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[A Clever Name]

I'm going to wait and see what the game has to say about all of this before I decide how I interpret the info.  Right now I believe it's possible that there could be a logical explanation - or as logical as you can make a retcon like this....  Maybe it's exceedingly difficult and therefore rare to learn Templar abilities without consuming lyrium?  As it's not conducive to numbers that the Chantry would need for what is essentially a holy police force, the lyrium route could have been a quick and effective solution to the dilemma, whereas the Seekers might function as a cabbalistic sect within the Templar Order that are trained in the more traditional methods of developing their skills.

[10K]

She's a Seeker, she can use templar talents without lyrium addiction. 

 

She was never a templar. 

 

Ergo....templars need not be addicted to lyrium. 

A lot of people has said this was retconned, so do templars need lyrium or not?

[Steelcan]

They are not addicted, and thereby don't need to rely on the Chantry, nor do they suffer the withdrawal symptoms. 

 

No defense can remove this inescapable fact with this little tidbit of lore. 

Yes, Seekers don't
 

 

But we don't know that templars can also do it without lyrium addiction, if it turns out that there is absolutely nothing stopping anyone from learning the abilities I will grab a pitchfork

[dragonflight288]

A lot of people has said this was retconned, so do templars need lyrium or not?

 

Her class description says that as a Seeker, she is not addicted to lyrium and has full access to all lyrium abilities. 

 

Whether they need lyrium or not, they don't need the addiction. 

[ParagonStovus]

 If Seekers can use Templar abilities without lyrium, then I bet that the Inquisitor will be taught the Templar spec by a Seeker. That way, they don't have to worry about the PC's lyrium use/addiction. I kind of want to see Cullen/other Inquisition Templars' reaction to that.

[Master Warder Z_]

Right....

so in order to support your argument, you have to retcon the entire nature of the danger of lyrium and why only dwarves or Tranquil can use it safely in order to justify it?

It was just an example.

But it seemed as plausible as any given that magical resistance can be bestowed by lyrium why not apply it to the magical effect of lyrium addiction.

It provides a continuous usage of lyrium and prevents addiction.

It just requires thedosian brain surgery.

[10K]

Her class description says that as a Seeker, she is not addicted to lyrium and has full access to all lyrium abilities. 

 

Whether they need lyrium or not, they don't need the addiction. 

But isn't lyrium in itself addictive?

[Br3admax]

But isn't lyrium in itself addictive?

Yes, that's why we need to know why Seekers aren't addicted to it. There is an unlimited amount of possibilities, and we really need to wait a month or so to find out. 

[AresKeith]

A lot of people has said this was retconned, so do templars need lyrium or not?

 

As far as we know, yes

 

But I guess we have to wait till the game comes out or a devs comment to see if that's still the case

[Icy Magebane]

But isn't lyrium in itself addictive?

Maybe the Seekers have an antidote?  Personally, I think this new info means that it was never a requirement to learn the Templar talents... if not, then the Seekers have an antidote but are withholding it from the Templars.  Both of these sound really bad to me...

[dragonflight288]

But isn't lyrium in itself addictive?

 

As ingested as the templars do, certainly. 

 

It also physically, and lethally morphs mages who get too close to the raw ore, which is why the dwarves are the only ones who can mine it. There is lore supporting that those who use it regularly suffer physical deformations, and those who are addicted to it eventually suffer lyrium withdrawal if they go without, which causes madness, or become lyrium addled, which makes them pretty much senile and barely able to function, or be aware of what's going on around them because of the mental deficiencies it causes over time. 

[10K]

This is why I think BW should just keep their lore consistent. They should have just left it the way Alistair explained it in Origins. Now everything is just so confusing.

[dragonflight288]

It was just an example.

But it seemed as plausible as any given that magical resistance can be bestowed by lyrium why not apply it to the magical effect of lyrium addiction.

It provides a continuous usage of lyrium and prevents addiction.

It just requires thedosian brain surgery.

 

Considering Tome of the Mortal Vessel says that many ban anatomy because it's considered blood magic.....

 

I get that you're trying to come up with a plausible scenario, but that particular theory is simply full of holes. 

[Steelcan]

This is why I think BW should just keep their lore consistent. They should have just left it the way Alistair explained it in Origins. Now everything is just so confusing.

they seem utterly incapable of it

[dragonflight288]

Yes, that's why we need to know why Seekers aren't addicted to it. There is an unlimited amount of possibilities, and we really need to wait a month or so to find out. 

 

And with each of these unlimited possibilities, are an equal number excuses for why Seekers who were never templars could learn templar talents without becoming addicted to lyrium, while templars have to become addicted. 

 

Until the process is explained, no amount of guessing or speculating takes away the simple fact that you do not need to be addicted to lyrium in order to use templar talents. 

