3034 réponses à ce sujet

[Bayonet Hipshot]

Do you have any objective evidence for this?

 

I have deductive reasoning. 

 

Attribute restriction in this way makes no sense for an SP game. In an SP game you either have attributes that you allow the player some form of control over or you do not.

 

Only in MMOs we have attributes that cannot be controlled or altered by players in any way and instead are dependent on gear and crafting. This is how MMO's work.

 

Putting two and two together....

 

So let's see..what part of DA:I is MMO in nature....Why, its DAMP of course !

[Rawgrim]

A game with choices is an RPG. 

I never played Gears of War, but if a similar had dialogue and scenario choices it's an RPG, as you are roleplaying a character. Stats are irrelevant.

 

In an rpg your roleplay YOUR character. It think you are confusing the rpg genre with "roleplaying". Its about much more than dialogue options. That would mean Monkey Island is an rpg, wich it isn't. Stats are vry important because the let you decide if your character is strong, a ******, clever, wise, charismatic.

[CrimsonHead]

The second part. You pick a mage and your points will be set for you. To have any real increment, passives or armor apparently. 

 

I  think they are doing this because of multiplayer because this streamlining makes no sense unless if you look at it from DAMP point of view. Having attributes there would make a character grossly underpowered or overpowered and so they decided to have it MMO style...

 

Here I thought MP would not be affecting SP in any way. 

 

Here come the conspiracy theories.

[PhroXenGold]

You cannot have proper unconventional builds because you cannot allocate attributes anymore. Its not about difficulty, its the fact that you just cannot. You are railroaded into strict roles due to this. 

 

Yes you can have unconventional builds. You just shape them with your equipment rather than clicking the plus button next to cunning when your warrior levels up.

[Gtdef]

With that much charisma he wont have to kill much, if you do it right.

 

Did you just ask me to make an optimized build? I want a combat heavy character that instead of an automatic rifle uses his smile. Isn't that a roleplaying game? Why should I be limited? Back in 1759 you could make a charisma build that oneshots the bosses with smiles.

 

#sarcasm

[10K]

Ultimately I just don't want to sacrifice the appearance of my character just to acquire attributes I want. Or sacrifice any cool perks an armor might give me as well. Destiny does this poorly. The only way you can achieve a higher lvl after 20 is to find gear with light attributes. So if you like the style of a sweet looking helmet you have that give you a faster reloading time with your handcannon. Too bad because the only way to increase your lvl is to replace it with this hideous helmet that contains light and no useful perks for the way you're playing. It's an awful design.  

[cjones91]

If by 'fun and refreshing' you mean tedious, mean-spirited, boring and pointless, then yes. Self-imposed challenges do add all that.

To you maybe,me and a large number of people out there disagree and find self imposed challenges add new ways to play a game we've beaten dozens of times over.

 

Then again a good number of gamers this generation can't even do things like get past the first level of Super Mario Bros,so I can see why they would hate self imposed challenges.

[falconlord5]

I have deductive reasoning. 

 

Attribute restriction in this way makes no sense for an SP game. In an SP game you either have attributes that you allow the player some form of control over or you do not.

 

Only in MMOs we have attributes that cannot be controlled or altered by players in any way and instead are dependent on gear and crafting. This is how MMO's work.

 

Putting two and two together....

 

So let's see..what part of DA:I is MMO in nature....Why, its DAMP of course !

 

So that'd be no, then.

[Rawgrim]

PLEASE tell me people here realize what is OBVIOUS and what Mike Laidlaw has said TWICE.

 

You do NOT distribute 3 stat points into 6 pools each time you level up.

 

INSTEAD you get your stat points by customizing and crafting gear.  You put your stat points INTO YOUR GEAR, using your crafting supplies and things you have unlocked.  Then you EQUIP the GEAR and get STAT POINT INCREASES.

