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[eyezonlyii]

Because they both might not necessarily strain suspension of disbelief to an equal degree.

Take a game like Mass Effect as an example. People are able to suspend disbelief about faster than light travel because it gets an in-universe explanation through element zero and mass effect physics. It makes sense for the game world even if it doesn't for the real world. If Shepard were depicted as surviving prolonged unprotected exposure to the hard vacuum of space however, the same people who suspend disbelief for FTL would probably cry foul, because the human body and its limitations are what they are. The latter strains suspension disbelief to a greater degree.

I think most people also realize the limitations of games when it comes to depicting romances between characters. By necessity you've got to boil that down to just a handful of conversations. It is not unlike the movies, even romance flicks, where you're really just viewing snippets of these characters lives rather than the entirety of it. Lets say the events of DA:I stretch over a period of six months. Presumably the main character and the love interest talk more than a handful of times over those six months, but the player just eavesdrops on the bits that are important to the story or those characters' arcs.

Also can you imagine a fully realistic portrayal of a romance? It would be mind-numbingly boring. I'm not sure I'd want to hear every conversation that a couple has. In fiction (and I include games with that) we don't need to hear, see, or read every mundane detail of the characters' lives.

So much this. Though me and mine have conversations that should be transcribed by Metatron himself.

[Lady Luminous]

Not. In. The. Slightest.

 

is better for being purely conservative IMO. At least it has color.

 

...Since when are gold and red not colours? (Not to mention that I find your example hideous and bulky.)

[someguy1231]

Yeah, realism is the wrong word. Most games that go for full on "realism" do indeed tend to be boring for me as well. But when I say I'm looking for "realism" in a game like DA, it's somewhat different from, say, ARMA. I'll point you at this post I made earlier in this thread that explains what people who say "realism" in regards to games like this mean:

 

 

 

Actually, sorry, reading your post again maybe I slightly misunderstood you. You might not've been quite questioning the use of "realism" the way I though you were. Or maybe you were. It's late, I'm sleepy

 

 But I'll leave that there anyway. Because overall, it does sum up what we're after - a believable world. And that is what we find fun to play. I'm not by any means going to claim everyone is like that. But of course I'm going to push for what I find believable and fun in a fatnatsy setting.

 

Anyway, in regards to romances, yeah, people, including myself, have been objecting to them not being believable in this very thread...

 

Yeah, I get what you're saying about internal consistency, and that's exactly why I find Bioware's romances so cheesy and immersion-breaking. They want me to think that this is "True Wuv" or "meant to be" or whatever, but I just can't buy it. The fact that it seems like half of all posts/threads here are romance-related is another big reason I see hypocrisy in this whole thing. It's clear that many fans of these games like the romances and how they're depicted, even though, if you look at them with the same eye for "realism" that armor is being subjected to, they don't hold up any better than bikini armor.

[Seraphim24]

I don't think either one is my favorite, but I thought that would be useful. I guess not.

 

The one you posted was one of the worst things I've ever seen though, I could probably a picture of just about anything and like it better. It's not just the (relative) absence of color.

[Muspade]

I could probably a picture of just about anything and like it better. It's not just the (relative) absence of color.

 

Hopefully this works for you.

[PhroXenGold]

Not. In. The. Slightest.

 

is better for being purely conservative IMO. At least it has color.

 

Thing is, the armour that CaptivatingKS posted isn't "conservative". That implies a deliberate attempt to obscure sexuality due to being offended by it, which simply isn't present. The attractiveness, the sexuality and the lack thereof of this armour have absolutely nothing to do with the design. It is designed from a purely practical standpoint, it considers what works to protect the wearer from attacks while not obstructing their movement significantly and that's it. Nothing more, nothing less. Sexual morality, positive and negative, are simply not involved.

[Lady Luminous]

I don't think either one is my favorite, but I thought that would be useful. I guess not.

 

The one you posted was one of the worst things I've ever seen though, I could probably a picture of just about anything and like it better. It's not just the (relative) absence of color.

