63 réponses à ce sujet

[TheKomandorShepard]

Well it's not that simple since he is more of a Spirit-Demon Hybrid. Even Rhys didn't sense him as just a Demon. He's basically a Spirit using the body of a dead Mage, not a Demon possessing someone or a Spirit - Human like Anders. I mean look at Wynne and her Spirit of Faith for example. She didn't try killing anyone. It's possible that our actions in Inquisition can result in Cole becoming either a Good Spirit, or a heartless Demon maybe. As of now, it's right not to trust him and be cautious, but trying to kill him off so quickly just sounds foolish to me since we don't even know how this is going to plan out.

Lambert used on him litany what proves either he is blood mage what is out or is demon.Andes wasn't detected as demon or spirit as well despite he was an abomnation not mention that rhys simple could be under demonic influence what he admist himself that he could be.Wynne was still dangerous abomnation as asunder showed under right circumstances she started act as an abomnation same for anders only difference was she had different trigger.

 

It doesn't work like that demon still is dangerous even if it thinks it is "good" like justice or vengeance simple you don't trust abomnations/demons if you do you end poorly that is pretty much series theme.

[ZRO]

you had it right, Just like Wynne anders and every other abomination they are to be used as tools then deposed of.

 

Actually, that's not completely true. Both Wynne and Anders had a Spirit living inside them. For Wynne, it was the Spirit of Faith. For Anders, the Spirit of Justice/Vengeance. For Cole, there is only Cole. He is the Spirit himself who has the body of the original Cole who actually already died. There isn't "two beings in one" like an Abomination.

[TheKomandorShepard]

Actually, you both have it wrong. Both Wynne and Anders had a Spirit living inside them. For Wynne, it was the Spirit of Faith. For Anders, the Spirit of Justice/Vengeance. For Cole, there is only Cole. He is the Spirit himself who has the body as the original Cole who actually already died. There isn't "two beings in one" like an Abomination.

As i said cole is demon lambert confirmed that neither cole or rhys could deny he is dangerous and unstable creature like anders he already was serial killer good luck if he will blow up city because it will be good in his eyes.

[Tevinter Soldier]

Actually, that's not completely true. Both Wynne and Anders had a Spirit living inside them. For Wynne, it was the Spirit of Faith. For Anders, the Spirit of Justice/Vengeance. For Cole, there is only Cole. He is the Spirit himself who has the body of the original Cole who actually already died. There isn't "two beings in one" like an Abomination.

 

no different than if a fade entity was to posses a suit of armour, they are of the fade, not to be trusted. you put them down with prejudice.

[ZRO]

As i said cole is demon lambert confirmed that neither cole or rhys could deny he is dangerous and unstable creature like anders he already was serial killer good luck if he will blow up city because it will be good in his eyes.

 

I would prefer to go with what Bioware is calling Cole, not Lambert, who would only blindingly call Cole a Demon. Also, if he were just "another Anders" that will screw up the story, there wouldn't be much of a point to even have him in the game if Bioware just planned on doing the same thing over again.

Lambert used on him litany what proves either he is blood mage what is out or is demon.

 

That much is true, but even Bioware says he stuck between being either a Spirit OR Demon, since he has the characteristics of both. Hence why they only nicknamed him The Spirit. They're basically saying it's not one or the other.

[Defne]

It takes more effort, but spirits can physically manifest, as shades.

But not alive.

 

But if he fully went into the Fade, that suggests he's a shade copying mage-Cole's body, rather than an abomination using mage-Cole's body.

Magisters were in the Fade and abominations.

[TheKomandorShepard]

I would prefer to go with what Bioware is calling Cole, not Lambert, who would only blindingly call Cole a Demon. Also, if he were just "another Anders" that will screw up the story, there wouldn't be much of a point to even have him in the game if Bioware just planned on doing the same thing over again.

 

Lambert used the Litany to undo Cole's invisibility. Yes, it's mostly for Demons, but then again, even Bioware says he stuck between being either a Spirit OR Demon, since he has the characteristics of both. Hence why they only nicknamed him The Spirit.

 

As i said litany confirmed that he is demon and even if he was spirit and he isn't he is still dangerous because as i said being self-righteous won't make you any less dangerous not mention spirit rly don't want possess anyone or get into human world and he did.He proved he is crazy and dangerous by fact being serial killer and by helping cause world war.  

[Arvaarad]

Actually, that's not completely true. Both Wynne and Anders had a Spirit living inside them. For Wynne, it was the Spirit of Faith. For Anders, the Spirit of Justice/Vengeance. For Cole, there is only Cole. He is the Spirit himself who has the body of the original Cole who actually already died. There isn't "two beings in one" like an Abomination.

Wynne had already died (or was very, very close) when the spirit of faith arrived. She died immediately when the spirit left.

There seems to be a "freshness" factor that determines how much of the host's personality is still there. I expect that merging with a very fresh corpse is similar to merging with someone that's almost dead. Even Kristoff still had a faint influence on Justice. It's only after some time being dead that it becomes just a spirit in a body.

[ZRO]

As i said litany confirmed that he is demon and even if he was spirit and he isn't he is still dangerous because as i said being self-righteous won't make you any less dangerous not mention spirit rly don't want possess anyone or get into human world and he did.He proved he is crazy and dangerous by fact being serial killer and by helping cause world war.  

