It kind of reminds me of Illium's indentured servitude program, where indentured servitude is a way to pay of debts, serve time, get the bare necessities, etc and those involved are ensured certain protections like having your needs seen to, protection from abuse, etc.
Interestingly, one time in Bioware's history where slavery wasn't presented as an unmitigated evil.
If they chose to sleep until they become archdemons they want to die.
I don't think they choose to sleep. I think they were bound there.
It kind of reminds me of Illium's indentured servitude program, where indentured servitude is a way to pay of debts, serve time, get the bare necessities, etc and those involved are ensured certain protections like having your needs seen to, protection from abuse, etc.
That would be the most ethical and least controversial way of presenting Slavery in Tevinter for the next DA game I think. It is a very uncomfortable subject after all.
That would be the most ethical and least controversial way of presenting Slavery in Tevinter for the next DA game I think. It is a very uncomfortable subject after all.
Well, for the protagonist at least. We know that Tevinter doesn't do just that when it comes to slavery, so all slavery in Tevinter being that would be a huge retcon.
It makes sense that there are different variations of slavery in a society that is so ancient and heavily reliant on it.Well, for the protagonist at least. We know that Tevinter doesn't do just that when it comes to slavery, so all slavery in Tevinter being that would be a huge retcon.
It makes sense that there are different variations of slavery in a society that is so ancient and heavily reliant on it.
Yeah, but it sounded like that's how you wanted slavery in Tevinter in general presented to which I disagreed. While that can be a type of slavery they show, there is too much of the worse slavery shown in past games for that kind to be ignored in Tevinter.
As I believe Danarius brought Fenris with him to social gatherings and into public eye, I think the treatment of slaves is largely dependent upon the owner of said slaves. The Pavus family might treat their slaves kinder than others but that may be more likely an indication of their character than an indication of the laws concerning slavery and their treatment.
As I believe Danarius brought Fenris with him to social gatherings and into public eye, I think the treatment of slaves is largely dependent upon the owner of said slaves. The Pavus family might treat their slaves kinder than others but that may be more likely an indication of their character than an indication of the laws concerning slavery and their treatment.
Yes, there are some slave owners in Tevinter who treat their slaves well considering, and then there are those who rape and/or murder their slaves on a whim or for blood sacrifices, and probably everything inbetween.
I have no doubt that the more horrible aspects will be shown in Tevinter, but we need to maintain a certain degree of realism, not just the bad parts,but the more morally grey and ambiguous aspects.Yeah, but it sounded like that's how you wanted slavery in Tevinter in general presented to which I disagreed. While that can be a type of slavery they show, there is too much of the worse slavery shown in past games for that kind to be ignored in Tevinter.
While I've nothing fond to say about slavery including that which goes on in Dragon Age, I do hope they portray the people of Tevinter including those that own slaves as diverse because we've seen enough to know that the treatment of slaves can be diverse. I'd like to see different opinions about slavery and attitudes towards slavery including amongst slaves.
Mind you, this does not mean that there should be a downplaying of the aspects of Tevinter slavery we have seen such as people being sold into slavery against their will, being forced to fight in arenas and being sacrificed in blood rituals.
I'm referring to showing the various mindsets that can exist when slavery is a normalized part of a culture and society and has been so since ancient times. A character can downplay these aspects of Tevinter slavery as per their characterization but the writers should not downplay these aspects of Tevinter slavery. I do not know if that makes sense but it is the best phrasing I can provide at the time.
So, indentured servitude is finally being acknowledged as a real thing?
Anyways, anyone seen HBO's Rome? They've got all kinds of slaves. From the fortunate to the unfortunate.
So, indentured servitude is finally being acknowledged as a real thing?
Anyways, anyone seen HBO's Rome? They've got all kinds of slaves. From the fortunate to the unfortunate.
Loved that series. Yeah, the treatment and positions of slaves in Tevinter will undoubtedly vary widely. Let's hope that if our PC is a slave they don't get a a shall we say, unappreciative master.
So, indentured servitude is finally being acknowledged as a real thing?
Anyways, anyone seen HBO's Rome? They've got all kinds of slaves. From the fortunate to the unfortunate.
Indentured servitude was a real thing but it was a labor system begging to be abused and so it was often to such a degree that it became slavery in all but name, to my knowledge.
I'll be fine with it appearing but not if they do not show how easily it can and would be abused especially in a place like Tevinter where corruption is prevalent: how equally would a Tevinter court weigh the word of a person of low status against the word of a person of high status?
being forced to fight in arenas
For the record, there were also gladiators who actually volunteered for the arena for a job, housing, and a chance at fame and fortune. Kinda like a sports team. They didn't always die if they gave a good-enough show for the audience, since dead gladiators means no more repeat business with that gladiator.