 

You put STAT POINTS through CUSTOMIZATION and CRAFTING into GEAR which you EQUIP.  THE END RESULT IS THE SAME, YOU JUST HAVE MORE CHOICES NOW.  AND YOU CAN RECRAFT GEAR AT WILL.

 

STOP freaking out people, and READ.  USE YOUR BRAIN. 

 

Customizing your armour is not the same as leveling up your character. Wearing an item is not character development. Its enhancing a piece of clothing.

[Gtdef]

taking those choices away from being part of the character to being part of the gear does.

 

No it doesn't. Just doesn't agree with your perfect game (and mine as well, but I have a different problem with that).

[cjones91]

If that's all the difficulty levels do, then the game is very poorly designed indeed.

Just like 99% of games ever made?

[Lebanese Dude]

In an rpg your roleplay YOUR character. It think you are confusing the rpg genre with "roleplaying". Its about much more than dialogue options. That would mean Monkey Island is an rpg, wich it isn't. Stats are vry important because the let you decide if your character is strong, a ******, clever, wise, charismatic.

As opposed to you deciding that your character is strong, clever, wise, and charismatic and picking the available options to effectively roleplay your character?

I fail to see how that is not roleplaying. You assume the role and you play the role. The game provides the medium to roleplay. Some games require stats to manage the medium. DAI uses a different system. Both roleplaying.

[Jimbo_Gee79]

PLEASE tell me people here realize what is OBVIOUS and what Mike Laidlaw has said TWICE.

 

You do NOT distribute 3 stat points into 6 pools each time you level up.

 

INSTEAD you get your stat points by customizing and crafting gear.  You put your stat points INTO YOUR GEAR, using your crafting supplies and things you have unlocked.  Then you EQUIP the GEAR and get STAT POINT INCREASES.

 

You put STAT POINTS through CUSTOMIZATION and CRAFTING into GEAR which you EQUIP.  THE END RESULT IS THE SAME, YOU JUST HAVE MORE CHOICES NOW.  AND YOU CAN RECRAFT GEAR AT WILL.

 

STOP freaking out people, and READ.  USE YOUR BRAIN. 

Wow could that have beebn stated less rudely?  Just so you are aware not all of us spend every waking minute on these forums reading every single post and scouring the internet for every scrap of info.

[Araceil]

I'm really not happy with this choice at all, assigning attributes and diversity in builds that it allowed was on of my favorite parts of Origins. Oh well given how badly they handled attributes in DA:2 this might be for the best. 

[Rawgrim]

Yes you can have unconventional builds. You just shape them with your equipment rather than clicking the plus button next to cunning when your warrior levels up.

 

That is not a build, that is wearing different clothes.

[falconlord5]

To you maybe,me and a large number of people out there disagree and find self imposed challenges add new ways to play a game we've beaten dozens of times over.

 

Then again a good number of gamers this generation can't even do things like get past the first level of Super Mario Bros,so I can see why they would hate self imposed challenges.

 

A good number of gamers of any generation couldn't get past the first level of Super Mario Bros. Cut the elitist crap honey, I've grown up with every video game system since the NES and I know exactly how hard those games were.

 

Self-imposed challenges are for people who can't stand the game they're playing and haven't the brains to go try something else out.

[Muspade]

That is not a build, that is wearing different clothes.

You don't use different clothing for different builds?

Or do all "Roleplaying" people run around with naked with their weapon of choice?

[Bayonet Hipshot]

Here come the conspiracy theories.

 

Its not conspiracy. This form of leveling is common in MMOs and dungeon crawlers such as Diablo.

 

DAMP borrows many elements from Diablo and it is multiplayer. Its not a far stretch to see that this levelling system works for MP and they just decided to drag it to SP and be done with it. 

[Vilegrim]

Great, my first argument on the notorious BSN.

