3034 réponses à ce sujet

[Jazzpha]

The thing that bums me out about this shift is that it takes away a substantial chunk of direct player agency. Instead of being able to shape our characters through attribute points on level up, we need to craft items with those attribute bonuses. Which would be a negligible difference, were it not for the fact that the hurdle of crafting puts you at the mercy of game-dictated crafting material drops.

 

Basically, rather than knowing how many more levels I had between me and an awesome spell acquisition, which was a great facet of DAO, now I'll have to shape my gameplay experience much more around hunting down the immediately crucial crafting materials I need. At least, that's the vibe I'm getting from this. Which is... unfortunate. Not game-breaking, just flummoxing.

 

Of course, if I'm horribly misconstruing something here, I'd be more than happy to be proven wrong.

[Zjarcal]

Hmm...

 

Well I can't say I ever saw that coming.

 

Not sure if I think it's a good change, there was nothing wrong with the way this worked before. Then again, having just replayed VTMB, I know you don't even need the traditional level up system to have an engaging character building system.

 

I'll reserve judgement till actually playing.

[Morroian]

My hype for this game is plummeting lower and lower with each reveal.

 

My favourite class has been nerfed hard along with my favourite build (entropy and creation). We can't switch weapons in combat and now we can't even select our own attribute points.

 

What's next?

 

This just feels like DA2 all over again.

 

In a period when traditional isometric type rpgs are becoming more popular why is the DA series seemingly turning further away from the rpg aspects of those games? 

[DragonAgeLegend]

Seriously, the more I find out about the game the less I'm looking forward to playing.   

[Ryzaki]

No, you just had to put points into your main skills to be able to use high level gear.

 

Which was simple enough really.

LMAO. Now every Inquisitor is Tony Stark and if you want to take on the Elder One you need to make the Hulk Buster if not, Your Journey Ends Here...

 

#dead

 

and if one thing BioWare has shown, its trying new things always pans out

 

[In Exile]

In a period when traditional isometric type rpgs are becoming more popular why is the DA series seemingly turning further away from the rpg aspects of those games? 

 

Because they can't fund development selling something like 40-100k worth of copies like Pillars of Eternity. 

[andar91]

Second, I'm actually okay not being able to increase attributes on level up. Attribute increases on level up always seemed like a tacky mechanic to me, as I was never sure what the numbers were supposed to mean. My Cunning starts at around 15-16, but deep into the game it's around 45; did I literally become three times more savvy during the course of the game? If not, are there diminishing returns on increasing attributes as your stats get higher and higher? In either case, I have no idea what these numbers are supposed to represent either mechanically or in-game.

 

This is an excellent point. Because we boosted stats so often, they seemed to...lose their meaning.

 

That's one great thing about D&D ability scores. They didn't go up as often, so you knew they counted.

[Steelcan]

In a period when traditional isometric type rpgs are becoming more popular why is the DA series seemingly turning further away from the rpg aspects of those games? 

because other more streamlined rpgs trounced DA2

[Bayonet Hipshot]

The thing that bums me out about this shift is that it takes away a substantial chunk of direct player agency. Instead of being able to shape our characters through attribute points on level up, we need to craft items with those attribute bonuses. Which would be a negligible difference, were it not for the fact that the hurdle of crafting puts you at the mercy of game-dictated crafting material drops.

 

Basically, rather than knowing how many more levels I had between me and an awesome spell acquisition, which was a great facet of DAO, now I'll have to shape my gameplay experience much more around hunting down the immediately crucial crafting materials I need. At least, that's the vibe I'm getting from this. Which is... unfortunate. Not game-breaking, just flummoxing.

 

Of course, if I'm horribly misconstruing something here, I'd be more than happy to be proven wrong.

 

Which is odd and hypocritical because they have said that crafting was optional. 

 

If crafting is optional, they they must give players a way to determine their own stats and the best way to do it is to allow us to allocate points on our own when we level up...

 

But apparently this is not a thing now...somehow...

 

Can we at least level up our health & mana / stamina like we did in Skyrim ? Or is that tied to gear as well  ? 

[Ryzaki]

The thing that bums me out about this shift is that it takes away a substantial chunk of direct player agency. Instead of being able to shape our characters through attribute points on level up, we need to craft items with those attribute bonuses. Which would be a negligible difference, were it not for the fact that the hurdle of crafting puts you at the mercy of game-dictated crafting material drops.

 

Basically, rather than knowing how many more levels I had between me and an awesome spell acquisition, which was a great facet of DAO, now I'll have to shape my gameplay experience much more around hunting down the immediately crucial crafting materials I need. At least, that's the vibe I'm getting from this. Which is... unfortunate. Not game-breaking, just flummoxing.

 

Of course, if I'm horribly misconstruing something here, I'd be more than happy to be proven wrong.

 

Outta likes but yeah. =/

[Morroian]

Seriously, the more I find out about the game the less I'm looking forward to playing.   

 

I said it in the ability thread but more and more I think will probably only play the single player once and just play multi player when I want to play some dragon age.

[In Exile]

Which is odd and hypocritical because they have said that crafting was optional. 

 

If crafting is optional, they they must give players a way to determine their own stats and the best way to do it is to allow us to allocate points on our own when we level up...