For the record, there were also gladiators who actually volunteered for the arena for a job, housing, and a chance at fame and fortune. Kinda like a sports team. They didn't always die if they gave a good-enough show for the audience, since dead gladiators means no more repeat business with that gladiator.
I know and that I'd like to see just as long as I also see people where that is not the case.
Tevinter is going to be a difficult country, culture and society to portray but I have faith in the writers.
I am so looking forward to experiencing it all and oh, the companions we could have!
Indentured servitude was a real thing but it was a labor system begging to be abused and so it was often to such a degree that it became slavery in all but name, to my knowledge.
I'll be fine with it appearing but not if they do not show how easily it can and would be abused especially in a place like Tevinter where corruption is prevalent: how equally would a Tevinter court weigh the word of a person of low status against the word of a person of high status?
I am well aware that indentured servitude could be much abused by masters who bought and sold the contracts over and over again. Its just...there's this chip on my shoulder. That "chip" is Fiona negotiating for indentured servitude but everyone keeps calling it slavery much to my personal vexation.
I am well aware that indentured servitude could be much abused by masters who bought and sold the contracts over and over again. Its just...there's this chip on my shoulder. That "chip" is Fiona negotiating for indentured servitude but everyone keeps calling it slavery much to my personal vexation.
The reason I do that is because I see it as strongly implied that Alexius is not going to honor the contract he made with Fiona at all. He alters the deal without Fiona's consent and shows he does not care about her protest.
Inquisitor: "What does the Imperium gain from taking rebels mages under it's wing?"
Magister Geron Alexius: "For the moment, the Southern mages are an considerable expense. After they are properly trained, they will join our legion."
Fiona: "You said not all my people would be military. There are children. Those not suited-"
Magister Geron Alexius: "And one day I am sure they will all be productive citizens of the Imperium when their debts are paid."
The reason I do that is because I see it as strongly implied that Alexius is not going to honor the contract he made with Fiona at all. He alters the deal without Fiona's consent and shows he does not care about her protest.
Inquisitor: "What does the Imperium gain from taking rebels mages under it's wing?"
Magister Geron Alexius: "For the moment, the Southern mages are an considerable expense. After they are properly trained, they will join our legion."
Fiona: "You said not all my people would be military. There are children. Those not suited-"
Magister Geron Alexius: "And one day I am sure they will all be productive citizens of the Imperium when their debts are paid."
Of course he wasn't going to honor the contract. He isn't even working for Tevinter.
I do believe that "Indentured Servitude" could be abused.
But I always thought that Tevinter Citizens entering such a contract will have rights. Certainly more rights than the Mages under Fiona. Especially if we consider that the Venatori are not sanctioned, nor supported (officially) by Tevinter. So such a contract might not even be truly valid.
That and Alexius probably used that as a ruse anyways to gain entry + more mages to bind
I am well aware that indentured servitude could be much abused by masters who bought and sold the contracts over and over again. Its just...there's this chip on my shoulder. That "chip" is Fiona negotiating for indentured servitude but everyone keeps calling it slavery much to my personal vexation.
Indentured servitude is slavery. With the only caveat being the promise of "eventual" freedom
Edit: or does "human/elven trafficking" make it sound more palatable?
Indentured servitude is slavery. With the only caveat being the promise of "eventual" freedom
Interestingly, one time in Bioware's history where slavery wasn't presented as an unmitigated evil.
The only case we know about in the rest of Thedas of indentured servitude being practiced is in DA2, where Hawke and family enter into this arrangment for one year to pay off whatever group bribed the guards to cover their entrance fee into the city.
So either indentured servitude is legal in the rest of Thedas and they do make a distinction between it and slavery... or it's just as illegal and Hawke's situation was more of a gentleman's agreement to work off the loan for their creditors directly?
I'd add it as another "positive" example, since while they didn't enter into the arrangement without reluctance, Hawke's creditors did let them go at the end of their year of service and consider the debt covered in full. They could have easily ratcheted up the price (or in this case the period of time) to cover the "interest", as so often happens when people are in debt (especially when it's to loan sharks).
Indentured servitude is slavery. With the only caveat being the promise of "eventual" freedom
Edit: or does "human/elven trafficking" make it sound more palatable?
Interesting... how do you feel about the debt culture of the United States where you cannot strive for anything without credit and cannot have credit without debt?
Of course he wasn't going to honor the contract. He isn't even working for Tevinter.
Also that.
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