 

Why do you hate it, exactly?  You know all stats can equip all sorts of gear now, which actually allows you more choice.  Mage in plate mail?  Go for it, and you can craft it to have magic and int bonuses too.  You are allowed more meaningful choices now, instead of "every time i level up, I distribute my 2 points into strength and one point into constitution for my tank" which is what I did for the entirety of DA:O and DA2.  

 

Did you do something different?  I'd love to hear it.

 

Sorry, I forgot I actually respecced my tank in the end, giving him the required strength for his gear, and then the required dex for all the shield talents, and then the rest in constitution.  I had no choice here.  The game did it for me with stat requirements.

 

DA:I's system seems to allow CHOICE for attributes through gear customization and talents.

 

 

Yea I did, Dex/will/con DW tank warrior was very effective, not quite as tough, but with the aggro stances, aoe and cc and with a properly built healer morrigan/wynne team the better DPS and hence higher threat was very viable and held aggro better while being alot more fun.  Or my con/magic Blood Mage/Arcane warrior uber tank, or the magic/will Arcane/Spirit healer paladin expy, or the cunning/will lethality archer. All fun, all abilities coming from the character and being innate parts of him/her rather than part of gear, take the dw tanks armor and weapons away, given him a shirt and two daggers and he would STILL murderface you.

[Thumb Fu]

As much as i want to argue that attribute points are really awesome and cool to spend and allocate as you see fit when levelling up... they really aren't cool or important.

 

Thinking about it i always spend the points in what is required for that class to be good. So if it is a tanking class i will put points in constitution, pysical damage warrior i will put more points in Str.

 

What i can see from the talent tree is that if you go into the tanking talents they also automatically give you a constitution bonus so the more you go into that tree the more Constitution you will have. Also makes respecing easy and fast. I like that.

 

I do agree though that this being removed does take away from the people who want to make... lets say "interesting" builds, like a warrior with tons of wisdom or something. Is that a bad thing, for some people sure, for me though it doesn't make a lick of difference.

 

End of the day you can still make a tanking warrior with lots of constitution, because thats how the classes and specs are supposed to work.

 

Thanks.

[PhroXenGold]

That is not a build, that is wearing different clothes.

 

What? Of course it is a build. Your gear forms part of your build. That's just a basic RPG staple. You shape your character's build through a mix of their own capabilities and their equipment. And DA:I will allow this. It juts moves one of the aspects of the build which is often applied directly to the character to the equipment instead.

[falconlord5]

Just like 99% of games ever made?

 

If you're comfortable with that, then go ahead. I'm sure those self-imposed challenges of yours make up for having to put up with a weaker game.

 

Me, I'm going to stick with the games were the difficulty levels mean something, and were the game isn't designed by incompetents.

 

I wonder which of us will have the more fun.

[Lebanese Dude]

You don't use different clothing for different builds?

Or do all "Roleplaying" people run around with naked with their weapon of choice?

That image in my head though.

[Rawgrim]

As opposed to you deciding that your character is strong, clever, wise, and charismatic and picking the available options to effectively roleplay your character?

I fail to see how that is not roleplaying. You assume the role and you play the role. The game provides the medium to roleplay. Some games require stats to manage the medium. DAI uses a different system. Both roleplaying.

You dn't pick those options. The game does it for you.

 

You assume the role of the character you create and have control over in a roleplaying game. Not just pick conversation options that a premade character would say.

 

Your outfts leveling you up is not roleplaying. It has zero to do with the character, mental or physical, its a cosmetic choice.

[cjones91]

A good number of gamers of any generation couldn't get past the first level of Super Mario Bros. Cut the elitist crap honey, I've grown up with every video game system since the NES and I know exactly how hard those games were.

 

Self-imposed challenges are for people who can't stand the game they're playing and haven't the brains to go try something else out.

It's not elitism,it's pure fact.I've been gaming for 18 years and this generation of gaming is ****** easy,almost every game holds the player's hand and treats them like a bunch of idiots who can't do anything for themselves.

 

That's just a sad reality of gaming today and I disagree wholeheartedly with the last line.