201 réponses à ce sujet

[Icy Magebane]

The retcon to what Alistair said is still there, just because the Seekers are different doesn't change that bit of info

If I recall correctly, Alistair said that you didn't need lyrium to learn the Templar talents, it just made Templar talents more effective.  Then David Gaider came out and said that was inaccurate and that you do need to use lyrium in order to access the Templar abilities... unless I'm totally wrong about Gaider's statement, doesn't that mean that the original retcon was overturned?

[Icy Magebane]

this is BioWare my good sir, retcons, retcons for everyone

No kidding... xD  This is why I stopped reading comic books...

[SgtSteel91]

If I recall correctly, Alistair said that you didn't need lyrium to learn the Templar talents, it just made Templar talents more effective.  Then David Gaider came out and said that was inaccurate and that you do need to use lyrium in order to access the Templar abilities... unless I'm totally wrong about Gaider's statement, doesn't that mean that the original retcon was overturned?

 

And in that comic series he was in, he said he took lyrium again to use his Templar powers, right?

[Icy Magebane]

 

And in that comic series he was in, he said he took lyrium again to use his Templar powers, right?

 

Maybe... I'm afraid I never read it, but that sounds like what I heard some time ago... eh... don't take my word for it though.  Like I said, I didn't read the DA comics...

[AresKeith]

 

And in that comic series he was in, he said he took lyrium again to use his Templar powers, right?

 

 

Yes he did

[Bayonet Hipshot]

We can withhold judgement, sure. 

 

But even then, the fact that there is a way to use templar talents without the need for the lyrium addiction, no matter how it is sliced, makes the Chantry who runs the Lyrium, trade, and its leader is the one the Seekers who are not addicted to lyrium report to, has been doing this for centuries......

 

I can't think of a single way for this to look good. 

 

I can keep from making a bunch of "BURN THEM" comments, but my opinion of the Chantry, which was already relatively low, has dropped. 

 

Me either.

 

It seems to me the Seekers perhaps took a leaf out of the Spirit Warrior (http://dragonage.wik.../Spirit_Warrior ) and use their anti-magic skills this way whereas the Templar uses lyrium to do it and then get addicted.

 

My opinion of the Chantry, which was low all along, has now gone into negative. There is no way any Chantry or Seeker member can spin this without making them look bad. 

[dragonflight288]

But there is no reason to suspect that the faith itself will be sundered

 

I, at least, have never claimed otherwise. 

[raging_monkey]

Me either.
 
It seems to me the Seekers perhaps took a leaf out of the Spirit Warrior (http://dragonage.wik.../Spirit_Warrior ) and use their anti-magic skills this way whereas the Templar uses lyrium to do it and then get addicted.
 
My opinion of the Chantry, which was low all along, has now gone into negative. There is no way any Chantry or Seeker member can spin this without making them look bad.

religion should respected... but not any who mistreat their followers like this

[azarhal]

 

Maybe the Seeker alternative is a lot more dangerous or difficult to accomplish. After all they only recruit the best of even the Templars to join their ranks, similar to how the Wardens look for the best since they are the most likely to survive the Joining.

The use of Lyrium could basically be a way to mass produce the results and not have a lot of the potential recruits get injured or killed. 

 

 

This^.

 

Also, it's quite possible that Seekers that come from the Templar Order remains addicted to Lyrium. The specialization text only talks about Cassandra not running risk of Lyrium addition, but she was never a Templar.

[dragonflight288]

This^.

 

Also, it's quite possible that Seekers that come from the Templar Order remains addicted to Lyrium. The specialization text only talks about Cassandra not running risk of Lyrium addition, but she was never a Templar.

 

And thus was able to learn templar talents without ever getting addicted. Which shows us that there is no need for templars to learn the same talents with the addiction. 

[Steelcan]

And thus was able to learn templar talents without ever getting addicted. Which shows us that there is no need for templars to learn the same talents with the addiction. 

but we don't know the context behind it

 

for all we know she could do it from birth because reasons

[dragonflight288]

but we don't know the context behind it

 

for all we know she could do it from birth because reasons

 

 

.....

