawke is siding with mages, and Fenris is a full rival. You can still lure Fenris to fight for you by simply baiting him like a little child. So much for magical fisting eh? If he is a friend, i trust it makes sense if he side with you even against his personal believes, however in the case of rival and a dialogue when he is a rival? yeah.

 

If Fenris is full rival he doesn't have to be lured or baited. He will side with Hawke. Period. Because Fenris respects rival Hawke. Rival Hawke has hammered on how magic is not necessarily evil and how it is not the single cause of Fenris' misery and unhappiness. Hawke tries to change Fenris' mind, show him it's not always as he fears. In the end Fenris admits that he has played his own part in the problems he still struggles with after Danarius' death (isolation, lack of purpose, no real life now that he is free and can do what he wants). Long story short, Hawke can show him a better way on rivalry, can make him realize magic and mages aren't always evil. I think even on rivalry he sides with the mages more for Hawke's sake, because he trusts and respects Hawke, but it's not strange at all that rival Fenris can side with the mages. On friendship it is actually stranger, because then Hawke has affirmed his beliefs that the world would be better off without magic. 


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#67
Althix

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as i recall, Hawke can say that Fenris just changing one master for another. and that triggers rival Fenris to side with mages... really? is that a respect for Hawke you mentioned before? so yeah rival Fenris siding with mages - laughable.

 

Upon another cases. You see Fenris is in dire need for help. Any help really. Without Hawke and co, he can't stand against Danarius. Which means he was on a suicide mission from the very beginning.

This xenos murdered a mage.. Hadriana in cold blood, and after that he actually can feel loss and betrayal? Really? Also if i recall Fenris wanted these markings. So the pain he suffered, he actually deserved. Action => consequence. So i believe he was in the great pain after all, and as result he suffered psychic trauma sure.

 

And about slave girl, her willingness to be a slave should not be taken into consideration at all, especially as argument to somehow justify Fenris and his behavior. He knows that he can't do **** without Hawke, so his standing as anti slaver crumbles under the weight of his own needs and agendas.



#68
renfrees

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as i recall, Hawke can say that Fenris just changing one master for another. and that triggers rival Fenris to side with mages... really? is that a respect for Hawke you mentioned before? so yeah rival Fenris siding with mages - laughable.

That's plain wrong. Hawke can persuade Fenris to side with mages (if he's not full friend/rival) either by: asking him if freedom from slavery means something to him; telling him if dying by his side is too much to ask for; or asking if all he wants is to win (depending on personality). If he's locked, then he will stand with Hawke right away, commenting that even though it is a mistake, he won't abandon them.

 

 

 

Upon another cases. You see Fenris is in dire need for help. Any help really. Without Hawke and co, he can't stand against Danarius. Which means he was on a suicide mission from the very beginning.

This xenos murdered a mage.. Hadriana in cold blood, and after that he actually can feel loss and betrayal? Really? Also if i recall Fenris wanted these markings. So the pain he suffered, he actually deserved. Action => consequence. So i believe he was in the great pain after all, and as result he suffered psychic trauma sure.

He murdered a person, who inflicted physical and mental torments on him for as long as he remembers, who came to recapture or kill him, and you blame him for it? I don't even... What's wrong with this world?

Also, Fenris wanted a boon to free his family, and fought to achieve it. He didn't know that markings would be an additional "benefit" to becoming Danarius' bodyguard, as Gaider confirmed.

 

I wonder how with this attitude and prejudice you didn't repeat Anders' words, that Fenris was simply jealous of his sister being a mage. You clearly listened too much to abomination.


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#69
Dutchess

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as i recall, Hawke can say that Fenris just changing one master for another. and that triggers rival Fenris to side with mages... really? is that a respect for Hawke you mentioned before? so yeah rival Fenris siding with mages - laughable.

 

Again, this is not full rivalry you're talking about. Full friendship or rivalry means Fenris sides with whatever Hawke decides. If the relationship is not maxed, he will side with the templars initially. If you're on the friendship path, you can later convince him to return to your side with the dialogue option you mentioned. If he's on the rivalry path with Hawke no dialogue can convince him to switch sides. Or this is after you've passed 50% rivalry. I'm not sure. It is, however, different from the scenario you are suggesting.

 

 

Upon another cases. You see Fenris is in dire need for help. Any help really. Without Hawke and co, he can't stand against Danarius. Which means he was on a suicide mission from the very beginning.

 

The mission being what, exactly? Initially he simply fled away from Danarius, who then pursued Fenris by sending lots of hunters after him. Fenris has successfully stayed out of their grasp for three years. He hired Hawke to investigate the bait the hunters had set up for him and then asked help for confronting Danarius in his mansion to finally turn the chase around. Should Fenris have kept running for eternity? Danarius was not going to give up. On his own, he was bound to be captured eventually, if that's what you mean. So Fenris realizes he needs help and finds it. How is this wrong on his part? It's hardly his fault he can't best all the means a Tevinter magister has at his disposal. As long as Danarius lives he can't start a new life as a free man, because at some point his former master can show up to destroy it all.

