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[Star fury]

I'm sick of Fiona after only reading the wiki article about her...ugh...

Fiona is the ultimate Mary Sue. She looks like she came from a particularly bad fanfic. But Gaider loves Mary Sues cause he inserted Tallis too.

[ComedicSociopathy]

Fiona is the ultimate Mary Sue. She looks like she came from a particularly bad fanfic. But Gaider loves Mary Sues cause he inserted Tallis too.

 

Really...

 

Is Fiona loved by all the characters she interacts with?

Is Fiona referred to as the most beautiful women in all of Thedas?

Does Fiona singlehandedly win every conflict without suffering one defeat even once?

Is Fiona an obvious self-insert of David Gaider?

Is Fiona the main character of every novel she's in?

Is Fiona a Half-Elf-Dwarf-Kossith love child?

 

If all these are not yes then I'm pretty sure she's not a Mary Sue. A badly written character maybe, but not a Mary Sue. 

[Keroko]

*ahem* Getting back to the topic of templar support, I raise the vote that templars can be exceedingly more tolerant than most people claim they are, when the choice for tolerance is for the greater good. Our greatest example of this tolerance?

 

Knight Commander Meredith.

 

I'll give you a moment to pick your jaws from the floor.

 

...

 

Jaws back in place? Okay. Now, remember, Hawke can be a mage. And as far as mages go... Hawke is probably the least subtle mage in Thedas' history. Meredith would have known of his existence for years, yet she happily let a known apostate run around in Kirkwall all those times.

 

And that's not just theoretical. She damn-well knew Hawke was a mage:

 

 

The reason she let him run around? Because Hawke was actually working to make the drekhole known as Kirkwall a decent place to live in. For that, Meredith was knowingly and willingly letting him run around without cuffing him and dragging him to the Circle.

 

"But Keroko!" you cry. "Meredith was an absolute dictator towards mages!"

 

Yes. She was. Because the Circle in Kirkwall was suspected of harboring blood mages. Which, aside from being an incredibly shady magic, goes against the very rules the Circle itself agrees with. The Circle was being extremely uncooperative with any investigation the templars attempted, which does nothing to lower anyone's suspicion. Yes, it meant that Meredith took draconian steps to limit mages freedom in order to be able to carry out her investigations, but in all of this remember one thing:

 

She was right.

 

Of course, Orsino claims she's just pulling things out of her ass, but given that we can't walk from the door of our house to the next street over without tripping over half a dozen blood mages, his words sound like weak excuses. You could throw a stone in any random direction and you'd have a good chance of hitting a blood mage! And even the lovely hypocritical First Enchanter himself greedily absorbed the knowledge of blood magic we handed him. Oh sure, he claimed he was going to 'seal it away', but that didn't stop him from studying and practicing it to the point where he could do the entire ritual completely from memory when push came to shove.

 

In the end, Meredith did go over the edge. But was that because she was a templar? Or because of the red lyrium?

 

Given that she let a mage Hawke walk around freely despite being a mage, I am inclined to say the later.

[Lulupab]

First of all the PC doesn't count, what do you expect? To have a dramatic difference between mage and other classes? Thats not going to happen therefore Meredith HAS TO allow Hawke to do that. She also has to tolerate Merril and Anders. Anders even insults her and she does nothing.
 
There is so much room for abuse in the order and that needs to be fixed. Even the highest ranking cop cannot change the rules and for good reason. Their experiences can change them and that's why highest ranking officials who know what they are doing determine the rules and the police enforce them. As a lawyer on my first playthrough when I heard Thrask saying Meredith changed the rules I knew I was going to face disaster because a Templar changed the rules as she seems fit, the law and the consequences are clear. Such decision can only come from highest ranking officials in Orlais, whoever they are.
 

[EmperorSahlertz]

Meredith doesn't change the rules. She enforces them more harshly.

[Keroko]

They could have Meredith be ignorant of Hawke's status as a mage. Yet, she is not. She willingly allows Hawke to remain free. Even Bethany is overlooked by Meredith, even if Cullen disagreed on that matter.

 

Also note how you encounter more blood mages around a single city in DA2 than you did through the entirety of Ferelden in Origins. Yes, Meredith enforced the rules extremely harshly, because there is enough crime and coverups of said crime to warrant doing so. When the crime rate in a city gets higher, so does police response to crime.

 

And strict adherence to rules goes both ways. If you judge Kirkwall for being harsher with its rules, then you also acknowledge Rivainn was in the wrong when it loosened theirs.

[Sir DeLoria]

Fiona is the ultimate Mary Sue. She looks like she came from a particularly bad fanfic. But Gaider loves Mary Sues cause he inserted Tallis too.

Tallis...ugh...don't remind me, killing half a dozen Crows in her intro without breaking a sweat...

[dragonflight288]

They could have Meredith be ignorant of Hawke's status as a mage. Yet, she is not. She willingly allows Hawke to remain free. Even Bethany is overlooked by Meredith, even if Cullen disagreed on that matter.

 

Also note how you encounter more blood mages around a single city in DA2 than you did through the entirety of Ferelden in Origins. Yes, Meredith enforced the rules extremely harshly, because there is enough crime and coverups of said crime to warrant doing so. When the crime rate in a city gets higher, so does police response to crime.

