2341 réponses à ce sujet

[RobRam10]

Unless she pulls a Padme.

A possibility.

[dragonflight288]

But they understand the concept of money. When the price is high enough, they'll eat each other. Humans, elves, dwarves, doesn't matter.

 

But in such a culture, diplomacy and free markets do not exist. Pillaging and looting is seen as the more 'manly' or 'honorable' way to to build up ones fortune. 

 

As Dr. Horrible says, "It's not about making money, it's about taking money."

[Xilizhra]

Support Gaspard de Chalons. Celene is a vile schemer.

A magister is somehow morally offended by someone else being a schemer?

[The Baconer]

But in such a culture, diplomacy and free markets do not exist.

 

Which culture? Also, diplomacy and free markets very much exist in Thedas. Nobles won't get very far without diplomacy. There are also many examples of "free markets"... one could say they are free to a fault, or many.

 

 

Pillaging and looting is seen as the more 'manly' or 'honorable' way to to build up ones fortune. 

 

That is a hefty oversimplification, and in some cases not even true depending on the culture.

[Meredydd]

Personally, I wouldn't trust Celene with anything. Much less an entire country. Not that I blame her entirely for how she is. She's a product of her time, a victim to her environment. But, considering how she treats people, especially her 'lover', I'm gonna side with Gaspard. At least he has a sense of honour and can be trusted to keep his word.

 

Considering how there is so much conflict going on in the world of Thedas, I think Orlais needs a strong leader with military experience. I'm not saying Gaspard is the best solution. If there was a third option I would probably pick it. But if it was Celene vs Gaspard, I'd pick Gaspard. I'd just try and convince him not to invade Ferelden.

 

In Inquisition, Orlais doesn't need cultural advancements, it needs stability and defense. I not so sure Celene can provide that.

[ladyofpayne]

She is not a traitor. She is fool. Her choses to get commoners in University is good but the rest were auwfull- give elve promises that she cannot fullfuill cost Orlais Civil War. If Gaspard won near Halamsiral war would be finished but Brioala spoiled everything.

[SilvinC]

She is not the savior of Orlais, but definitely the lesser of two evils when compared to the warmongering Gaspard. Celene and Briala working together again would be probably the best hope for orlesians, humans and elves alike.

[Mimilette]

Celene and Gaspard are both products of their environment, so I cannot blame one more than the other about their flaws. As for who is better for Orlais, I feel it depends on what you personally think is better for the empire. If it's social progress, for the humans at least, and cultural achievements, Celene seems to be the obvious choice. If it's to reinforce its military power and expansion, it seems Gaspard is the winner. Now if it's for Orlais to survive the crisis, then I have absolutely no idea.

 

We know Celene is a capable ruler, she's been one for 20 years, but she didn't have to deal with crazyness happening everywhere. As for Gaspard, I have no clue. All he has as credentials is being a noble and a brilliant chevalier. Loghain was a brilliant general too, but he made for a terrible leader during Ferelden biggest crisis, so I'm not certain how well Gaspard would fare, especially since his "long term vision" seems to be limited to be emperor, and invade Ferelden.

 

I don't really understand how his code of "honor" is a recommendation either, because he did not strike me as an honorable man. Clearly he respects the chevaliers code, but since the chevaliers are an order of less than savory people, I have a hard time finding that wonderful. He manages to berate Remache for wanting to torture Pierre, talking how his "honor" wouldn't allow such an act, only to threatens immediately to burn Halamshiral to the ground to make him talk. Destroying a city and killing its citizens are a-ok, but torturing one noble is just going too far. He also does not hesitate to kill an ally who was helping him because of his code. I understand how it looks cool, but basically the man who is supposed to hold his promises will betray you in a heartbeat because you didn't meet his personal moral standards? I just don't see why I would want such an annoying ally, with a code I couldn't care less about.

 

I think both Celene and Gaspard are completely unreliable. They'll side with you when it suits them, and betray you the second you do something they don't like.

 

Briala better do something smart in Inquisition so helping her will make sense, because my canon Inquisitor sure doesn't want to side with those two.

[Yermogi]

I have not yet made up my mind between the two of them as to which I will support. 

 

The Empress is, as stated, selfish, cruel, and manipulative. I am not surprised with that. She's Orlesian, and an Empress. It's kind of required. For me, I will have to take a closer look at what she has done in the past and how she plans to take care of issues in the future.

 

Meanwhile, the duke (or whatever his name is) is fed up with the needless decadence and nonsense of The Game and wants to go to bare-bones necessity. I like that about him. But I know nothing else about him besides that. If he's racist, cruel, and wants to invade Ferelden again, he's out.

 

As it looks, I'll probably have to choose between the lesser of two evils. Hopefully a third option will present itself that will be preferable to the first two choices.

[Hammerstorm]

I haven't read TME, but the Game in Orlais sound a lot like the Game in Cairhien in The wheel of time. and my problem is that when Rand tried to forbid it it only evolved to be "maybe I said it maybe I said that" or "he said that but I know he meant that". That is what I think will happen if Gaspard tries to do the same.