 

Right. 

[Master Warder Z_]

but we don't know the context behind it

for all we know she could do it from birth because reasons

Or it occurred in circumstances that can never be duplicated.

Like being Mary sued out of the taint.

[lil yonce]

If true, my mage is going to have a field day with this. Josephine, get the PR campaign ready. "The Chantry's unnecessarily drug addicted stooges succumb to mind altering, body deforming hardcore substances in midst of continent wide murdering spree." Think the templar order is done and hopefully the Chantry has no political capital left to weasel out of this reputation sinker.

[Br3admax]

That reasoning in that paragraph makes me cringe more than Varric being Gimli. 

[dragonflight288]

Or it occurred in circumstances that can never be duplicated.

Like being Mary sued out of the taint.

 

And yet the very description says that because Cassandra is a Seeker, she can use templar talents without the addiction.....

[Steelcan]

*snip*

 

.....

 

Right. 

I don't see an explanation there though, its just taught them and forced lyrium.  For all we know its how others can learn skills.

 

 

Think Red Sand in the ME universe, it gives users temporary biotic ability

[dragonflight288]

I don't see an explanation there though, its just taught them and forced lyrium.  For all we know its how others can learn skills.

 

 

Think Red Sand in the ME universe, it gives users temporary biotic ability

 

She's a Seeker, she can use templar talents without lyrium addiction. 

 

She was never a templar. 

 

Ergo....templars need not be addicted to lyrium. 

[Br3admax]

She's a Seeker, she can use templar talents without lyrium addiction. 

 

She was never a templar. 

 

Ergo....templars need not be addicted to lyrium. 

Except most Seekers were Templars. There's tons of room for Sueness to creep in. 

[Icy Magebane]

Or it occurred in circumstances that can never be duplicated.

Like being Mary sued out of the taint.

I have my doubts about that... I'm sure she will also share this knowledge with Cullen so that it's never an issue for him (if she hasn't already... I'm not sure of when they meet one another), but we'll see.

 

I'm sure the Inquisitor will also have access to this secret knowledge... basically, the chances of this being unique to Cass are slim.

 

edit:  Actually, that part about Cullen would be dependent on whether it's a cure for addiction or whether this is part of the initial training... if it's the latter, then I guess this wouldn't help him.  I just figured they would come up with some way to dodge the issue in Cullen's case, but maybe this wouldn't work...

[Steelcan]

She's a Seeker, she can use templar talents without lyrium addiction. 

 

She was never a templar. 

 

Ergo....templars need not be addicted to lyrium. 

We don't know why Seekers can use templar abilities w2ithout lyrium addiction, do they use lyrium at all?  Is it necessary for less skilled individuals, ie templars to use it in order to use the same abilities

[dragonflight288]

Except most Seekers were Templars. There's tons of room for Sueness to creep in. 

 

Then a bunch of Seekers could have avoided the whole hassle in the first place. 

[Master Warder Z_]

She's a Seeker, she can use templar talents without lyrium addiction.

She was never a templar.

Ergo....templars need not be addicted to lyrium.

Flimsy logic without much backing it.

For all we know she had a bit of lyrium implanted in her skull or something equally extreme to be "addiction free"

[dragonflight288]

We don't know why Seekers can use templar abilities w2ithout lyrium addiction, do they use lyrium at all?  Is it necessary for less skilled individuals, ie templars to use it in order to use the same abilities

 

They are not addicted, and thereby don't need to rely on the Chantry, nor do they suffer the withdrawal symptoms. 

 

No defense can remove this inescapable fact with this little tidbit of lore. 

[dragonflight288]

Flimsy logic without much backing it.

For all we know she had a bit of lyrium implanted in her skull or something equally extreme to be "addiction free"

 

Right....

 

so in order to support your argument, you have to retcon the entire nature of the danger of lyrium and why only dwarves or Tranquil can use it safely in order to justify it?