 

And strict adherence to rules goes both ways. If you judge Kirkwall for being harsher with its rules, then you also acknowledge Rivainn was in the wrong when it loosened theirs.

 

You only trip over blood mages during act 3, and in high town at night.

[Lulupab]

Meredith doesn't change the rules. She enforces them more harshly.

Thrask continues that Meredith has been justifying murder of apostates when there is nothing to incriminating them. Killing any mage other those labeled as Maleficar is openly forbidden. Maleficar means a mage who has harmed someone or is simply a blood mage.

She changed the rules in the circle as well as kirkwall by stopping anyone from becoming Viscount. I'm not saying the whole Templar order is corrupted, I'm saying its too easy to be corrupt.

[Lulupab]

They could have Meredith be ignorant of Hawke's status as a mage. Yet, she is not. She willingly allows Hawke to remain free. Even Bethany is overlooked by Meredith, even if Cullen disagreed on that matter.
 
Also note how you encounter more blood mages around a single city in DA2 than you did through the entirety of Ferelden in Origins. Yes, Meredith enforced the rules extremely harshly, because there is enough crime and coverups of said crime to warrant doing so. When the crime rate in a city gets higher, so does police response to crime.
 
And strict adherence to rules goes both ways. If you judge Kirkwall for being harsher with its rules, then you also acknowledge Rivainn was in the wrong when it loosened theirs.

On this top Gaider has said that while Kirkwall had more blood mages, there were more normal mages and Hawke somehow stumbled upon every blood mage in Kirkwall.

[Keroko]

Which still doesn't change that there was a ridiculous amount of mages -even Circle mages- who practised blood magic. Yes, Meredith was taking excessive measures but again, greater rate of crime leads to a greater police crackdown. This is not a new thing.

And it's kind of sad that the templar order is labelled as "to easy to become corrupt" while the mages, who face the threat of corruption every day merely by living, are just as constantly excused. Even though Bioware throws blood mage after blood mage followed by a heaping dose of abominations at us to show that falling to the lure of power is ever so easy for mages.

[Lulupab]

Which still doesn't change that there was a ridiculous amount of mages -even Circle mages- who practised blood magic. Yes, Meredith was taking excessive measures but again, greater rate of crime leads to a greater police crackdown. This is not a new thing.

And it's kind of sad that the templar order is labelled as "to easy to become corrupt" while the mages, who face the threat of corruption every day merely by living, are just as constantly excused. Even though Bioware throws blood mage after blood mage followed by a heaping dose of abominations at us to show that falling to the lure of power is ever so easy for mages.

Templars are obligated to fight corruption, no? Evidently even the police face harsher punishments than actual criminals if they abuse their stations, Templars should be no different. They hold (held?) unjust power and it left a lot of room for corruption and this shouldn't happen in an order who is supposed to fight it.

[Keroko]

Templars are obligated to fight corruption, no? Evidently even the police face harsher punishments than actual criminals if they abuse their stations, Templars should be no different. They hold (held?) unjust power and it left a lot of room for corruption and this shouldn't happen in an order who is supposed to fight it.

Templars are obligated to watch for magic corruption and fight it wherever it appears. They are not obligated -nor trained- to fight political corruption. That's the job of the Seekers.

[herkles]

Templars are obligated to watch for magic corruption and fight it wherever it appears. They are not obligated -nor trained- to fight political corruption. That's the job of the Seekers.

 

The templars should though work to avoid corruption within their own ranks though as that can hinder their mission. 

[Hellion Rex]

Well, Meredith's Lyrium Sword is a thing now.

[Keroko]

The templars should though work to avoid corruption within their own ranks though as that can hinder their mission.

 
Yeah, but it's a helluvalot harder to judge your own organization than it is to judge another.

It's why police policing the police rarely turns out well.

Which is also why the Seekers existed. But then they got corruption in the high ranks as well, and since nobody was policing them... well, here we are.
 

Well, Meredith's Lyrium Sword is a thing now.

... Well this won't end well...

[Hellion Rex]

Better Meredith Sword shot

[The Baconer]

Yes, Meredith was tough on maleficarum... except when it really mattered.

 

Why not just search the tower?

[AresKeith]

Yes, Meredith was tough on maleficarum... except when it really mattered.

 

Why not just search the tower?

 

I think Orsino wouldn't let her

[Hellion Rex]

I think Orsino wouldn't let her

Yeah. He demanded probable cause and evidence before he'd let her in.

[Keroko]

Yeah. He demanded probable cause and evidence before he'd let her in.

 

Which, of course, she couldn't get because she needed to get in to search for it.

 

Its a miracle she didn't just storm the tower.

[The Baconer]

I think Orsino wouldn't let her

 

He couldn't stop her from doing anything she wanted in Act 3. It remained un-searched because of Meredith and Meredith alone.

[MisterJB]

Well, Meredith's Lyrium Sword is a thing now.

Placeholder?

I mean, it broke and I can't seen the game allowing to start sniffing Red Lyrium.

[Master Warder Z_]

He couldn't stop her from doing anything she wanted in Act 3. It remained un-searched because of Meredith and Meredith alone.

The grand cleric likely didn't approve the search.

She was her immediate superior.

[Hellion Rex]

Placeholder?

I mean, it broke and I can't seen the game allowing to start sniffing Red Lyrium.

We have corruption runes, which appears to mimic red lyrium weapons. We see it in the Crafting and Customization video.