 

And as I said, Bioware wouldn't make him a Companion in this game if were just going to be doing all of those "mercy killings" again. It would just be poor writing if Cole is just another character that's going to cause a lot of upsets. It's clear they're trying to redeem the character in a way that they couldn't do with Anders. The difference is, Anders knew what he was doing. Cole however thought he was doing right by killing those people. I think judgement on him can be simple. He apparently only wants to help the Inquisition by saving lives. So if your Inquisitor is constantly saving people and doing good while having Cole along, he can probably become the Good Friendly Spirit he wants to be, and people begin to accept him. If your Inquisitor brings Cole along and prioritizes in power or anything renegade-ish instead, then Cole may become the Demon serial killer again that he was known for in Asunder. Possibly even worse to the point where we kill him. And if we never recruit him or just never bring him along or help, be might just stay the same the entire time. My point is, there's going to be more to the character than just the the "He's a Demon, kill it!" thing.

[TheKomandorShepard]

And as I said, Bioware wouldn't make him a Companion in this game if were just going to be doing all of those "mercy killings" again. It would just be poor writing if Cole is just another character that's going to cause a lot of upsets. It's clear they're trying to redeem the character in a way that they couldn't do with Anders. The difference is, Anders knew what he was doing. Cole however thought he was doing right by killing those people. I think judgement on him can be simple. He apparently only wants to help the Inquisition by saving lives. So if your Inquisitor is constantly saving people and doing good while having Cole along, he can probably become the Good Friendly Spirit he wants to be, and people begin to accept him. If your Inquisitor brings Cole along and prioritizes in power or anything renegade-ish instead, then Cole may become the Demon serial killer again that he was known for in Asunder. Possibly even worse to the point where we kill him. And if we never recruit him or just leave never bring him along or help, be might just stay the same the entire time. My point is, there's going to be more to the character than just the the "He's a Demon, kill it!" thing.

Rly? rly? Anders .

Anders also thought he was "right" why you think he did that for fun?

As i said he is demon not good sprit that gives everyone cookie and being self-righteous don't make them any less dangerous as you said he was crazy demon because he thought he was doing good.

 

No he won't for me he is there to punish players that are dangerously naive and think if they will hug something everything will be alright that how it should be i will be disappointed if they will put "power of love will solve everything" into dragon age .

[ZRO]

Rly? rly? Anders .

Anders also thought he was "right" why you think he did that for fun?

As i said he is demon not good sprit that gives everyone cookie and being self-righteous don't make them any less dangerous as you said he was carazy demon because he thought he was doing good.

 

No he won't for me he is there to punish players that are dangerously naive and think if they will hug something everything will be alright that how it should be i will be disappointed if they will put "power of love will solves everything" into dragon age .

 

You really can't see it can you? I used Anders as an example because of what he did and why he did it. Anders was a grown man who knew what he was doing wasn't going to end well, but he did it anyway just to prove a point for Mages. He knew he wasn't saving any lives or making Mages lives any easier by blowing up the Chantry, but he did it anyway, which took innocent lives. What he did was all him, Vengeance had nothing to do with Anders being in idiot. Now compare that with something who has the mind of a child who legitimately thought killing people who were suffering was the right thing to do. And like a child, you actually learn from your mistakes. That's why there's difference with this character. Sorry that I'm not so simple-minded to classify him as "your average everyday Demon."

[TheKomandorShepard]

You really can't see it can you? I used Anders as an example because of what he did and why he did it. Anders was a grown man who knew what he was doing wasn't going to end well, but he did it anyway just to prove a point for Mages. He knew he wasn't saving any lives or making Mages lives any easier by blowing up the Chantry, but he did it anyway, which took innocent lives. What he did was all him, Vengeance had nothing to do with Anders being in idiot. Now compare that with something who has the mind of a child who legitimately thought killing people who were suffering was the right thing to do. And like a child, you actually learn from your mistakes. That's why there's difference with this character. Sorry that I'm not so simple-minded to classify him as "your average everyday Demon."

There is no such thing like right thing to do... as i said it is called being self-righteous anders saw his actions as justified and right (you don't and you think he did that for kicks and to make life of everyone harder) as some peoples as well you and cole may see this as "right" but others may not. Simple cole is dangerous and unpredictable creature.It is not being simple-minded it is being smart pretty much series shows how ends having such well poor views on spirits and demons . 

[bluebullets]

the book made it extremely clear that he is a demon. He is not "just a spirit".

 

I actually like the hope/despair theory, in relation to justice.. It makes a lot of sense.. I actually really like it. Rhy's could not sense wynne's spirit, nor coles.  That makes me think that whatever it is, it fused with cole like wynee and ander's spirits did

 

"there was a cole, but you left him there, scared and dying, and i reached out to him. stayed with him until it was all over" sounds like despair to me

[Dust]

1. Litany of Adralla only interrupted his INVISIBILITY, not PHYSICAL EXISTENCE, it didn't force him to return to his original form or sent him back to the fade and after it passed its effective time, Cole regained his power and CHOSE to disappear.

 

2. Cole has wide rang of emotions and sensations, he aged, he can dream, he can be reasoned with, he changed his motives and cognitions... these things are definitely beyond the understanding of a conventional Spirit/Demon. According to the Chantry, S/D are merely empirical beings, they can't dream, they can't be tricked by themselves, and they can't create the things that they can't even imagine of. So if chantry is right, the soul of mage Cole might still exist (not just memories, memories only react on past experience, he won’t learn and grow.) If his identity was created from nothing, then he must be a fade being which has a soul and almost as powerful as the maker- definitely not like a conventional spirit.)

 

3. Also remind that he can hear the song of Old Gods, but he doesn't seem to like it. His face looks like tainted, but we know that taint and S/D are fundamentally different. I don't know what kinds of complicated situation we are dealing with here, but one thing I'm sure about is that he exist, he is not a delusion and not like the other spirits, he deserves to be treated like a human being.