Well said.
Doesn't change the fact that I hate politics and those who gleefully practice it.
My personal opinion is that politics is, at best, a necessary evil in running a civil society. Just my opinion.
Another fact of life is where power dwells.
In an alternative scenario, Celene and Gaspard do get married (trust me, there are worst couplings in both real and fictional life). Do you see them successfully rule Orlais or tear each other to shreds until the country goes into shambles?
In an alternative scenario, Celene and Gaspard do get married (trust me, there are worst couplings in both real and fictional life). Do you see them successfully rule Orlais or tear each other to shreds until the country goes into shambles?
Meh, one of them would most likely murder the other in their sleep soon enough.
I believe this relationship between Celene & Briala is abusive because of manipulating Briala into loving her which leads to abuse into their relationship. Thus telling Briala that she envies a maid because she has freedom to do whatever she wants? And Celene cheats Gaspard of his birthright to become emperor, but she says to Briala that she wishes she was free like her? (Don't you guys feel that's a bit odd?) She's taking advantage of her feelings because she wants to start a massacre the defenseles elves that way Briala will be conflicted about Celene, because Briala thinks Celene would never do such a thing because they love each other.Narcissists can abuse others physically and mentally, lie to them, steal from them, take advantage of them, sexually abuse them, and generally walk all over them, without feeling the least bit sorry for their victims.
I think that statement is the main reason why she wanted to start slaughtering elves, simply because it gives her pleasure of killing the defenseless and she was pissed off that the elves were revolting against the humans who been giving them hell, and since she's started doing good things for the elves by allowing them to their universities, and giving them decent jobs and all that good stuff. She thought that the elves are going to bow down and worship Celene as a "Good Samaritan" and this so called "savior" but they didn't and that is why she felt threatened and pissed off, because if the elves can take a stand against the humans they could stand up to Celene as well. So she started a massacre as an example to not thwart her authority. That is the peak of a malignant narcissist.In fact, it often gives them pleasure to dominate, control, manipulate and take from those around them. It's what drives them. It's what motivates them to do cruel and sadistic things to others to show their superiority."
Source:
http://www.decision-...narcissism.html
Modifié par IHaveReturned1999, 25 juillet 2016 - 06:46 .
Celene is vile traitor. I played DAI first and read TME later. I hated Celene and Michel de Chevin in that book and was ever so pleased to note that both were already dead in my worldstate.
Celene's and Briala's relationship is sick. She murdered her parents and Briala is just going to... forgive her? Well, should not be surprising she already forgave her for burning the alienage and killing all the innocent elves just to protect her precious image (not to mention imprisoned Briala and would have let that varterral kill her). Letting Celene die is doing Briala a favor - she is too codependent on her. She rules Orlais in my canon worldstate but I would love it if she were to become a companion in the next game. I loved her in TME and it was kind of sad that she only had a very small role in DAI.
You're preaching to the choir.Celene is vile traitor. I played DAI first and read TME later. I hated Celene and Michel de Chevin in that book and was ever so pleased to note that both were already dead in my worldstate.
Celene's and Briala's relationship is sick. She murdered her parents and Briala is just going to... forgive her? Well, should not be surprising she already forgave her for burning the alienage and killing all the innocent elves just to protect her precious image (not to mention imprisoned Briala and would have let that varterral kill her). Letting Celene die is doing Briala a favor - she is too codependent on her. She rules Orlais in my canon worldstate but I would love it if she were to become a companion in the next game. I loved her in TME and it was kind of sad that she only had a very small role in DAI.
Traitor, no. Terrible person, yes. And do recall that Briala was setting up elves that knew of her past relations with Celene to be removed.Celene is vile traitor. I played DAI first and read TME later. I hated Celene and Michel de Chevin in that book and was ever so pleased to note that both were already dead in my worldstate.
Celene's and Briala's relationship is sick. She murdered her parents and Briala is just going to... forgive her? Well, should not be surprising she already forgave her for burning the alienage and killing all the innocent elves just to protect her precious image (not to mention imprisoned Briala and would have let that varterral kill her). Letting Celene die is doing Briala a favor - she is too codependent on her. She rules Orlais in my canon worldstate but I would love it if she were to become a companion in the next game. I loved her in TME and it was kind of sad that she only had a very small role in DAI.
Traitor, no. Terrible person, yes. And do recall that Briala was setting up elves that knew of her past relations with Celene to be removed.
Either way, Gaspard rules in my world state, so all is well.
True enough, Briala was not much better than Celene... she was obviously upset when Celene burned the alienage and killed the elves but still forgave her. She let the dalish be killed, did nothing to stop it. And like you said she was setting up elves to cover her mistakes... just like Celene did before. Somehow I still like her (mostly I think it's because I liked her and Felassan's friendship so much and admire Briala's ambition to help her people).
Celene did betray Briala, though. That makes her a traitor.
Hello, if that could be of any use : in abusive relationships, as it seems to be what we're talking about here, desperately wanting to forgive the abuser for whatever they do in every possible way is something that tends to happen a lot
I think Briala has issues. Classic Stockholm.True enough, Briala was not much better than Celene... she was obviously upset when Celene burned the alienage and killed the elves but still forgave her. She let the dalish be killed, did nothing to stop it. And like you said she was setting up elves to cover her mistakes... just like Celene did before. Somehow I still like her (mostly I think it's because I liked her and Felassan's friendship so much and admire Briala's ambition to help her people).