 

But apparently this is not a thing now...somehow...

 

Can we at least level up our health & mana / stamina like we did in Skyrim ? Or is that tied to gear as well  ? 

 

It's presumably optional because - like DA:O and DA2 - the game is a joke on the standard difficulty. 

[ElementalFury106]

they are so lucky i already have it fully paid for on preorder and am addicted to the story, cause so far, from everything i heard about combat in this game, its going to suck so much ass, its going to become a chore and not be fun.

 

Literally couldn't have said it better myself. Paid off my preorder last week when buying Shadow of Mordor.

 

Been addicted to bits and reveals of the story for 2+ years...I'm too invested to just drop it. But I swear every reveal I'm hearing lately sounds terrible. I really REALLY hope all of us who have doubts right now will be proven wrong in the end.

[Gruntburner]

Not gonna lie, I always found it odd when you max out a stat like Strength but restrict you from doing something like bashing a door because you lack the requisite skill. Good to see they are at least tied in some way.

[Morroian]

Because they can't fund development selling something like 40-100k worth of copies like Pillars of Eternity. 

 

Divinity was high in the steam charts for quite a while.

[Wissenschaft 2.0]

The thing that bums me out about this shift is that it takes away a substantial chunk of direct player agency. Instead of being able to shape our characters through attribute points on level up, we need to craft items with those attribute bonuses. Which would be a negligible difference, were it not for the fact that the hurdle of crafting puts you at the mercy of game-dictated crafting material drops.

 

Basically, rather than knowing how many more levels I had between me and an awesome spell acquisition, which was a great facet of DAO, now I'll have to shape my gameplay experience much more around hunting down the immediately crucial crafting materials I need. At least, that's the vibe I'm getting from this. Which is... unfortunate. Not game-breaking, just flummoxing.

 

Of course, if I'm horribly misconstruing something here, I'd be more than happy to be proven wrong.

 

I don't think talents are locked by attribute requirements like in Origins. I think its like in DA 2, where talents are locked by level requirement only.

[pdusen]

Ah BSN. Just when I thought you couldn't get upset over anything more trivial, this thread appears.

Bravo, everyone.

[Morroian]

because other more streamlined rpgs trounced DA2

 

But not because they were streamlined.

[aeoncs]

But it's not about "augmenting". It's about the opportunity cost, and augmenting it "properly". Let's pretend the stats work like DA:O. Armour that does +2 MAG and +2 WIS is worse compared to armour that gives +4 MAG for a mage, especially for a damage build. Getting a mage drop like the former and not the later is a problem. 

 

Yes, it's worse, but not by the extent you're making it out to be. I think the gear we'll get from (Mini-)Bosses and special quest rewards will be just as good as anything you can craft at that moment in time. Obviously you'll come out ahead when you really devote yourself to crafting but that's simply a necessary feature if you want people to invest time into crafting gear at all - but that doesn't mean it will be twice as good.

[MasterPrudent]

In Exile, on 09 Oct 2014 - 1:14 PM, said:

Because they can't fund development selling something like 40-100k worth of copies like Pillars of Eternity. 

 

Divinity was high in the steam charts for quite a while.

 

 

 

I don't know about Divinity but you can't add attributes to characters on level up in Pillars of Eternity (I'm a beta player). Also I'm struggling to think of old school rpgs in which you could (aside from Planescape).

[Wissenschaft 2.0]

It's presumably optional because - like DA:O and DA2 - the game is a joke on the standard difficulty. 

 

Have you seen the new gameplay videos released this week? Have you seen how those players are so bad they make normal seem challenging. Yeah, thats the type of player normal is meant for.

[Giantdeathrobot]

Meh, stat-ups are the very least interesting part of leveling up. It's just, oh, now I have 26 Cunning instead of 24, and do 2% extra critical damage! Which is interesting because RPG! Yeah, give me a new spell or a new effect over that boring tripe any day of the week.

 

Besides, whenever it's in Dragon Age, DnD, Diablo II, WoW talents, whatever, attribute-based systems always worked the same way if you wanted an optimal build: invest everything in a golden stat, some more points in vitality, and absolutely nothing in the rest. In other games, it was; invest only as much as you need to equip BiS item X, dump the rest in vitality and/or mana. In Torchlight it was; equipment requirements are meaningless anyway, dump everything in mana. It resulted in very cookie cutter builds and little real originality at all. And I have literally never seen my impression get debunked by any game that used such a system.

 

We still get attribute skill-ups by picking talents/spells. It seems like they wanted an additional incentive to some talents via stat ups. Time will tell if it's a good idea. But I certainly will not miss attributes in any way.

[Steelcan]

But not because they were streamlined.

didn't say they made a good call on it

[In Exile]

Yes, it's worse, but not by the extent you're making it out to be. I think the gear we'll get from (Mini-)Bosses and special quest rewards will be just as good as anything you can craft at that moment in time. Obviously you'll come out ahead when you really devote yourself to crafting but that's simply a necessary feature if you want people to invest time into crafting gear at all - but that doesn't mean it will be twice as good.

 

It can only be as good as what we craft if Bioware is already aware of the best power-gaming builds and designs their lot drops around that. But that's... never been the case.