201 réponses à ce sujet

[10K]

Not really, as it stands Templars still need Lyrium in order to use their abilities.

We don't know whether or not the Seekers are the same, only that they don't have to worry about Lyrium addiction

The lore is still not consistent it has changed twice since Origins. First: saying one can use templar talents without lyrium, but lyrium makes templar talents more effective and is very addictive. Then: one only can use templar talents with the use of lyrium and is very addictive. Now: one can use templar talents without the addictions of lyrium.

 

Edit: Weather or not lyrium needs to be used to use templar talents is now a unknown. 

[dragonflight288]

agreed, which is why I'm not calling this one one way or the other just yet

 

if its the chantry taking a short cut or being lolevil, I'll break out the torches and pitchforks

 

Fair enough. 

 

I suppose when I saw it, I lashed out a little based on a preexisting prejudice that came from origins that I later accepted in the retcon in the comics, despite being frustrated with it since I don't care for renovating existing lore, only to see today that the retcon has been retconned, and the old prejudice came out. 

 

But it still remains that we see that there is a way for people to learn templar talents without getting addicted to lyrium. 

 

I'm not saying "Burn the Chantry with its precious Chant!" or anything like that, nor am I saying every priest and Grand Cleric knows the secret, but I am saying that since this has apparently been going on for centuries, my respect for the Chantry's leadership, and the Seekers, have dropped since templars don't really need to be addicted to lyrium based on what we know, as of now. 

[Master Warder Z_]

We don't know that they don't need to be addicted either.

Poor wording but there it is.

We have no idea why there is lyrium additiction immunity.

[Icy Magebane]

We don't know that they don't need to be addicted either.

Poor wording but there it is.

We have no idea why there is lyrium additiction immunity.

Well, one way or the other, we'll find out in November.  I don't see this ending well for the Chantry, however... this is a pretty big blemish on their already spotty reputation.  It would take more complex loopholes than I can come up with to explain this in a way that doesn't make them appear to be incredibly corrupt and immoral (they meaning the leadership of the Chantry and all Seekers... I doubt the various Grand Clerics, brother, sisters, and mothers know anything about it...).

[dragonflight288]

We don't know that they don't need to be addicted either.

Poor wording but there it is.

We have no idea why there is lyrium additiction immunity.

 

It says specifically that the Seekers taught templars the talents, and because Cassandra is a Seeker, she can use the talents and isn't addicted to lyrium. 

 

It doesn't give details, but it does state that Seekers don't need the lyrium addiction to use templar talents.

 

We'll likely learn the details in Inquisition, but Seekers, whether or not they need lyrium, are not addicted to it. But I can see literally no way how the Chantry's leaders and pretty much all the Seekers throughout the centuries can get away with this with their hands clean. 

[10K]

It would be awful if they didn't address this, I'd lose mind.

[Steelcan]

It would be awful if they didn't address this, I'd lose mind.

handwaves are inbound

[dragonflight288]

handwaves are inbound

 

I'm expecting them. 

 

I would like this comment, but I'm out of likes. 

[Br3admax]

Well, one way or the other, we'll find out in November.  I don't see this ending well for the Chantry, however... this is a pretty big blemish on their already spotty reputation.  

9.99999/10, I'd bet this will not even matter in the next game and the Chantry will be fine regardless of this fact. 

[Hanako Ikezawa]

Well, one way or the other, we'll find out in November.  I don't see this ending well for the Chantry, however... this is a pretty big blemish on their already spotty reputation.  It would take more complex loopholes than I can come up with to explain this in a way that doesn't make them appear to be incredibly corrupt and immoral (they meaning the leadership of the Chantry and all Seekers... I doubt the various Grand Clerics, brother, sisters, and mothers know anything about it...).

I think that's a little unfair. The top brass of Seekers like Lambert sure, but the regular Seekers like Cassandra would have  most likely been ordered to keep quiet about it. Thus they are just following orders, so really shouldn't be blamed for it. It's like how not all the Templars at Kirkwall should be blamed for the annulment of the Kirkwall Circle. They were just following Meredith's orders.

[dragonflight288]

I think that's a little unfair. The top brass of Seekers like Lambert sure, but the regular Seekers like Cassandra would have  most likely been ordered to keep quiet about it. Thus they are just following orders, so really shouldn't be blamed for it. It's like how not all the Templars at Kirkwall should be blamed for the annulment of the Kirkwall Circle. They were just following Meredith's orders.

 

....

 

I'm only commenting on this comment because I would like to point out that this can open a VERY BIG can of worms, and anyone who reads this comment, let's try and steer clear of Kirkwall's annulment for the sake of my sanity. 

