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Still using male animations for FemInq in cutscenes?


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#226
PhroXenGold

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Holy crap.  I had never played with the mod myself, but that looks really good.  Purposeful, strong and yet without walking like she has something between her legs.  

 

See, that's what I would love to see on my female character.  Alas, with the game being launched in just over a month, it's probably not going to happen.  I'm really hoping it was maybe just something buggy in the animation, or in the video.  I'd rather not walk like I drank too much beer and then decided a ride on a mechanical bull was a hot idea.

 

Yeah, that looks far far better than the comical swaying. Wish, at the very least, that was an option we could chose.



#227
Grieving Natashina

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Yeah, that looks far far better than the comical swaying. Wish, at the very least, that was an option we could chose.

For an easy side-by-side comparison on the same page:

 

 

Edit: Nothing like that video to demonstrate how utterly silly the idle animations look in general.



#228
PhroXenGold

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For an easy side-by-side comparison on the same page:

 

 That is....faaaaaabulous ;)



#229
Vapaa

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For an easy side-by-side comparison on the same page:

 

 

Edit: Nothing like that video to demonstrate how utterly silly the idle animations look in general.

 

The running animations aren't so bad, but the idle ones are cringeworthy :sick:



#230
eternalshiva

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But what if I want to sensually lust after the plants and animals in the environment during my short exploration stroll? It's totally realistic to wink at my enemy and defeat him/her with my magical spine breaking hip sway 20 feet before I even enter combat! Gotta keep that blood flowing elsewhere than the brain to dumb down the enemy AI!

 

Give me my metal plate bikinis with overly swaying hips or death!

 

*sarcasm off*

 

I definately got the Male Shepard Stomp impression that plagued ME for femshep in the cut scene with the female Inquisitor, broad shouldered side to side stomp with a tendency to lean forward too much. Not very graceful, anyways.


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#231
CannotCompute

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Still not sure why BioWare didn't just pick neutral animations for both genders and stuck with that. It would've saved a bit of time and resources, plus more people would be happy.


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#232
WildOrchid

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Still not sure why BioWare didn't just pick neutral animations for both genders and stuck with that. It would've saved a bit of time and resources, plus more people would be happy.

 

Pretty much.

Most people i've seen irl walk neutral. I rarely see the "macho cowboy" walk and the exaggerated hip sway.


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#233
Blisscolas

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I hate how the tone of these discussions always have an undercurrent of anti-femininity, as if we can't criticize BW's tendency towards both gender essentialism AND defaulting to masculinity when needed without also acting like feminine anything is Bad. I mean, if I were BW, I would give Cassandra the male animation set for questing and any cutscenes related to questing. But for things like the scene we saw in the Twitch stream, a more relaxed, feminine walk seems pretty natural. Just because she's had extensive military training doesn't mean that she can't express feminine characteristics, nor does it undermine her capabilities to do so. 

 

I'm not thrilled with the cutscene animations used for the Femquisitor, but I think that the female elf model is exacerbating it (because her shoulders are so narrow, the wide-legged gait looks even more awkward). Hopefully it's not as noticeable on more balanced models.

 

 

Wow...spot on!!!! You deserve more likes than I can give



#234
Lebanese Dude

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OK, recorded video with FemHawke using MaleHawke animations.

It looks... normal. And of course- It's much better than default.

 

According to the responses to this post, it seems people prefer the male character animations for their characters because their expressions are never in excess IE: neutral.

 

This implies that a "neutral" animation for both genders would be the male ones by default as the female animations are the ones with the "extra" bits (hip sway, hip lean).

 

Seems BioWare has fixed this during cutscenes but did not implement it outside of them. Might have been an oversight. Has anyone asked?



#235
Lebanese Dude

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For an easy side-by-side comparison on the same page:

 

 

Edit: Nothing like that video to demonstrate how utterly silly the idle animations look in general.

I don't think this is relevant. I don't think most people in most cultures like seeing men run with such ... flourish, while most wouldn't blink an eye if a women ran with (or without) hip sway.

