155 réponses à ce sujet

[GalacticDonuts]

I wouldn't mind having to kill Hawke...as long as the writers came up with a good enough reason. The Warden on the other hand I wouldn't want to fight, the main reason being that my Warden was more or less invulnerable since he was AW/SH/BM my inquisitor would probably get wrecked :/

[Master Warder Z_]

I don't think there's a few thousand Templars in the entire Free Marches, let alone the Kirkwall Gallows. Probably 150 tops, and that's counting recruits at no point in any Dragon Age work do I think we see more than 3 score Templars gathered together.

Lambert had a force of several thousand converging at the white spire to march on the mages.

Kirkwall was the largest army in the east.

I'd suspect there were probably around 2000
to 3000 stationed there at any given time.

You don't mark one location as the largest concentration of Templars out of orlais without it being just that.

[KaiserShep]

I wouldn't mind having to kill Hawke...as long as the writers came up with a good enough reason. The Warden on the other hand I wouldn't want to fight, the main reason being that my Warden was more or less invulnerable since he was AW/SH/BM my inquisitor would probably get wrecked :/

 

I don't believe that there's any reason they could give that would be good enough that would force us to kill a former protagonist.

 

As for the Warden, it's not like this character's power really matters. Like, if Hawke fought the Warden in DA2 for some reason, the Warden would be bound to DA2's gameplay limits.

[TheEternalStudent]

Lambert had a force of several thousand converging at the white spire to march on the mages.

Kirkwall was the largest army in the east.

I'd suspect there were probably around 2000
to 3000 stationed there at any given time.

You don't mark one location as the largest concentration of Templars out of orlais without it being just that.

Where do you get several thousand in the White Spire? There's a crowd, many, but no exact numbers, or any rooms with known dimensions filled with Templars. Kirkwall did have the most Templars in the Marches, and Meredith no doubt requested more, but  thousands? That's probably more than a 2:1 ratio of templars to mages, and at that point I don't think any apostates could wander Kirkwall with that many Templars.

[Doominike]

I don't believe that there's any reason they could give that would be good enough that would force us to kill a former protagonist.

 

As for the Warden, it's not like this character's power really matters. Like, if Hawke fought the Warden in DA2 for some reason, the Warden would be bound to DA2's gameplay limits.

They could give them arbitrarily jacked up stats to mimic the effect though

[Sviken]

Killing Patrice would of been murder, with the Templars it's mostly self defense and soldiers die all the time, but if Patrice dies a laysister, then an investigation would occur. Hawke's powerful but she ends up with a lot of enemies, many of which would doom her for killing Patrice.

 

And Hawke really couldn't help the city from avoiding a mage templar war, despite her role in it, Anders asked for help and I know I was suspicious of it the first time through, but I assumed it was something more lowkey not blowing up the Chantry, I honestly assumed it was likely just to get the Grand Cleric out of the chantry and into the streets, where she had to see the mage's plight. There is nothing Hawke can do to avoid Meredith and Orsino coming to blows because Meredith was just unreasonable, and Hawke can't kill Meredith as she's the most powerful person in Kirkwall. Meredith would of just tranquiled more mages and limited even greater freedoms until the mages would of fought back, and at the start of Act III Hawke is trying to calm the emotions, and stops the explosion of war from starting sooner. The Grand Cleric was the only one who could of stopped the war, and that's EXACTLY why Anders killed her.

Here comes the role-play - you can kill almost anyone. The guy practically reduced Kirkwall population by half. As I also said, Elthinia didn't seem to care that she got killed at the center of the Chantry either, when she was a Mother (a higher rank than a lowly sister). In a crime area, you think the Kirkwall authorities are going to go in some deep investigation? Highly doubt so, considering that during Act I the Guard Captain was corrupt as f*ck..

 

Anders basically said he was planning "something big" and didn't want it to "blow" back to you. If that's lowkey...

