15949 réponses à ce sujet

[Reznore57]

I didn't say just Tevinter. I mean everything. I'm just focused on ethics and drama. That goes for all literature really. It's one thing I hate about a lot of fantasy.. many authors are trying to do their version of Tolkien-esque world building. And it's not even fun from an RPG standpoint. PnP GMs are all about world building too, but they wouldn't get much playtime if they went on and on about it. People want to live and play in their settings. Not forage through them.

 

Somewhere along the way, CRPG campaign creators were left to their own devices.. and the storytelling became very one sided. It's just them flooding people with codexes and slowly "revealing" how they constructed their world. 

 

And this is supposedly drama. It's not. It's weak. Either that or I have to be a big fan of someone to appreciate it. Which I'm not here. Maybe Kirkbride in TES. Maybe because I don't understand him half of the time. He sounds pretty high.

 

I fear I'm gonna get it much worse from Weekes. It seems he picked all the characters that delved in "high level" stuff (Cole, Bull, Solas), along with writing a lot of poetry codexes. Great.

 

It's not like there isn't any potential for drama with slavery in Tevinter , I mean beyond the slavery is bad thing.

Lore says slaves do not get along at all , they are also divided in some type of caste , mostly an imaginary class system they made up themselves...where a slave who , for example , is worked to death on mines or on the fields is not equal to a slave who mostly do some paper work in a nice place.

 

They went a tiny bit there with Fenris sister who said being a Liberati , a freed slave , sucked worse than being an actual slave...but not sure they will keep on with the slaves supporting slavery because their living condition aren't bad , and ready to throw their rebellious peers under the bus.

 

To be honest I'd like a bit of both , high fantasy where you discover ancient lore and all that stuff , but I have to say I'm still waiting for something like Fallout New Vegas where you dealt with down to earth issues , fight for ressources , fight over political ideologies with all different factions who had their own way of living and were ready to fight to the death or make some truce.

 

Tevinter would be nice for this, having different factions with different agenda , and you could create a possible coalition between some of these factions .

[straykat]

It's not like there isn't any potential for drama with slavery in Tevinter , I mean beyond the slavery is bad thing.

Lore says slaves do not get along at all , they are also divided in some type of caste , mostly an imaginary class system they made up themselves...where a slave who , for example , is worked to death on mines or on the fields is not equal to a slave who mostly do some paper work in a nice place.

 

They went a tiny bit there with Fenris sister who said being a Liberati , a freed slave , sucked worse than being an actual slave...but not sure they will keep on with the slaves supporting slavery because their living condition aren't bad , and ready to throw their rebellious peers under the bus.

 

To be honest I'd like a bit of both , high fantasy where you discover ancient lore and all that stuff , but I have to say I'm still waiting for something like Fallout New Vegas where you dealt with down to earth issues , fight for ressources , fight over political ideologies with all different factions who had their own way of living and were ready to fight to the death or make some truce.

 

Tevinter would be nice for this, having different factions with different agenda , and you could create a possible coalition between some of these factions .

 

There is a lot of potential drama. Just like there is here..or rather, there was. This was the last story I expected high fantasy, but they went and did it anyways.

 

So there's potential, but I'm cautious what the writers actually do with it.. and present it. And I'm really wary of Patrick Weekes. His first foray into Dragon Age, and he went full-on lore geek.

[Lulupab]

Well my point was if you put aside the very slim chance one might be released of slavery or a way out of hopeless poverty, some slaves are in better situation than those in Alienages, and some are in worst.

 

It entirely depends on their masters. Like the master doesn't even have to be nice, as long as he is not cruel. That would mean the slave would spend most of his time in luxury houses, even if he would spend that time working. There would be food and at least half decent bed and room for them to sleep in. But if the master is cruel, then the slave has a worse life in comparison to people in Alienages.

 

In simpler words, slaves with good masters are in gilded cages, but people in alienages are in filthy diseases ridden cages. 

[straykat]

Well my point was if you put aside the very slim chance one might be released of slavery or a way out of hopeless poverty, some slaves are in better situation than those in Alienages, and some are in worst.