 

Come to think of it, I'm fairly certain that a lot of women and men in my part of the world have a similar "idle" stance as the female Hawke one. I do it too sometimes, by leaning on one side and on my hip. We don't especially care to call it feminine. (Although the DA2 one is a smidge excessive :P )

 

I don't think the female animations are as bad as people say they are, but I agree that making all female characters exhibit such "hyper-feminine" behavior isn't fine either. Perhaps they can implement an option for male animations on females (and the other way around for those seeking a flamboyant male character). 



#236
FumikoM

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According to the responses to this post, it seems people prefer the male character animations for their characters because their expressions are never in excess IE: neutral.

 

This implies that a "neutral" animation for both genders would be the male ones by default as the female animations are the ones with the "extra" bits (hip sway, hip lean).

 

Seems BioWare has fixed this during cutscenes but did not implement it outside of them. Might have been an oversight. Has anyone asked?

Some people prefer that, others do not. And the animation they use in cutscenes for DA:I are in no way neutral.


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#237
AzureAardvark

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And the animation they use in cutscenes for DA:I are in no way neutral.

 

I have to agree now that you've shown me an image.  Hopefully this will get changed before release.



#238
Ashelsu

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(sorry, out of likes otherwise I would have tossed you one for this)

 

No arguments, even lighter plate armor wouldn't allow for that much of a hip sway.  It's possible to do a small bit of sway, but not like that.  I agree, wholeheartedly.  That not only looks silly, but it looks very uncomfortable to strut like that in plate.  

 

Plus, it goes back to the "time and place" debate.  You don't strut when you're getting ready to dive, since your mind is focused on what you're doing and not if your hips are movin' just right.   Cassandra shouldn't be strutting with that sort of extreme sense "femininity" since she's in armor and killing demons.  What's more, is it doesn't seem to suit her anyway.  

 

Again, I'd be fine with a little hip sway.  However, that is just way too much.  

 

After literally years of feedback between ME3 and DA2, you think it would have been easier by now to animate women in a way that doesn't look ridiculous.  <_<

qLQRfkF.jpg

They don't think it's ridiculous.



#239
General TSAR

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Still not sure why BioWare didn't just pick neutral animations for both genders and stuck with that. It would've saved a bit of time and resources, plus more people would be happy.

You'd be surprised. 



#240
Ryzaki

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You'd be surprised. 

 

I don't recall a lot of complaints about Shep's animations in ME1.


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#241
Phnx

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Let me show a pic to those who say they think Femquisitor walk is neutral, or that they don't know what we're talking about:

cPjXRWW.jpg?1

 

Cass has that sensual-sway-hips-style. Femquisitor walks like she's on horse back, or has very, very big, yeah you know... Her knees are just way too much to the sides. I'ts definitely a masculine walk. Nothing neutral about it. And I think it looks a bit silly, does not at all make sense when she a few seconds earlier walked like Cassandra.

Everyone admit it, she walks as if she shat her pants. No doubt about it. -_-


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#242
WildOrchid

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I don't recall a lot of complaints about Shep's animations in ME1.

 

Now that's the definition of neutral animation. ME1 was perfect in general.

 

 

 

Everyone admit it, she walks as if she shat her pants. No doubt about it. -_-

 

Lmao, now can't unsee.


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#243
GrayTimber

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"Like every other woman."

 

I've never seen a woman walk or run or even stand like that, nor the other bioware animations except gender neutral Shepard and Origins. :lol:

 

Really, Bioware is really bad at capturing how a woman walks without over-doing it way too much.



#244
Ryzaki

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Everyone admit it, she walks as if she shat her pants. No doubt about it. -_-

 

Oh man :lol: :lol: :lol:



#245
eyezonlyii

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Cassandra's not impressed face though...

 

******-please-harry-potter-vs-twilight-16


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#246
llawsford

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I actually think these animations insult both genders. I've never seen anyone walking like this IRL. Ever. This sh*t is immersion breaking, really.


