2341 réponses à ce sujet

[Willowhugger]

Well the Celene option is certainly the best then.

 

The idea of them reconciling is the most evil decision I can think outside of Jade Empire or the City Elf Origin.

[ButterRum]

The idea of them reconciling is the most evil decision I can think outside of Jade Empire or the City Elf Origin.

 

I do agree...the power dynamic in Celene and Briala's relationship was uneven. Celene took advantage of Briala as her handmaiden, and the way I read it in the book...they first kissed when Briala was shocked in horror over the blood bath of her parents' bodies. So basically, Celene seduced Briala in a very emotionally vulnerable time for her and built their entire relationship living a lie.

 

Celene does not view Briala as her equal and doesn't truly doesn't consider elves as fully individuals or whatever, but she still has a more progressive view as a human than most in Thedas. Still, it doesn't make it right for how Celene treated Briala. She probably strung her along and slowly gave elves some rights in Orlais out of guilt and to keep the elf quiet. Celene definitely believes the elves should be given more rights (so that they could be put to use in Orlais), and the book stated she had a fascination with elven culture when she was little, so it wasn't only about Briala but, Briala was very influential and a force to be reckoned with, so it would have gone bad for Celene had Briala found out what Celene did.

 

Also, the exoticism of Celene's view of Briala made the relationship extra creepy. It was almost like she had a fetish for Briala. I mean, elves aren't human though, so Celene's type of exoticism is way different than actual exoticism IRL, but let's not go there.

 

It wasn't a healthy relationship at all, especially for Briala, and what Celene did is unforgivable to Briala. I don't know how it would be possible to reconcile their relationship.

 

Still siding with Celene though. 

 

 

What happened in the City Elf origin??? I remember playing through it but never finishing.

[Warden Commander Aeducan]

The idea of them reconciling is the most evil decision I can think outside of Jade Empire or the City Elf Origin.

I think this may be one of the worst things you can do. Blood Magic, sacrificing countless innocents, dethroning honorable men in favor of dictators, all for the greater good. But this? This would make a Tevinter Magister's jaw drop.

[Lady Artifice]

I will do what is necessary to keep that woman away from Briala. 

 

Edit: Even if what is necessary is siding with that pompous, warmongering Chevalier.

[ButterRum]

I think this may be one of the worst things you can do. Blood Magic, sacrificing countless innocents, dethroning honorable men in favor of dictators, all for the greater good. But this? This would make a Tevinter Magister's jaw drop.

LOL What about giving Fenris back to the slaves or giving Isabela to the Arishok or executing Alistair?

I haven't read the spoiler though. I wanna find out myself.

[wcholcombe]

Bah she is an adult and I'd she still loves celebs then that is up to her. Céline tried to send Briala away after that but she came back.

Plus, Briala wielded a tremendous amount of influence overy Céline and her decision making.

[ButterRum]

Bah she is an adult and I'd she still loves celebs then that is up to her. Céline tried to send Briala away after that but she came back.

Plus, Briala wielded a tremendous amount of influence overy Céline and her decision making.

Briala is an adult but it's not like she could just quit her job as Celene's handmaiden and file for unemployment. She was born into a system that abuses elves and takes advantage of them. Briala was Celene's confidante and if she quit working, Celene would have had her killed, especially if her throne was threatened. Celene was willing throw a dagger at Briala when she had the eluvians.

Yes, Celene told Briala to go to the Dalish, but she also told Briala to live for her. So I think she was suggesting that Briala should return.

[Morroian]

The idea of them reconciling is the most evil decision I can think outside of Jade Empire or the City Elf Origin.

 

I wasn't really talking about that so much as what each does as emperor afterward.

[Warden Commander Aeducan]

LOL What about giving Fenris back to the slaves or giving Isabela to the Arishok or executing Alistair?

I haven't read the spoiler though. I wanna find out myself.

Oh right, I forgot about those. Well, giving Isabela to the Arishok is debatable that it's evil or not. While it may look like Hawke betraying her tbh she betraying Hawke in the first place, and her selfish action brought this on Kirkwall, and a lot of people suffer from it...so she's not really an innocent bystander. I didn't hand Isabela to the Arishok, but I'm bummed that she walks free, unharmed without facing any kind of punishment from the people of Kirkwall.

 

 

Bah she is an adult and I'd she still loves celebs then that is up to her. Céline tried to send Briala away after that but she came back.

Plus, Briala wielded a tremendous amount of influence overy Céline and her decision making.

Their relationship ended a long time ago when Briala found out that Celene respond for her parents' death, and she has already decided that Celene cannot be trusted with the fate of the elves. If she is an adult then she already made her decision, and she doesn't need another person interfere with her life. That mean people shouldn't try to reconcile Celene & Briala, unless it's Briala decision without the Inquisitor's influence. 

So...that mean Celene is weak, and she's a lot weaker without Briala holding her hands. 

[wcholcombe]

Oh right, I forgot about those. Well, giving Isabela to the Arishok is debatable that it's evil or not. While it may look like Hawke betraying her tbh she betraying Hawke in the first place, and her selfish action brought this on Kirkwall, and a lot of people suffer from it...so she's not really an innocent bystander. I didn't hand Isabela to the Arishok, but I'm bummed that she walks free, unharmed without facing any kind of punishment from the people of Kirkwall.


Their relationship ended a long time ago when Briala found out that Celene respond for her parents' death, and she has already decided that Celene cannot be trusted with the fate of the elves. If she is an adult then she already made her decision, and she doesn't need another person interfere with her life. That mean people shouldn't try to reconcile Celene & Briala, unless it's Briala decision without the Inquisitor's influence.