 

It entirely depends on their masters. Like the master doesn't even have to be nice, as long as he is not cruel. That would mean the slave would spend most of his time in luxury houses, even if he would spend that time working. There would be food and at least half decent bed and room for them to sleep in. But if the master is cruel, then the slave has a worse life in comparison to people in Alienages.

 

In simpler words, slaves with good masters are in gilded cages, but people in alienages are in filthy diseases ridden cages. 

 

If this is anything like the ancient world, there's chance of disease or poisoning in many places. That might be par for the course

 

But I think someone like... the mentality of Orana and Fenris (Fog Warrior era Fenris) is much different than a City Elf. There doesn't even seem to be a sense of pride or autonomy in their psyche.

[Gervaise]

I think may be you are blaming Patrick Weekes a bit too much for the direction the story took.   Yes, he was responsible for writing those characters but I'm pretty sure that he was following an overall plot that was given to him.   In fact DG originally wanted to keep Cole but had give him up for lack of time    Where PW may have had some influence was over the desire to make Solas a more sympathetic character, as I gather originally he was meant to be far more obviously an untrustworthy trickster than he ultimately became.    This is likely because PW has admitted that he feels far more comfortable writing conflicted characters rather than out and out villains. Bear in mind that the Fen'Harel portrayed in Felassan's tales seems far more in keeping with the original incarnation of Solas, even though PW wrote Masked Empire, which suggests that at that time he was still keeping to the original concept.   According to DG only half the story originally envisaged for DAI has been told, which means the plot is already there to be developed and it won't be solely down to PW what happens next.

[straykat]

Well, I blame fans too... if you want me to spread the love. lol. They're the ones that largely hated DA2, got it's expansion canceled, and called death threats on Jen Hepler and her family. She was originally Gaider's choice to take over lead.

 

And it all came at a time when many complained that DA2 and ME3 weren't heroic enough..... which I think convinced people at Bioware or EA to write DAI the way they did. They act real proud and defensive when these games are out, but when it comes to making new games, they seem to cave in. Which isn't necessarily a good thing.

[Hellion Rex]

Meh, in the grand scheme of things, I think DAI was pretty good, all things considered. Better than DA2 in some respects.

[raging_monkey]

I like am all each has a flaw that improves the series

[Daerog]

I kind of liked the time jumps in DA2 since the hero worked from the bottom to the top rather than a straight shot to the top.

I would like DA4 to have the hero work for a house in order to gain more power in order to be independent. The hero will be given orders and missions, but the hero decides how to proceed and finish the mission. Options for betrayal would be a plus.

By focusing on Tevinter and a war with the Qunari, I hope to learn more about modern Thedas before questing for lost history.

Each DA game is a little different, and I would like to see DA4 to also try something different.

I just hope we are not choosing the Archon this time around, a war hero would be enough.

[straykat]

DA2 is definitely flawed, but I even prefer it's flaws compared to DAI. lol

 

The copy paste maps are terrible, but I would say the Inquisitor themselves is just as shoddily done... and it's more important. And for all the pretty visuals and big maps, the quests still mostly suck.

 

The best thing I can say about DAI is the art design...they finally got a lot of their vision down. Like armor styles and such. That part will probably carry over to the next game.

[nightscrawl]

I fear I'm gonna get it much worse from Weekes. It seems he picked all the characters that delved in "high level" stuff (Cole, Bull, Solas), along with writing a lot of poetry codexes. Great.

I can understand your concern. I sort of have something similar because I'm not really into elves in general (or Qunari), and I'm concerned that they will go even more heavy on elven lore in the next games, particularly since Solas is PW's character.

BUT I think it's important to remember that he's not some lone novelist creating this world and getting absorbed and lost in elven lore. He may be head writer, but he is still part of a team and does not have the final say, just as David Gaider didn't have the final say during his time.

[straykat]

I can understand your concern. I sort of have something similar because I'm not really into elves in general (or Qunari), and I'm concerned that they will go even more heavy on elven lore in the next games, particularly since Solas is PW's character.