[Steelcan]

Until the process is explained, no amount of guessing or speculating takes away the simple fact that you do not need to be addicted to lyrium in order to use templar talents. 

For all we know right now that reason could be limited to a very small number of people, the rest need lyrium to accomplish it

[AresKeith]

This is why I think BW should just keep their lore consistent. They should have just left it the way Alistair explained it in Origins. Now everything is just so confusing.

Not really, as it stands Templars still need Lyrium in order to use their abilities.

We don't know whether or not the Seekers are the same, only that they don't have to worry about Lyrium addiction

[AresKeith]

For all we know right now that reason could be limited to a very small number of people, the rest need lyrium to accomplish it

I wouldn't be surprised if the non-Templar Seekers and possibly Lambert can avoid the addiction by some method

[Master Warder Z_]

Considering Tome of the Mortal Vessel says that many ban anatomy because it's considered blood magic.....

I get that you're trying to come up with a plausible scenario, but that particular theory is simply full of holes.

Really?

Where do you think such research would be done if not the Chantry?

I mean the Litany of adralla likely involved extensive studies of blood magic but it was produced by the Chantry.

So the Seekers being hacked up to be made super soldiers by the Chantry wouldn't be surprising. Power comes with price and I'd imagine being free of lyrium addiction is a ****

[TheJediSaint]

I suspect there will be abilities used by used by NPC Templars that can't used by Player Character Templars because the PC doesn't use Lyrium.

[dragonflight288]

For all we know right now that reason could be limited to a very small number of people, the rest need lyrium to accomplish it

 

Cassandra's own Class Description says that as a Seeker, she has full access to templar talents without the lyrium addiction.

 

Sure, plenty of Seekers may be addicted to lyrium, but that is ultimately, as has been established, that many Seekers are former Templars. 

 

There is no room for interpretation here. Cassandra can use templar talents without needing to constantly take lyrium because she's a Seeker, and one who was never a templar. 

 

I can get that MAYBE, the process to be able to do that is complicated and expensive, so it can be used in a limited fashion, but as it stands, nothing supports this. Only speculation.

 

Because Bioware has retconned this from Origins, to DA2 and the comics, and back again in Inquisition, this is causing a great deal of confusion, but as it stands as of now, the lore says that you don't need to be addicted to lyrium to use templar talents. Without more details it is impossible to say, but as it stands, I can say with full certainty that you don't need to be addicted to lyrium to learn templar talents, and the Seekers know the secret behind it, and have for centuries, based on the lore we have, and that tells me plenty. 

 

Really?

Where do you think such research would be done if not the Chantry?

I mean the Litany of adralla likely involved extensive studies of blood magic but it was produced by the Chantry.

So the Seekers being hacked up to be made super soldiers by the Chantry wouldn't be surprising. Power comes with price and I'd imagine being free of lyrium addiction is a ****

 

The Litany was also published by a Tevinter Magister. 

[Steelcan]

Cassandra's own Class Description says that as a Seeker, she has full access to templar talents without the lyrium addiction.

 

Sure, plenty of Seekers may be addicted to lyrium, but that is ultimately, as has been established, that many Seekers are former Templars. 

 

There is no room for interpretation here. Cassandra can use templar talents without needing to constantly take lyrium because she's a Seeker, and one who was never a templar. 

 

I can get that MAYBE, the process to be able to do that is complicated and expensive, so it can be used in a limited fashion, but as it stands, nothing supports this. Only speculation.

 

Because Bioware has retconned this from Origins, to DA2 and the comics, and back again in Inquisition, this is causing a great deal of confusion, but as it stands as of now, the lore says that you don't need to be addicted to lyrium to use templar talents. Without more details it is impossible to say, but as it stands, I can say with full certainty that you don't need to be addicted to lyrium to learn templar talents, and the Seekers know the secret behind it, and have for centuries, based on the lore we have, and that tells me plenty. 

the lore says Seekers don't have to be addicted, and for all we know it may be due to an intrinsic value of being a Seeker

[SgtSteel91]

Whatever, the Templar spec is now tied with Champion as the specialization I want to take.

[dragonflight288]

the lore says Seekers don't have to be addicted, and for all we know it may be due to an intrinsic value of being a Seeker

 

Which regular people, non-mages and non-templars, join, and can learn all the abilities without the need for the lyrium addiction. 

 

It may be possible that being a Seeker may be like being a Warden and the taint and being the only ones who can kill an archdemon because of what they are, but that is still nothing more than speculation. 

[Steelcan]

 

It may be possible that being a Seeker may be like being a Warden and the taint and being the only ones who can kill an archdemon because of what they are, but that is still nothing more than speculation. 

agreed, which is why I'm not calling this one one way or the other just yet

 

if its the chantry taking a short cut or being lolevil, I'll break out the torches and pitchforks