 

Ouch, seriously. The worst? It's not nearly as bad as that WoW massive armour you posted the other day!

[someguy1231]

Because they both might not necessarily strain suspension of disbelief to an equal degree.

 

Take a game like Mass Effect as an example. People are able to suspend disbelief about faster than light travel because it gets an in-universe explanation through element zero and mass effect physics. It makes sense for the game world even if it doesn't for the real world. If Shepard were depicted as surviving prolonged unprotected exposure to the hard vacuum of space however, the same people who suspend disbelief for FTL would probably cry foul, because the human body and its limitations are what they are. The latter strains suspension disbelief to a greater degree.

 

I think most people also realize the limitations of games when it comes to depicting romances between characters. By necessity you've got to boil that down to just a handful of conversations. It is not unlike the movies, even romance flicks, where you're really just viewing snippets of these characters lives rather than the entirety of it. Lets say the events of DA:I stretch over a period of six months. Presumably the main character and the love interest talk more than a handful of times over those six months, but the player just eavesdrops on the bits that are important to the story or those characters' arcs.

 

Also can you imagine a fully realistic portrayal of a romance? It would be mind-numbingly boring. I'm not sure I'd want to hear every conversation that a couple has. In fiction (and I include games with that) we don't need to hear, see, or read every mundane detail of the characters' lives.

 

Yeah, now that I think about it, I can't think of a single video game that depicted romance well, in my opinion. Video games just aren't the right medium for it, I guess. If they really must boil it down to "a handful of conversations", then there's no way I'll ever be able to suspend my disbelief over it.

[PhroXenGold]

Yeah, I get what you're saying about internal consistency, and that's exactly why I find Bioware's romances so cheesy and immersion-breaking. They want me to think that this is "True Wuv" or "meant to be" or whatever, but I just can't buy it. The fact that it seems like half of all posts/threads here are romance-related is another big reason I see hypocrisy in this whole thing. It's clear that many fans of these games like the romances and how they're depicted, even though, if you look at them with the same eye for "realism" that armor is being subjected to, they don't hold up any better than bikini armor.

 

Well, I dunno. Romance in DA is pretty consistently unrealistic. I guess thats just the way love works on Thedas

[Lady Luminous]

Fine then... What about this? Better? 

[Todrazok]

Considering crafting and customization is one of the big selling points for DAI, why not both? 

[Lady Luminous]

Well, I dunno. Romance in DA is pretty consistently unrealistic. I guess thats just the way love works on Thedas 

Yeah, now that I think about it, I can't think of a single video game that depicted romance well, in my opinion. Video games just aren't the right medium for it, I guess. If they really must boil it down to "a handful of conversations", then there's no way I'll ever be able to suspend my disbelief over it.

 

Well, if you think about standard action movies where the protagonist has a love interest, do we ever really get more than a handful of mushy scenes and some sex scenes? 

[Seraphim24]

No... it's really not.. lol. I'm not really putting a ton of effort into this exactly.

 

As to the Cryptid one that is definitely a lot better, however just from that game there were a few that I thought were pretty cool.

 

[xkg]

Ehh, ok. Why even waste your time reading the entire thread.

 

This sums up it perfectly. Every single argument is here.

 

[Lady Luminous]

No... it's really not.. lol. I'm not really putting a ton of effort into this exactly.

 

As to the Cryptid one that is definitely a lot better, however just from that game there were a few that I thought were pretty cool.

 

 

 

Oh for eff's sake, Kefka. You are impossible to please. Have you ever considered compromise instead of posting over-the-top sparkly/colourful images?

[Seraphim24]

Zelda's pretty cool and is neither here nor there IMO. Also um wasn't that the first one I posted? So there's conservative, crazy over the top sparkly, and in the middle, if people don't like any of them then I think this impossible to please comment is the other way around.

 

[PhroXenGold]

Well, if you think about standard action movies where the protagonist has a love interest, do we ever really get more than a handful of mushy scenes and some sex scenes? 