BUT I think it's important to remember that he's not some lone novelist creating this world and getting absorbed and lost in elven lore. He may be head writer, but he is still part of a team and does not have the final say, just as David Gaider didn't have the final say during his time.

 

I focus on him because he's the main change...and suddenly just came into a major lead part.

 

But I also get the feeling he was a relatively fresh member who finally got access to the "lore bible" and just spazzed out on it. And while I like Gaider, he just seemed resigned. Maybe I'm reading too much into it. It just seemed like he cared less. Like one time I asked him about backstories and he just told me to make up everything myself. I'm OK with that in many RPGs, but it's not what I expected here. With Bioware, there was more back n forth between author and audience. I don't think this new direction came out of some desire for open-ness, but because he stopped giving a ****. And now he's gone.

[Lumix19]

Meh, in the grand scheme of things, I think DAI was pretty good, all things considered. Better than DA2 in some respects.

It was pretty good. Though if I'm honest I would pick DA2 over DA:I in a heartbeat. Not that DA:I was bad but DA2 is an underappreciated game in my opinion.

[nightscrawl]

I focus on him because he's the main change...and suddenly just came into a major lead part.
 
But I also get the feeling he was a relatively fresh member who finally got access to the "lore bible" and just spazzed out on it. And while I like Gaider, he just seemed resigned. Maybe I'm reading too much into it. It just seemed like he cared less. Like one time I asked him about backstories and he just told me to make up everything myself. I'm OK with that in many RPGs, but it's not what I expected here. With Bioware, there was more back n forth between author and audience. I don't think this new direction came out of some desire for open-ness, but because he stopped giving a ****. And now he's gone.

 
I don't think that was a wrong response for that question, though, especially because the DAI origins purposefully left so much open to interpretation and headcanon. You have to remember that people quote him on everything, and that "Word of God" was basically "Word of Gaider" for a long time. If he says that the Trevelyan non-mage was meant to be this or that, then he would be invalidating people's roleplay choices.

 

You may not have been satisfied with that response, but I am quite happy with it.

[straykat]

 
I don't think that was a wrong response for that question, though, especially because the DAI origins purposefully left so much open to interpretation and headcanon. You have to remember that people quote him on everything, and that "Word of God" was basically "Word of Gaider" for a long time. If he says that the Trevelyan non-mage was meant to be this or that, then he would be invalidating people's roleplay choices.

 

You may not have been satisfied with that response, but I am quite happy with it.

 

He was also telling me to make up everything, despite their codex. Like to just forget it. This is dropping all commitment... even that little bit. That doesn't make any sense to put that in there, if he really wanted openness. It just tells me he stopped caring.

 

I don't mind this on principle, but it's just about expectations. I expect mysterious chosen one prisoners waking up in The Elder Scrolls... because that's TES' schtick. It's like a joke at this point. I don't expect it from Bioware.... especially with how cinematic they've become.

[Hellion Rex]

I will say this about DA2 - I preferred the smaller cast, and in the next game I do hope we return to that. I felt like DAI had too many. I think 7 is a decent number of party members to have without it being too many.

[straykat]

I think that the DA2 cast just fit it's story more.. (kind of hard to screw that up though. DA2 was perfect for a simple band of adventurers). I wouldn't mind DAI's large cast, but some of them have nothing to do "Inquisitions". It's trying to be the whole band of adventurers gimmick Bioware always does, but it's not really great for this group. Nor are half of the activities.

[Heimdall]

On that note, I kinda hope DA4 ties off this Solas world saving business and DA5 goes for something a bit more low key.

[nightscrawl]

On that note, I kinda hope DA4 ties off this Solas world saving business and DA5 goes for something a bit more low key.

 

Completely agree. I'd give even more "likes" if I could.

[Hellion Rex]

I kind of hope the Tevinter game isn't a part of the Solas storyline, as I think it deserves it own arc, one not boggled down by this storyline. Being honest, I'm really done with the ancient elf stuff. I honestly wish it had been self contained in DAI, not dragged through multiple main games. I don't give a rats behind about Solas at the moment. The lore reveals were cool and all but I'm ready to move on to something else.