Celene did betray Briala, though. That makes her a traitor.
Somehow I still like her (mostly I think it's because I liked her and Felassan's friendship so much and admire Briala's ambition to help her people).
Felessan is the one most responsible for the death of that Dalish Clan. He was the only one who knew what he would do once he was free and he also that Michel was going to unknowingly free him from his cage. And he chose to let him do it.
Hello, if that could be of any use : in abusive relationships, as it seems to be what we're talking about here, desperately wanting to forgive the abuser for whatever they do in every possible way is something that tends to happen a lot
This is true and could explain many things. Leliana even said that with Celene on the throne Briala would never truly be able to rule because there is too much emotional connection. So Celene still has hold over her.
It's not a relationship to begin with and Briala is nothing but a fling for Celene, and use her as a tool and to be thrown away when it served it's purpose.Hello, if that could be of any use : in abusive relationships, as it seems to be what we're talking about here, desperately wanting to forgive the abuser for whatever they do in every possible way is something that tends to happen a lot
Felessan is the one most responsible for the death of that Dalish Clan. He was the only one who knew what he would do once he was free and he also that Michel was going to unknowingly free him from his cage. And he chose to let him do it.
Felassan doesn't care about the dalish. He compares them to itchweed. They are insignificant to him and to his plans. Briala is the one who gets upset when Thelhen says: "Abelas, da'len, but I have no people in the alienages of Orlais."
She blames the dalish for "letting the alienages burn, because the city elves are not their people." Excuse me? It was your precious Celene that burned the alienage because she didn't want anyone to think she would have an elven lover. Why on earth should the dalish now of all the sudden go and get themselves killed for nothing? That's just delusional.
Briala says she will fight for her people because no one else would. I admire that. But when she walks away with the humans and lets the dalish get slaughtered - I cannot understand. Just a few minutes ago you were offended that the dalish do not see CE as their people but now your just going to walk away hand in hand with the women who is responsible for all the dead elves while they all get killed? Yet she acts like she's better than them. It's her self-righteousness I don't like.
She blames the dalish for "letting the alienages burn, because the city elves are not their people." Excuse me? It was your precious Celene that burned the alienage because she didn't want anyone to think she would have an elven lover. Why on earth should the dalish now of all the sudden go and get themselves killed for nothing? That's just delusional.
Well, and the whole 'that Alienage was causing a violent revolt' but yeah, let's ignore all the facts and say it was just because of the elven lover thing. 
Not saying I support what Celene did, since I don't, but there were other circumstances that made it an understandable move.
Well, and the whole 'that Alienage was causing a violent revolt' but yeah, let's ignore all the facts and say it was just because of the elven lover thing.
Not saying I support what Celene did, since I don't, but there were other circumstances that made it an understandable move.
For Celene the Game is all that matters. She would have let Briala handle the revolt in a peaceful way. That rumor was the only reason why she decided the alienage must burn. It had nothing to do with the elves revolting. She was just concerned about her reputation. They were just casual victims of the Game.
Felassan doesn't care about the dalish. He compares them to itchweed. They are insignificant to him and to his plans. Briala is the one who gets upset when Thelhen says: "Abelas, da'len, but I have no people in the alienages of Orlais."
She blames the dalish for "letting the alienages burn, because the city elves are not their people." Excuse me? It was your precious Celene that burned the alienage because she didn't want anyone to think she would have an elven lover. Why on earth should the dalish now of all the sudden go and get themselves killed for nothing? That's just delusional.
Briala says she will fight for her people because no one else would. I admire that. But when she walks away with the humans and lets the dalish get slaughtered - I cannot understand. Just a few minutes ago you were offended that the dalish do not see CE as their people but now your just going to walk away hand in hand with the women who is responsible for all the dead elves while they all get killed? Yet she acts like she's better than them. It's her self-righteousness I don't like.
Celene burned Halalmshiral because there was a rebellion. I was saying that you condemned Briala for letting the Dalish die when there was nothing she could have done about it, but like her for being friends with the guy who COULD have done something about it and chose to let them die.
Celene burned Halalmshiral because there was a rebellion. I was saying that you condemned Briala for letting the Dalish die when there was nothing she could have done about it, but like her for being friends with the guy who COULD have done something about it and chose to let them die.
Felassan never claimed that the dalish are his people - there is no hypocrisy in his actions. He never cared. Why should he start now when he sees them as useless to him anyway?
So if Celene doesn't see those elves as her people, you'd have no moral problem with her burning Halamshiral?
Burning stuff is never a good idea really, whatever the reason. Things take a lot of time and effort to build and politicians need to learn to respect that
So if Celene doesn't see those elves as her people, you'd have no moral problem with her burning Halamshiral?
You still don't understand...
My problem with Briala in that situation was that her actions were so hypocritical - blaming the dalish for doing something and then seconds later doing the same thing herself. If she thinks she is better than them, well, she clearly is not.
Moral problem? Sure, who doesn't think it's wrong to burn alienages and let a demon butcher entire dalish clan? But that is not the point. My point was what annoyed me about Briala in that situation was her hypocrisy like I already explained.
approves
I guess Celene and Gaspard are the Hillary Clinton and Donald Trump of Dragon Age.
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