So...that mean Celene is weak, and she's a lot weaker without Briala holding her hands.

Briala admits she still loves Celebs at the end of TME so obviously not. Also, we will just have to disagree, Céline is far more trustworthy the Gaspard, a self admitted racist, who has already broke his oath of loyalty to Céline so what would he care about an oath made to an elf whom he thinks are below humans in the first place. Especially since he probably has already made promises to those nobles he race baited into supporting him.

[ButterRum]

Who knows if Celene had any other secret elven lovers besides Briala.

DAI spoiler...

Spoiler

I read that you can romance Vivienne to Celene but that's all I know. Don't want to know anymore.

[wcholcombe]

As for how they reconcile, I believe the INQ just points out the fact that they still care for each other.

[ButterRum]

Briala admits she still loves Celebs at the end of TME so obviously not. Also, we will just have to disagree, Céline is far more trustworthy the Gaspard, a self admitted racist, who has already broke his oath of loyalty to Céline so what would he care about an oath made to an elf whom he thinks are below humans in the first place. Especially since he probably has already made promises to those nobles he race baited into supporting him.

I agree that Gaspard's "honor" is overrated and incredibly convenient for him. He plays dirty too and was also part of Lady Mantillon's dirty business.

When Celene tried making peace with Ferelden, let's not forget he crashed the party and mocked the death of the Red Queen or Ferelden's old queen or whatever, and it could have sent Ferelden into a war with Orlais.

He tried arranging a "hunting accident" for Celene, and when that didn't work, he lied about where he was gonna be and ambushed Celene's forces.

He's the traitorous one challenging Celene's legitimate position as empress of Orlais, so it's weird that people think Celene is a traitor of her country. She's defending her legitimate claim to the throne like every other noble would do.

Also, The Game is part of Orlesian culture and something that everyone plays to gain power in Orlais, so Celene isn't a traitor by playing the game. That would make basically every ruler in Orlais a traitor if she is one too.

[Warden Commander Aeducan]

Céline is far more trustworthy.

Yes, because any trustworthy person would murdering your parents just to advance her own political career. Then this trustworthy person will save you only to use you to serve her own interest, manipulating you into believe that this trustworthy person is your savior, and this trustworthy person would lie to you for twenty years. This trustworthy person has promised to uplifting the elves, but turn on them at the first sight of resistance, and when this trustworthy person afraid to lose her own power. Celene didn't care for the elves nor the people of Orlais. Celene is only caring for herself, and she intends to do everything to keep herself in the power.

 

I'm not saying Gaspard is more trustworthy, but if you're saying Celene is far more trustworthy especially after seen what she have done, and what she's capable of. I find it's utterly laughable if some people still think Celene is trustworthy at this point.

[Master Warder Z_]

Gaspard took his throne.

[ButterRum]

Celene is trustworthy for the people of the Orlais and keeping education, arts, and peace in place. Not so much for elves.

If you want Orlais to regress back to conquering nations and building up armies, pick Gaspard.

If you want Orlais to progress into an enlightened era with education, arts, and possibly more rights for elves (such as allowing them into universities or less taxes on them), pick Celene.

Both Celene and Gaspard would do what benefits the humans of Orlais if it came down to them versus the Orlais elves though.

And both of them would defend their position to their deaths if it came down to it.

[Warden Commander Aeducan]

If you want Orlais to regress back to conquering nations and building up armies, pick Gaspard.

If you want Orlais to progress into an enlightened era with education, arts, and possibly more rights for elves (such as allowing them into universities or less taxes on them), pick Celene.

 

Not defending Gaspard, but how is this even regressive for Orlais. I didn't know conquering other nations, retake their lost territory and expand Orlais's influence and power, and building up an armies is considerd regressive for Orlais.

Spoiler

In Celene's sole ruler ending, she never uplifting the elves.

[Master Warder Z_]

If you want Orlais to regress back to conquering nations and building up armies, pick Gaspard.

You mean the very acts that founded the Empire?

That's not regression, it's returning to what made Orlais great.

[Hellion Rex]

I give the throne to Gaspard, with Briala working in the shadows. Cause while Gaspard might be a jerk, he's also a very honorable jerk, which I respect a hell of a lot more than Celene's backstabby nature. At the least, I need the eluvians.

[Morroian]

You mean the very acts that founded the Empire?

That's not regression, it's returning to what made Orlais great.

 

Which is why if you want Orlais gone choosing Celene is the better result.

[Warden Commander Aeducan]

I give the throne to Gaspard, with Briala working in the shadows. Cause while Gaspard might be a jerk, he's also a very honorable jerk, which I respect a hell of a lot more than Celene's backstabby nature. At the least, I need the eluvians.

I am convinced that is the way to go even though I knew it's possible to have all three working together. I will be damned if I try to reconcile Celene & Briala. It's just wrong.

[Nyaore]

Reading this makes the whole decision smack of Bhelen and Harrowmont again, and oh the time I had making that little choice to the point where I spent four hours running around in game trying to find a way to pick 'none of the above'. 

[Hellion Rex]

I am convinced that is the way to go even though I knew it's possible to have all three working together. I will be damned if I try to reconcile Celene & Briala. It's just wrong.

Ugh. I agree.

[Br3admax]

I give the throne to Gaspard, with Briala working in the shadows. Cause while Gaspard might be a jerk, he's also a very honorable jerk, which I respect a hell of a lot more than Celene's backstabby nature. At the least, I need the eluvians.

Pretty much. 

[Master Warder Z_]

I didn't want nor need those evil things.

Edit: besides for progression of the plot.