[AlleluiaElizabeth]

Where PW may have had some influence was over the desire to make Solas a more sympathetic character, as I gather originally he was meant to be far more obviously an untrustworthy trickster than he ultimately became.    This is likely because PW has admitted that he feels far more comfortable writing conflicted characters rather than out and out villains. Bear in mind that the Fen'Harel portrayed in Felassan's tales seems far more in keeping with the original incarnation of Solas, even though PW wrote Masked Empire, which suggests that at that time he was still keeping to the original concept.  

I don't see any real discrepencies btwn the Solas we got in DAI/Tresspasser and the Fen'Harel from the Slow Arrow or Adruil's Tree stories. What do you mean by this? 

 

I kind of hope the Tevinter game isn't a part of the Solas storyline, as I think it deserves it own arc, one not boggled down by this storyline. Being honest, I'm really done with the ancient elf stuff. I honestly wish it had been self contained in DAI, not dragged through multiple main games. I don't give a rats behind about Solas at the moment. The lore reveals were cool and all but I'm ready to move on to something else.

Pretty sure you're going to be disappointed on that front, then. But maybe the conflicts of Tevinter will be well integrated with the Solas plot in the background till its in the foreground. That's doable, imo.

[nightscrawl]

I think may be you are blaming Patrick Weekes a bit too much for the direction the story took.   Yes, he was responsible for writing those characters but I'm pretty sure that he was following an overall plot that was given to him.   In fact DG originally wanted to keep Cole but had give him up for lack of time    Where PW may have had some influence was over the desire to make Solas a more sympathetic character, as I gather originally he was meant to be far more obviously an untrustworthy trickster than he ultimately became.    This is likely because PW has admitted that he feels far more comfortable writing conflicted characters rather than out and out villains. Bear in mind that the Fen'Harel portrayed in Felassan's tales seems far more in keeping with the original incarnation of Solas, even though PW wrote Masked Empire, which suggests that at that time he was still keeping to the original concept.   According to DG only half the story originally envisaged for DAI has been told, which means the plot is already there to be developed and it won't be solely down to PW what happens next.

 

That all may be accurate, but don't you think that the final result was actually more interesting? If Solas were more obviously shady (yes, I'm aware some players were suspicious from the outset), then it wouldn't have been as much of a mind screw as it ultimately was, you wouldn't want to scream in his face, "I thought you were my friend! Why are you doing this?!" because you wouldn't have felt that way about him.

 

Whether PW chose that path for Solas because he was more comfortable in writing him that way doesn't really matter in the end. We have the Solas that we have. Also, I've gathered from other people that are more familiar with PW is that part of the concern stems from the fact that he is very into magic and those sorts of things, so a head writer who really enjoys that aspect of fantasy worlds might be likely to have it lean more heavily in that direction. If that's not something you also support, I think it's not unreasonable that one might have some negative thoughts about it.

 

 

As for me, I just have no interest in elves or Qunari, so the next game likely featuring a heavy dose of both has not got me quivering in anticipation. The only thing saving DA4 for me at this point is the other half of the DAI plot, as you mention, and the possibility of finally getting into Tevinter.

[raging_monkey]

Well they could do half and half. First half solas fiasco second the reformation

Rest filled in with dlc(properly paid for) or heck maybe do what fallout did divergence or some temporal acolypse that resets the world

[Hellion Rex]

I just really don't want it to be Inquisition Part 2: Tevinter Edition.

If anything, I want it to be perhaps indirectly related Solas, or have the events progress naturally without his direct influence. I want it to be subtle, without us even perhaps realizing what's going on till the end. I imagine the "Tevinter Theater", if you will, is one of many cogs in the wheel of his grand master plan as of right now.

Also, I really don't want to see the character himself in the game either.

[nightscrawl]

^ Hah, I actually like BOTH of those, the Inquisition Part 2: Tevinter Edition, and the "Tevinter Theater." I'd take either and be quite pleased.