 

Anyway, I'm not saying Hawke should have stormed the Gallows and destroyed Meredith single-handedly, but the guy was extremely wealthy, very loved by the people, was practically controlling the underworld and the city guard by Varric and Aveline and had a ship with full crew under Isabela and had other very powerful friends themselves like Merill, Fenris and Anders (who himself could rally the Fereldans he saved), and Hawke himself was extremely powerful. And you can bet the mages would have joined the fight, if there was one. Now if that's not enough to destroy Meredith, which is highly unlikely, then he could have began a campaign to broker a peace with the mages or become viscount himself, and he would have won. Believe me, I highly doubt Meredith would have tried to apprehend an innocent man because if she did, then her already cracking support would have eradicated in that second (btw, her own Knight-Captain betrayed her even if Hawke protected the mages).

 

The thing is: things haven't become from bad to relatively good in those 3 years leading to act III, they have become bad to worse (as stated during the loading screen) which means Hawke did absolutely nothing to prevent any of it. A guy with so much influential power, well, you would think he could make some kind of difference, but no...

 

I would have been happy, if Hawke tried to make things better, and with the political support he had, he brokered a relative peace between the mages and the templars. By act III things have become brighter than before and Meredith and Orsino were actively cooperating to root out trobulemakers in both ranks and Hawke participating. But Anders ruins it all by becoming finally giving in to Justice and blows up the Chantry ( and no, he doesn't tell Hawke about this, he just goes and finds the materials himself). This forces Meredith hand who doesn't have a choice but to call the Right of Annulment which results in Hawke having his choice between templars and mages. See, two plot holes removed. This will reduce Hawke's ineptitude and make him somewhat of a tragic hero he was meant to be, not some random, stupid, all powerful guy that took mssions from everyone in Kirkwall without question... because?

[Master Warder Z_]

Where do you get several thousand in the White Spire?.

When it talks about the host he is assembling to march on the mages?

I said that no?

[Lulupab]

I think the thousand number is accurate because mages are some thousand at Andorals' reach as well. The Templar force is at least double in size.

[TheEternalStudent]

When it talks about the host he is assembling to march on the mages?

I said that no?

At the end, when he's talking about the final mass of all the templars, that might be the case, but I don't remember, nor could I find any reference to, tousands of Templars in/about the White Spire.

[Reidbynature]

I'm all for being able to fight past protagonists.  Hawke or Warden.  I just think it would be fun to set off our new player characters in opposition to past ones if they encounter them and watch the sparks fly.  That and just for the prestige of taking down 'The Champion' or the 'Hero of Ferelden'.

 

Or on the flip-side depending on what kind of character you're playing as it would be fun to team up with them for a stint also.

[KaiserShep]

And outside of the cast of companions, the only character that can actually show the utmost respect for Hawke is the Arishok, because Kirkwall is in love with irony as much as crisis.

[atamajakki]

Hawke was a shameless supporter of the Templars in my playthrough, so I doubt she'll be any sort of antagonist for my Human Templar or even my Dwarf Rogue. We'll team up to kill more evil bad mages.

[Reptillius]

I've had a couple tank Wardens that were pretty nasty all by themselves as well. Though some of the mage ones are downright deadly too.  I wouldn't have wanted to pit the two against each other. Could have been potentially game breaking considering they were designed to kill each other. (Templar is commonly one of my specialties on my tanks and I take out mages with extreme prejudice by locking them down heavily.

 

As for numbers of Templars at Merideth's dispoal.  It could be as little as 150 to 200 with the ability to call up enough to double that or a bit more with enough time to prepare and it could still easily be the second largest unit of Templars anywhere.

 

You got to remember that 60 is seen as a large group of Templars in most places where they have perhaps 20 or 30 in standing service more than likely.  And maybe 60 to 80 in large places like Denerim or other major cities.

 

 

As for Anders. I didn't quite expect him to blow up the chantry but I did expect something that monumentally stupid.  I spent the entire 3rd act on my first couple of playthroughs trying to figure out how to talk him out of doing whatever he was planning until I learned that it wasn't even possible.  So on my third playthrough I went Templar loving and killed him when I got the chance in revenge.

[the inquisitor94]

Well according to my mage Hawke i think she is the Hero or Symbol of Mage Rebellion. She sided with the mages, run off with her true love Anders and maybe they lived happily every after (for a while maybe). And as i mage i will be i'd like to have her at my side and help me kill some evil templars.