 

This xenos murdered a mage.. Hadriana in cold blood, and after that he actually can feel loss and betrayal? Really?

 

There's something wrong. You're feeling sorry for Hadriana. Just because she's a mage? That woman tormented him for years and Fenris found the hard way he is unable to move past the hatred he feels for her as a result. He genuinely regrets that he could not keep his word to her because it shows how much his past and the people in it are still controlling him. So much so that it brings him to break his own promise. Fenris is the victim in this situation, and claiming Hadriana is just because she had been defeated in battle is not right. Had it been the other way around - if Fenris had been the one to lose and lie on the floor like that - she would have dragged him back to Tevinter in chains. Then Fenris would have been the helpless one. Only then would her actions have been wrong? Or are mages just supposed to win?

 

[quote[Also if i recall Fenris wanted these markings. So the pain he suffered, he actually deserved. Action => consequence. So i believe he was in the great pain after all, and as result he suffered psychic trauma sure.[/quote]

 

Wow. He did not want the markings. He did not know he would receive the markings if he won the boon (word of Gaider). All he knew was that he could earn a boon, and he used that boon to have his mother and sister freed from slavery. But yeah, if you want that, you totally deserve to undergo agony so traumatic that it wipes your memory.

 

 

And about slave girl, her willingness to be a slave should not be taken into consideration at all, especially as argument to somehow justify Fenris and his behavior. He knows that he can't do **** without Hawke, so his standing as anti slaver crumbles under the weight of his own needs and agendas.

 

It's true Fenris is not entirely selfless. Absolutely. But what exactly was he supposed to do when Hawke claimed the slave? He vehemently protested and Hawke said "nope". All that he could have done then was fight Hawke & co. That would likely have gotten him killed. And if he had won, he had a young, naive slave girl he cannot take care of. In a cave filled with slave hunters and the apprentice of Danarius. What was his alternative, according to you?

 

 

Edit: damnit, renfrees. :P  I could have known the new post would render my long ramblings moot. 



#70
renfrees

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This discussion strongly reminds me of this meme:

 


Fenris:*says that he went through a ritual he only remembers cause it was agonizing and remembers nothing else from his past, including his family*

Fenris:*was enslaved and sexually abused by mages and was so under Danarius's control he snapped and killed the only people who had shown him kindness*

Fenris:*sister turns out to be alive and she betrays him to the man who abused him and he feels alone in every way possible even when he has friends because he lost what little he had to of his past*

Fandom:God, Fenris is soooo whiny!

 

And this - http://fableprincess...nageconfessions


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#71
KaiserShep

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This xenos murdered a mage.. Hadriana in cold blood, and after that he actually can feel loss and betrayal? Really?

 

Can't knock him for rubbing out some contemptible vampire that was murdering her own slaves to augment her powers. As dear ol' dad used to say: "F*** 'em."



#72
Althix

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I am not feeling sorry for Hadriana because she was defeated. However i really doubt that person who can murder another person in cold  blood can suffer any doubts or remorse. The first time you hit a person, or you fire at person in anger - you change. Believe it or not, even in sparring in the ring many people can't attack somebody else. Mental block of sorts. But our emo-elf simply murder a woman just because he can. Which i approve.

 

Mission to kill Danarius. Yeah sure, he hired help and he stormed into the mansion in order to kill Danarius, and he was ok to trust his life to some random people who could just run away before some demons. Point is, if you are about to end life of somebody, you don't hesitate. Honestly this entire business with Danarius - was a problem of Fenris from the very start. Hawke or no Hawke - if was a elf's fight. But nope - Hawke should decide. Why? Because Fenris is weak. OK.

 

About slave girl - his alternative is to keep his mouth shut. Easy.



#73
themikefest

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Well thankfully he's completely optional.

 

if only most companions in DA2 were =/

Yep. Anders and Merril come to mind

 

The only thing for me, is the overkill of him saying mage are this and that. Otherwise I had no problem with him. I enjoyed his dialogue when I had him with Anders and Merril with me,  which was not very often.


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#74
Sir DeLoria

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Well thankfully he's completely optional.
 
if only most companions in DA2 were =/


*cough* Anders *cough*
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#75
Ryzaki

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*cough* Anders *cough*

 

Yep. Anders and Merril come to mind

 

The only thing for me, is the overkill of him saying mage are this and that. Otherwise I had no problem with him. I enjoyed his dialogue when I had him with Anders and Merril with me,  which was not very often.

 

Especially Merrill since she plays absolutely zero significance on the plot. Her being forced is the biggest wut.


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