[10K]

9.99999/10, I'd bet this will not even matter in the next game and the Chantry will be fine regardless of this fact. 

I wouldn't be surprised.

[dragonflight288]

I wouldn't be surprised.

 

Or at least the Chantry has a set place that will not be destroyed despite player intentions, like losing all its teeth militarily in the world, but retaining a lot of influence post-game. 

[Urazz]

I'm noting that the blurb says that it means that you don't have to take too much lyrium to be able to use templar abilities and thus not get addicted.  I'm also assuming that using more lyrium makes templar abilities more effective to a point but it becomes addictive then.

 

I'm thinking since the Chantry wants to maintain the highest effectiveness of their templar's anti-magic abilities so they give them the highest dose every time so the templars become addicted because they are constantly at that high dose.  Since the Seeker's are the best warriors of the templar order and mostly are just watching the templars, i'm thinking that they also tend to compensate for weaker templar abilities with better fighting skills when they do fight mages.

[raging_monkey]

Bioware is messing up.... alot recently i mean what else are they gonna retcon? Tevinter is actually decent!, dwarves can do magic to x extent?.... its like they cant get their lore book together

[10K]

Bioware is messing up.... alot recently i mean what else are they gonna retcon? Tevinter is actually decent!, dwarves can do magic to x extent?.... its like they cant get their lore book together

Well about the dwarf thing, I think sandal can do magic, if that counts.

[Icy Magebane]

I think that's a little unfair. The top brass of Seekers like Lambert sure, but the regular Seekers like Cassandra would have  most likely been ordered to keep quiet about it. Thus they are just following orders, so really shouldn't be blamed for it. It's like how not all the Templars at Kirkwall should be blamed for the annulment of the Kirkwall Circle. They were just following Meredith's orders.

I'll have to think it over.

[Steelcan]

Bioware is messing up.... alot recently i mean what else are they gonna retcon? Tevinter is actually decent!, dwarves can do magic to x extent?.... its like they cant get their lore book together

they can't, internal lore consistency is nonexistent

[ParagonStovus]

  In Asunder, there was a passage where Cole sensed a frightening power in Lord Seeker Lambert that was different from every Templar he'd ever met. It's possible that the Seekers have some alternate, sinister source of anti-magical powers that is either too dangerous or too morally dubious for every Templar to use, thus the reliance on lyrium.

 

    Admittedly, it would have to be pretty evil to justify using a toxic, mind-altering drug as the best alternative.

[raging_monkey]

Well about the dwarf thing, I think sandal can do magic, if that counts.

sandal is an enigma a fluke of nature but i was reffering to all dwarves not my little buddy ENCHANTMENT!!

they can't, internal lore consistency is nonexistent

at this point i believe that

[dragonflight288]

  In Asunder, there was a passage where Cole sensed a frightening power in Lord Seeker Lambert that was different from every Templar he'd ever met. It's possible that the Seekers have some alternate, sinister source of anti-magical powers that is either too dangerous or too morally dubious for every Templar to use, thus the reliance on lyrium.

 

    Admittedly, it would have to be pretty evil to justify using a toxic, mind-altering drug as the best alternative.

 

If such is the case, that would make it very hard to justify even liking Cassandra, when she has been built up by the developers in her character description as someone who is willing to break tradition to do the right thing and force the world kicking and screaming back into order. 

[Icy Magebane]

9.99999/10, I'd bet this will not even matter in the next game and the Chantry will be fine regardless of this fact. 

Be that as it may, it will still be satisfying to refuse to help them, even if that won't have any long-term effects.

[Bayonet Hipshot]

If such is the case, that would make it very hard to justify even liking Cassandra, when she has been built up by the developers in her character description as someone who is willing to break tradition to do the right thing and force the world kicking and screaming back into order. 

 

I am already not very fond of Pentaghast but this whole Seeker thing might seal the deal for me on not liking her full stop. She certainly will have to answer for the Seekers' abilities. 

[raging_monkey]

If such is the case, that would make it very hard to justify even liking Cassandra, when she has been built up by the developers in her character description as someone who is willing to break tradition to do the right thing and force the world kicking and screaming back into order.

hard to justify anything the white chantry does right now... so glad i converted to the black chantry(dont wholley agree with tevinter but they are honest about it at least

[BellPeppers&Beef023]

I'm just gonna ignore that original retcon. F that noise. So much BS. In other words, lyrium is not needed for Templar abilities, just as Alistair said. It does make some sense that an organisation as large as the chantry would have no issues resorting to lyrium addiction as a form of control for its (very large and important) military branch.