[SmilesJA]

Whatever Hawke is, I hope we have to deal with him or her as little as possible. I personally can't stand Hawke. I find Hawke to be obnoxious at best, and a grade-A screw up who gets all the "Hero of the World!" treatment without having to accomplish any of the tasks at worst. I can't stand the way nearly all the characters in the world constantly kiss Hawke's **** and act like Hawke is the most skilled, important, competent, capable person since the Warden, even though the Warden had to actually earn her stripes and Hawke is just a glorified errand boy/girl.

 

Whatever Hawke is, I hope my Inquisitor can tell her to get lost, or at least be as rude and dismissive as possible for as long as we're forced to deal with her and then send her packing. Knowing Hawke, whatever quest she gets involved with will turn into a total failure by the end.

 

People kissing up to the player character isn't new. Also I would argue that Hawke had to work twice as hard to get respect. The Warden, even he/she was a rookie was part of a legendary organization that commands respect especially during blights. 

[Niox D Caledonia]

Ugh Code Geass *vomits in the corner*

How Dare You

Code Geass is a masterpiece but thats not what we are here to talk about is it?

 

and yes Hawke kept getting pulled into  everything, of all the protagonist so far he is the weakest in terms of leadership

"Zero" rebuilt the Ferelden Gray Wardens from 2 people and "Thanatos" is the first leader of the newly revived Inquisition.

 

what was hawke major deeds apart from

i. starting a war he didnt want

ii. releasing an ancient magister with similar abilities like an arch-demon after he took the time to give them hints Corypheus actually told them "If I cannot leave with you, I will leave through you! I seek the light!" and the wardens didn't even twitch admittedly Hawke had no idea but Larius, carver/Bethany or Anders were there.

[dantares83]

I don't believe that there's any reason they could give that would be good enough that would force us to kill a former protagonist.

 

As for the Warden, it's not like this character's power really matters. Like, if Hawke fought the Warden in DA2 for some reason, the Warden would be bound to DA2's gameplay limits.

well, if Hawke's views are so different from yours, i dont see why not.

[the inquisitor94]

Hawke was meant to be a man (or woman) to seek out fortune, a place to Kirkwall and protection against the templars (if he was a mage for himself, or for Bethany). He wasnt the hero type that would go all around the world, seek out evil and destroy it. Most things were random or Fate i may imply as Flemeth once said. Now we can go around and blame him for everything.

 

Hawke never wanted to make the things go in that crazy spin. If you maded good, sarcastic or a crazy villainous murderer the result would be the same (deep roads, qunari, distraction of chantry and conflict between mages- templars, death of that loony Meredith no matter what side you chose). The game was meant to be a cannon for the future events to happen and i am all for it.

 

Think that if it werent for him the DaI may have been different.

 

P.S. about Corypheus i am glad he isnt dead. Maybe we will learn more about him and the ancient tevinter, magisters and maybe Black City- darkspawn.

[House Lannister]

The outcome of Hawke greatly depends on Hawke's actions and what type of Inquisitor I'm planning to play. I feel boring and might mold myself as the Inquisitor.

 

Killing my Mage Hawke who sided with the templers is going to be upsetting.

[Lord of Mortlan]

I think it would be realy interesting. Maybe they could make some options to avoid it or something, but it would give the consequences a hole new meaning. And Dragon Age need consequences to your actions.

[KennethAFTopp]

I think the OP had a good question, such as if we met the Warden in DA:I, one of my warden playthrough he's a total selfish power hungry sociopath, and it would be great to have a choice to fight against him so to speak. Same thing with Hawke. But secondly it's all a question of the characters and are their goals aligned. 

[JMan240]

You know; after all this time I don't know how I missed this.

 

But for this to work in game, as a werewolf it must have been possible for Hawke to change from wolf-man form back to human.......

 

Which makes me wonder about the werewolves and the lady of the forest and why they couldn't do that.

That's probably why they changed it. You can come up with a cool concept out of context, but it doesn't work in context. Like half the female races for the Mass Effect games that just didn't work the first time out, or the original designs for the Turians.