 

That said: because I haven't read the book I will only go with what the game give me. (And my gut  )

[BloodKaiden]

So, just finished TME and I'm conflicted. This book was amazing and I look forward to meeting these characters but when it comes to Celene I can't help but have this mad level of respect for her. Like I don't agree with some of the things that went down however I feel like she will return in Inquisition far more powerful and ruthless than before. Especially since the betrayal of her lover at a point where she could have reclaimed her rule....at the end of the day I think I'd go Celene over Gaspard. I feel like Ferelden doesn't need another war atm.

[Spectre Impersonator]

 I feel like she will return in Inquisition far more powerful and ruthless than before.

Does it get much more ruthless than having your lover's family slaughtered in cold blood? I mean, maybe she'll do less crying about it afterwards but I'm not sure that will impress me. Her one redeeming  quality was her regret for her actions, indicating she still had a human soul.

[Andreas Amell]

Good grief. It sounds like we're having to choose between Mary (Queen of Scotts) and Napolean Bonaparte.

[herkles]

Good grief. It sounds like we're having to choose between Mary (Queen of Scotts) and Napolean Bonaparte.

well to me this is a bit easier since I am a tad biased towards Napoleon  

 

For my main inquistor, Navilia Trevelyan, it will be whom ever supports the chantry, Ostwick and/or Nevarra more. 

[Andreas Amell]

well to me this is a bit easier since I am a tad biased towards Napoleon

 

For my main inquistor, Navilia Trevelyan, it will be whom ever supports the chantry, Ostwick and/or Nevarra more. 

Whatever floats your boat. I support whomever leaves Ferelden alone.

[raging_monkey]

Good grief. It sounds like we're having to choose between Mary (Queen of Scotts) and Napolean Bonaparte.

thats soo true...

[Lady Artifice]

This thread makes me dizzy...

Are there any other devoted Briala fans out there?

Nobody? Okay then.

[The Baconer]

This thread makes me dizzy...

Are there any other devoted Briala fans out there?

 

Certainly more than Gaspard or Celene for sure. Her methods are... questionable, but that is something I can fix, assuming a partnership is possible.

[Lady Artifice]

Certainly more than Gaspard or Celene for sure. Her methods are... questionable, but that is something I can fix, assuming a partnership is possible.

I hope so. She's *that character* for me. The one who I see is flawed, but I'm so utterly smitten that I feel I could overlook almost anything.

[Spectre Impersonator]

This thread makes me dizzy...

Are there any other devoted Briala fans out there?

Nobody? Okay then.

I can deal with Briala. She reminds me of a companion character from a Bioware game. She's not really as smart as she thinks but she's skilled and creative.

[HK-90210]

I can deal with Briala. She reminds me of a companion character from a Bioware game. She's not really as smart as she thinks but she's skilled and creative.

 

My problem with Briala has little to do with the character and more with Bioware's consistent pushing of female elves we're supposed to like and care about. First it was Fiona(the Calling), then Tallis(Redemption and MotA), then Briala(Masked Empire) and finally Valya and Isseya(Last Flight). Each of them are presented as flawed characters, but the narrative makes it clear that we are supposed to like them. They're purposefully endearing, and it feels forced at this point. "Ooo, female elf, I'm supposed to like them." At least Masked Empire had Mihris, a female Dalish elf we are definitely NOT supposed to like. That was kind of nice.

 

The trope is just getting a little tiring at this point. I'm also done with the semi-sarcastic human male hero with a well-connected mother who ends up being the leader of an armed rebellion and has trouble with two attractive women, one of whom betrays him(Maric and Rhys). Give us a dwarf hero. Or a female human hero who isn't as incompetent as Celene. Something new and different in the likeable protagonist department.

 

*ends semi off-topic rant on tropes*

 

So yeah.....Go Gaspard. Down with the selfish, incompetent Empress.

[Lady Artifice]

My problem with Briala has little to do with the character and more with Bioware's consistent pushing of female elves we're supposed to like and care about. First it was Fiona(the Calling), then Tallis(Redemption and MotA), then Briala(Masked Empire) and finally Valya and Isseya(Last Flight). Each of them are presented as flawed characters, but the narrative makes it clear that we are supposed to like them. They're purposefully endearing, and it feels forced at this point. "Ooo, female elf, I'm supposed to like them." At least Masked Empire had Mihris, a female Dalish elf we are definitely NOT supposed to like. That was kind of nice.
 
The trope is just getting a little tiring at this point. I'm also done with the semi-sarcastic human male hero with a well-connected mother who ends up being the leader of an armed rebellion and has trouble with two attractive women, one of whom betrays him(Maric and Rhys). Give us a dwarf hero. Or a female human hero who isn't as incompetent as Celene. Something new and different in the likeable protagonist department.
 
*ends semi off-topic rant on tropes*
 
So yeah.....Go Gaspard. Down with the selfish, incompetent Empress.

I found Briala more savvy and wise than those other examples.


However, I see your point.

[Sully13]

[Lady Artifice]

Honor is for stupid Chevaliers.