 

Interestingly, this is actually tied into something I've rather been realising over the last year or so - I find I just don't enjoy most films anymore because they're never really long enough to properly tell a story, particularly given the seeming need to throw in sideplots like the horribly abbreviated romances you mention. So yeah, in terms of depth, DA romances probably have more that most non-romance films. But even then, it's no so much the depth of the romances I feel hurts my belief, it's the way that they're all player controlled. It's like the NPCs exist just so you can act out your fantasy of falling in love, rather then them feeling like genuine people with agency of their own.

[eyezonlyii]

I don't think either one is my favorite, but I thought that would be useful. I guess not.

 

The one you posted was one of the worst things I've ever seen though, I could probably a picture of just about anything and like it better. It's not just the (relative) absence of color.

I actually like the one you posted. and with just a hint more protection in the midsection, it could easily fit in DA. 

[Lady Luminous]

Zelda's pretty cool and is neither here nor there IMO.

 

 

I'll show my girly side and admit I wouldn't mind wearing that around Denerim or the skyhold, but I'd never wade into the darkroads wearing something so flouncy. 

[Cainhurst Crow]

Ehh, ok. Why even waste your time reading the entire thread.

 

This sums up it perfectly. Every single argument is here.

 

 

Oh please, you can make a bingo for anything. Doesn't make it anything on there any less valid tbh.

 

[PhroXenGold]

No... it's really not.. lol. I'm not really putting a ton of effort into this exactly.

 

As to the Cryptid one that is definitely a lot better, however just from that game there were a few that I thought were pretty cool.

 

 

The thing about images like that is they're made by men in order to entice other men into playing the game. It's pure exploitation. it's not some wonderful positive expression of sexuality. It's there to give teenagers a boner.

 

Not that I have a huge problem with that - hell, I watch porn and play h-games - but it is what it is and nothing more.

[Lady Luminous]

Interestingly, this is actually tied into something I've rather been realising over the last year or so - I find I just don't enjoy most films anymore because they're never really long enough to properly tell a story, particularly given the seeming need to throw in sideplots like the horribly abbreviated romances you mention. So yeah, in terms of depth, DA romances probably have more that most non-romance films. But even then, it's no so much the depth of the romances I feel hurts my belief, it's the way that they're all player controlled. It's like the NPCs exist just so you can act out your fantasy of falling in love, rather then them feeling like genuine people with agency of their own.

 

Sometimes I can understand this, like with Isabella or Merill, but I'll tell you I fell head over heels for Mirrigan within minutes of meeting her, so to me it felt pretty real. 

[Seraphim24]

I would say it's exploitation in the sense of not providing any other context for the game sure, but we're just talking about outfits here. I don't play any of the card games because they aren't games in any meaningful sense, they don't provide any justifications for their characterization (which barely exists) and a whole host of other reasons.

 

However, objectively, I can't say some of them don't at least look somewhat cool. I also wouldn't be surprised if mostly younger people played those games. I'm not sure why attractive pictures would only attractive older people for some reason.

[PhroXenGold]

Sometimes I can understand this, like with Isabella or Merill, but I'll tell you I fell head over heels for Mirrigan within minutes of meeting her, so to me it felt pretty real. 

 

Yeah, I mean, they're not awful, and I have enjoyed them (even Isabella's was good up to the point it became more than flirting and causal sex...), and indeed, I don't mind having some done in the "Bioware" style. I just wish at times there was more, well, uncertainty. More agency on behalf of the NPCs, rather than just being a matter of "if I pick the right dialogue, she'll sleep with me".

 

Oh, and I'm still in love with Jaheira...  

[eyezonlyii]

Yeah, I mean, they're not awful, and I have enjoyed them (even Isabella's was good up to the point it became more than flirting and causal sex...), and indeed, I don't mind having some done in the "Bioware" style. I just wish at times there was more, well, uncertainty. More agency on behalf of the NPCs, rather than just being a matter of "if I pick the right dialogue, she'll sleep with me".

 

Oh, and I'm still in love with Jaheira...  

Maybe if an NPC initiated the contact (like Zevran), and actually tried to woo you. that would be cool.