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#247
BubbleDncr

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Someone pointed out that being against these walk animations is being anti-feminine.  Er, no.  In the game, I don't want to look like I just got off a mechanical bull (my first impression of the lady Inquisitor with that walk,) nor do I wish Cassandra to have that "sexy" strut.  Anyone actually tried to walk like that?  It feels really awkward.  For fun, man or woman, try it sometime.  I showed that to my husband and he couldn't stop laughing.  He asked me if it hurt.

 

I want my warriors to walk like, well, Aveline.  Strong, purposeful, without an exaggerated sashay, and without looking like a damned gorilla (I was never able to finish my maleShep because of the gorilla stomp.)  Really, the better ways for me for my lady Inquisitor to express her femininity would be through things like fancy scrollwork or orientation on my armor; makeup and hair; different causal clothes.  The last of which the devs have stated they are looking into.

 

Let me show femininity/personal style in my Inquisitor's dress and clothing.  That stupid model strut looks out of place.  It's not impossible.  As one of the other posters pointed out (I think I tossed you a like,) plate armor was actually meant to be flexible and lighter weight as time went on.  It still wouldn't allow for that much freedom of hip movement.  In any case, it looks stupid.

 

Vivienne and Isabela having model struts made sense for their characters, not to mention wearing light chain/clothing (a lot of mage robes I've seen have got at least light chain mail under it) can allow for more freedom of movement.  In Vivienne's case, this is the one time where the model strut really suits the character.  Among other things, Life for her is a giant runway.  You only have one chance to make it look good.

 

Otherwise, such an animation looks just bad, silly and out of place.  I really hope those damned idle movements haven't returned.   Here's another experiment: Fire up DA2.  Roll a female character.  Then fire up youtube and check out the video where they put female Hawke's animations on a male Hawke.  To me, it doesn't matter the gender, they look equally stupid.   Then fire up youtube again and check out the video where they put male Hawke's animations on a female Hawke.  It looked a lot more natural, and the way a rather seasoned and (understandably) paranoid warrior should move.

 

I am a female who works in video game animation. I know from experience, that when male animators are given the task of animating female walks, they almost always emphasize hip sway, more than I ever would. I think what it comes down to is a lot of men like swaying hips, so when they're making a walk for a woman, they're creating what they think "looks good." Which to them is swaying hips. It's not consciously a sexist thing (I mean, I can't speak for all video game animations, just the people I work with), its just something that happens in their attempt to make a good female walk.

 

I can also say from experience that it generally works out a lot better to put male animations on female characters than the other way around. It tends to make the female character feel "tough," which for warriors in RPGS, is probably a better way to go, than making male characters feel feminine. That said, I do almost always have to update male animations to bring the knees in, to make the women not walk like they've been riding horses.

 

All that said, it doesn't seem out of the realm of possibility for a game to be set up so that in cutscenes, depending on character gender, it determines which animation to use, but there's also plenty of reasons to not set a game up to do that (frame rate, programming time, animation time, etc).


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#248
Spectre Impersonator

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Everyone admit it, she walks as if she shat her pants. No doubt about it. -_-

Apparently, that's what we call "male animations" here so it can be a sexism issue instead of an animation issue.


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#249
Heimdall

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Let me show a pic to those who say they think Femquisitor walk is neutral, or that they don't know what we're talking about:

cPjXRWW.jpg?1

 

Cass has that sensual-sway-hips-style. Femquisitor walks like she's on horse back, or has very, very big, yeah you know... Her knees are just way too much to the sides. I'ts definitely a masculine walk. Nothing neutral about it. And I think it looks a bit silly, does not at all make sense when she a few seconds earlier walked like Cassandra.

What bothers me more is the idle stance from the beginning of that video, the part where she has her arms straight and slightly raised to the side as if she's about to flap them like wings.  Very odd.



#250
Estel78

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Those walking animations are really really bad. From she-gorillas to overtly sexy / girly. Maybe in another 10 years Bioware will figure it out...

 

Sorry for being plain, i'm very much looking forward to DAI but this had to be said.


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